iloowy.goowy2 days ago
@Terry, dark mode is white text on black. It saves battery.
Not to be confused with the dark web, that has to do with encryption and anonymity.
_______
Posts by Terry
-
6
Is there a 'dark mode' available for this site?
by ProdigalApostate ini view this site on my mobile browser and would prefer to use it in dark mode (white text on black background).
dark mode helps conserve battery on an oled display used on most phones.
how do i enable it for this site?
-
-
Terry
-
33
THIS is how Jehovah operates? Examining GB Jefffrey Winder's words
by Terry ingoverning body member jeffrey winder on jw dot org:“we are not embarrassed about ‘adjustments’ that are made; nor is an apology needed for not getting it ‘exactly right’ previously.
we understand: this is how jehovah operates.”
1952 no wt 6/1/52 p.338 1965 maybe they will be resurrected .
-
-
Terry
DesirousOfChange
I gather you escaped while in your 30’s. Evidently, I’m a “slow learner” as it took me another 20 years.
___________________________
I was 12 years old when I met my "Best Friend" in elementary school, Johnny Santa Cruz.
We bonded over a love for Monster movies and Jerry Lewis comedies.
He always brought up the Bible and started asserting bits of "DID YOU KNOW" factoids that actually
made me feel stupid. My family were not church goers but they believed in God and there was a Bible in the house.
In other words, I was pig-ignorant about Doctrine or the gestalt of the Bible.
Johnny and I were intellectually competitive.
He presented a challenge.
I couldn't match him fact for fact at all. I knew NOTHING about the Bible.
I had a huge vocabulary and I was well-read and quick-witted but HE KNEW the Bible.
It was like a boxing match with one of the fighters' hands tied behind his back.
WHAT TO DO?
We started a "Bible study" and I was smart enough to point out to him that the PARADISE BOOK
was NOT the Bible. Oh, I gave him a very hard time and he remained exasperated but patient.
I was invited to the KINGDOM HALL.
Spending so much time with his family and comparing them to my family - I felt very comfortable going with them and checking it out.
LOVE BOMBING, friendliness, smiling faces, a welcoming spirit REALLY sucked me in. I was horribly shy but a very bright kid. I could soak up those books and memorize scriptures and I blossomed like field of sunflowers.
THAT was my beginning of indoctrination. Very pleasant and quite intensive.
It is easy for me to memorize complicated things. The Bible (and JW doctrine) is a labyrinth of blind alleys.
Did I "believe" any of it? Hmmmm.
Honestly, I didn't have to FEEL belief because I had a head full of DATA and I became conversant.
Back in those days of the nineteen fifties and early sixties, there was no such thing as
Asperger's or Spectrum disorder syndromes.
I WOULD HAVE BEEN a shining example, had there been.
The Kingdom Hall / Jehovah's Witness experience was my THERAPY. It worked for me.
I learned to meet strangers, shake their hand.
I learned to be outgoing (I was faking it till I became real).
I learned public speaking (bye bye shyness - I had a real talent).
You know how it works - we've all been there.
My starting date was 1959 and I lasted until 1979. I was baptised the say after JFK was shot.
November 23, 1963
GOING TO PRISON was a COMING OF AGE experience for me as a person, a boy into MAN.
I formed a BOND with other Brothers and learned to talk to God.
I was transformed into a TRUE BELIEVER as soon as I lied about not being raped.
I convinced myself!
Amazing how the mind works when it isn't working.
When I was paroled, I was out of my frickin' mind. I was a rabid JW, on fire, irrepressible.
Over a space of 4 years I got worn down to the bone.
My mind crashed. I was a cornered and desperate animal looking to bite or to escape.
I escaped to California with my wife and three tiny kids.
I remained a JW on the margins as my ART career blossomed.
I made "worldly" friends who treated me wonderfully well and they were good, fine humans.
NOT the kind of worldly I had had stigmatized inside my head.I could say the JW mantra words and go through the motions but splitting my personality
like that was exhausting and unhealthy. I started SEEING and HEARING the empty
phrases and excuses for 1975 FAILURE among the Brothers.
That was the tipping point.
JW FAITHFUL are talented at talking themselves into it and among each other.
IT IS ALL PIOUS FRAUD.
20 years through the sausage grinder.
That was more than enough for me.
I BECAME A HUMAN BEING because the JW's taught me how to communicate with other human beings.
I became mentally strong because I made it through 1967-69 among criminals and abuse.
I fond it - I lost it - I found it.
Over and over.
What is "it"?
IT IS ME. Experiencing LIFE through many lenses.
I've been up, down, over, and out - like the Frank Sinatra song :)
THAT's LIFE for everybody. Some slower, some faster.
Age 12 to Age 32.
That's more information than anybody asked for - but there it is.
THAT'S LIFE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XvfImv9NseYThat's life
(That's life)
That's what all the people say
You're riding high in April, shot down in May
But I know I'm gonna change that tune
When I'm back on top, back on top in JuneI said that's life
(That's life)
And as funny as it may seem
Some people get their kicks
Stomping on a dream
But I don't let it, let it get me down
Cause this fine old world, it keeps spinnin' aroundI've been a puppet, a pauper, a pirate, a poet
A pawn and a king
I've been up and down and over and out
And I know one thing
Each time I find myself
Flat on my face
I pick myself up and get
Back in the raceThat's life
(That's life)
I tell you, I can't deny it
I thought of quitting, baby
But my heart just ain't gonna buy it
And if I didn't think it was worth one single try
I'd jump right on a big bird and then I'd flyI've been a puppet, a pauper, a pirate, a poet
A pawn and a king
I've been up and down and over and out
And I know one thing
Each time I find myself layin'
Flat on my face
I just pick myself up and get
Back in the raceThat's life
(That's life)
That's life and I can't deny it
Many times I thought of cutting out but my heart won't buy it
But if there's nothing shaking come this here July
I'm gonna roll myself up
In a big ball and die
My, my -
27
TODAY is my 56th anniversary of GOING TO PRISON as a Jehovah's Witness Conscientious Objector
by Terry inwhat happened to jehovah’s witness young men and why did it happen?______in the 1960s men of draft age were called upon to either serve in the military (during the vietnam war) or to comply with the alternate service option: serving in a hospital or community in need.. non-jehovah’s witnesses were faced with only one refusal: military service.jw boys and young men were instructed (in private) to refuse the alternate civilian service as well.
the superior authorities had made this exemption for people of conscience.the law was clear on this.
if we worked in a hospital community we would be free to go about our witnessing ministry - if we double-refused: we would languish in prison.a no-brainer to them.
-
-
Terry
What percentage of brothers in USA were told that? I was never told that.
Nixon stopped the draft a month before I was scheduled to appear.
______________
A per one hundred breakdown is not within my capability because I only have
surreptitious access to the still living / still in Brothers who were in prison.
I've been very careful, methodical, and circumspect in my queries. Out of the
40 or so Brothers I spoke with back in the late 60s, every one of them was
privately counseled the same way. They were from Southern states, Oklahoma, Louisiana,
Arkansas, Texas mostly. As a sample size - I don't know how representative this is.
There were 5 Draft Age Bros. in my home congregation. Only 2 of us went to the clinker.
With the other 3 it was a "don't ask - don't tell" situation.
One Bro had a mom who was best friends with the head of the local Draft Board. She was
not a JW. He ended up working at a GOODWILL INDUSTRIES job for 2 years.
Another Bro had a wealthy dad. So, every variation on that theme was possible.
I discovered a few years back, when an EXJW confessed it to me - he had bribed his way out.
Cash changed hands. A political thing. He is a wealthy engineer and he comes from money.
There are thousands of stories in this experience. Maybe there is no "there" there as far as
that goes.
If you want to know what a REAL conscientious objector, true-believing Christian would do -
Watch the movie HACKSAW RIDGE about the real life C.O. Desmond Doss (An Adventist).
Now THAT was courage and integrity!
We JW boys pretty much had a relatively easy time of it all things considered.
Yes, I was sexually molested - but - it didn't kill me and at the time - didn't wreck my faith.
I lied about the severity of it to my prison Brothers, inventing a kind of "Jehovah saved me" scenario as might be expected. In reality, so many of us were brutally treated one on one and lying about it for the sake of the FAITH BUBBLE. Who knows what any would be Christian in history really experienced, eh?
It has a name: Pious Fraud.
It happens because True Believers don't want to ruin the fantasy for the others."Pious fraud" is a term used to describe actions or deceptions that are committed with the belief that they serve a greater good or a religious or moral purpose. While these actions may involve dishonesty or deception, they are often rationalized by those who commit them as being for a higher cause. Here are several examples:
1. **Forgery of Religious Artifacts:** Throughout history, individuals have created or altered religious artifacts, such as relics, in an attempt to strengthen the faith of believers. For example, in the Middle Ages, some churches claimed to possess pieces of the True Cross, but many of these were likely forgeries.
2. **Religious Propaganda:** Some religious texts or writings may contain exaggerations or embellishments to promote faith. For instance, hagiographies (biographies of saints) often included miraculous events or deeds to inspire piety.
3. **Religious Charlatans:** Certain individuals throughout history have claimed to have divine powers or connections to the divine, using their perceived authority to exploit believers. These charlatans may use deception to gain followers and accumulate wealth.
4. **Apocryphal Texts:** Some religious traditions have included texts that were not included in official scripture but were revered by certain sects. These texts may have been written with good intentions but contain exaggerated or false claims.
5. **Altered History for Religious Reasons:** In some cases, religious leaders or organizations have altered historical events to fit a particular religious narrative. For instance, changing the dates of significant events or claiming divine intervention in historical battles.
6. **Religious Miracles:** While many people genuinely believe in the miracles attributed to religious figures or events, some skeptics argue that some of these stories are embellished or even fabricated to promote faith.
7. **Suppression of Contradictory Information:** In some cases, religious institutions or leaders may suppress or downplay information that contradicts their beliefs. This can include censorship of historical evidence or the suppression of scientific discoveries.
8. **Pseudoscience and Health Claims:** Some individuals or organizations promote pseudoscientific or miracle health remedies with religious undertones, claiming that these remedies are in line with divine will.
9. **Misrepresentation of Religious Texts:** In an attempt to make religious texts more appealing or relevant to modern audiences, some individuals or groups may interpret or translate religious texts in ways that deviate from their original meaning.
10. **Invented Relics:** Creating and promoting relics, such as the purported burial cloth of Jesus, the Shroud of Turin, which some claim as evidence of the crucifixion and resurrection, is seen by some as a pious fraud.
It's important to note that the term "pious fraud" is subjective, and what one person considers a deception for a greater religious good, another may see as deliberate dishonesty. These examples illustrate the complexity of the concept and its historical significance.
-
27
TODAY is my 56th anniversary of GOING TO PRISON as a Jehovah's Witness Conscientious Objector
by Terry inwhat happened to jehovah’s witness young men and why did it happen?______in the 1960s men of draft age were called upon to either serve in the military (during the vietnam war) or to comply with the alternate service option: serving in a hospital or community in need.. non-jehovah’s witnesses were faced with only one refusal: military service.jw boys and young men were instructed (in private) to refuse the alternate civilian service as well.
the superior authorities had made this exemption for people of conscience.the law was clear on this.
if we worked in a hospital community we would be free to go about our witnessing ministry - if we double-refused: we would languish in prison.a no-brainer to them.
-
-
Terry
My congregation overseer told me that Brothers Knorr and Fred Franz wouldn't risk being
treated the way Judge Rutherford and his Board of Directors were treated and end up in prison
for advising others against following orders during a time of war.
Every one of us inside
were taken into the Kingdom Hall library respectively, and told what to say and do but strongly admonished
to NOT say we had been advised.
The situation dripped with irony. We, the young JWs, had to be the brave ones while the older leaders cowered in their paradise on earth in Brooklyn.
One of my closest Brothers named Sam told me his Dad paid Attorney Hayden Covington $10 grand but in the middle of
the parlay with the Judge, Covington got a call from boxer Cassius Clay (Muhammad Ali) to join his legal team due to his success before the Supreme Court on behalf of freedom of religion.
Sam said that Covington rushed the Judge and left in a hurry when the 5 year sentence was banged down.
What is interesting about all that is this: Covington was disfellowshipped in, I believe, 1963 or thereabouts and not reinstated until 1978.
Muhammed Ali and his team fired Covington and refused to pay him. The only thing he ever got from Ali was an old clock. -
27
TODAY is my 56th anniversary of GOING TO PRISON as a Jehovah's Witness Conscientious Objector
by Terry inwhat happened to jehovah’s witness young men and why did it happen?______in the 1960s men of draft age were called upon to either serve in the military (during the vietnam war) or to comply with the alternate service option: serving in a hospital or community in need.. non-jehovah’s witnesses were faced with only one refusal: military service.jw boys and young men were instructed (in private) to refuse the alternate civilian service as well.
the superior authorities had made this exemption for people of conscience.the law was clear on this.
if we worked in a hospital community we would be free to go about our witnessing ministry - if we double-refused: we would languish in prison.a no-brainer to them.
-
-
Terry
Clown college
-
27
TODAY is my 56th anniversary of GOING TO PRISON as a Jehovah's Witness Conscientious Objector
by Terry inwhat happened to jehovah’s witness young men and why did it happen?______in the 1960s men of draft age were called upon to either serve in the military (during the vietnam war) or to comply with the alternate service option: serving in a hospital or community in need.. non-jehovah’s witnesses were faced with only one refusal: military service.jw boys and young men were instructed (in private) to refuse the alternate civilian service as well.
the superior authorities had made this exemption for people of conscience.the law was clear on this.
if we worked in a hospital community we would be free to go about our witnessing ministry - if we double-refused: we would languish in prison.a no-brainer to them.
-
-
Terry
Incidentally, what the hell is this all about and what is it doing in the middle of my thread??
-
27
TODAY is my 56th anniversary of GOING TO PRISON as a Jehovah's Witness Conscientious Objector
by Terry inwhat happened to jehovah’s witness young men and why did it happen?______in the 1960s men of draft age were called upon to either serve in the military (during the vietnam war) or to comply with the alternate service option: serving in a hospital or community in need.. non-jehovah’s witnesses were faced with only one refusal: military service.jw boys and young men were instructed (in private) to refuse the alternate civilian service as well.
the superior authorities had made this exemption for people of conscience.the law was clear on this.
if we worked in a hospital community we would be free to go about our witnessing ministry - if we double-refused: we would languish in prison.a no-brainer to them.
-
-
Terry
DIRTY LITTLE SECRET
REFUSAL of a LEGAL exemption allowing Conscientious Objectors to serve in local communities
is NOT the same thing as refusal to join the armed forces!
1. You go before a local Draft Board and you are interviewed by the F.B.I. and state that your
conscience and religious beliefs will not permit serving in the armed forces. That is refusal number one.
You are legally in your rights to do so. No prison punishment required.
2. The law allows you to serve local community needs in a hospital instead as an alternate choice.
The JW REFUSES (the 2nd refusal) because his congregation leader privately tells him he can't - but -he's not allowed to point the finger at this instruction.
That is a conspiracy and it is illegal. The GB were cowards hiding their undue influence.
I know approximately 20 JWs who served time in Federal prison and who are STILL IN the Org
but who never realized (because they never "self-questioned" at an analytical level) the
fact that they DOUBLE REFUSED.
It has to be explained to them over and over and even
when they see it and understand it and acknowledge it - after a month passes - astoundingly,
they have forgotten all about it!!
Ask any old-timer JW why he went to prison and he will NEVER say it was the 2nd Refusal
that put him in jail.
It is a DIRTY LITTLE SECRET even their own heart and mind cannot grasp. -
6
Is there a 'dark mode' available for this site?
by ProdigalApostate ini view this site on my mobile browser and would prefer to use it in dark mode (white text on black background).
dark mode helps conserve battery on an oled display used on most phones.
how do i enable it for this site?
-
-
Terry
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gO9fTnMxwYw
This may or may not be a solution
-
27
TODAY is my 56th anniversary of GOING TO PRISON as a Jehovah's Witness Conscientious Objector
by Terry inwhat happened to jehovah’s witness young men and why did it happen?______in the 1960s men of draft age were called upon to either serve in the military (during the vietnam war) or to comply with the alternate service option: serving in a hospital or community in need.. non-jehovah’s witnesses were faced with only one refusal: military service.jw boys and young men were instructed (in private) to refuse the alternate civilian service as well.
the superior authorities had made this exemption for people of conscience.the law was clear on this.
if we worked in a hospital community we would be free to go about our witnessing ministry - if we double-refused: we would languish in prison.a no-brainer to them.
-
-
Terry
WHAT HAPPENED to Jehovah’s Witness young men and WHY did it happen?
______In the 1960s men of draft age were called upon to either serve in the Military
(during the Vietnam War) or to comply with the Alternate Service option: serving in a hospital or community in need.Non-Jehovah’s Witnesses were faced with only one refusal: Military Service.
JW boys and young men were instructed (in private) to refuse the Alternate civilian service as well.
The Superior Authorities had made this exemption for people of conscience.
The law was clear on this. If we worked in a hospital community we would be free to go about our Witnessing ministry - if we double-refused: we would languish in prison.
A no-brainer to them. But to us? Our leaders applied pressure to “not compromise.”
Was the Superior Authority trying to stop us from preaching? No.
Was the Superior Authority trying to punish us for our beliefs? No.
______________
DUTY to Jehovah vs duty to Superior Authority
We young JW Brothers were admonished to omit public mention of “any influence” at all by others.
(“Others” means our overseers and organization leaders acting in private).
We were told to say to the authorities that it was our personal conscience at work without undue influence or pressure to act against our own best interests.
WAS IT OUR CONSCIENCE or the influence in secret by our leaders pushing us
toward double refusal of legal alternatives to Military service?
(Were we telling a white lie?) (Theocratic Strategy?)
This is where the Seagoville Prison story really begins
The U.S. Government saw us as one group within a larger group of men refusing to comply with the law - not for political protest but for reasons of deeply-held beliefs.
(Jehovah’s Witnesses, Hutterites, Mennonites, 7th Day Adventists, etc.)
The following is an excerpt from a study analysis conducted by our government.
These documents are found online in the President Gerald Ford Library of records.
I discovered this recently and was quite fascinated in terms of our JW community and the other C.O.’s in their community.
To the analysts, we were a case study in human behavior.
An odd group of ages, races, psychological types, and special motivations.
TAKE A LOOK BELOW.
Fascinating? Yes, I think so. A perspective is possible using this information.
To see ourselves as others saw us is an amazing gift.
Let us continue…
“He did indicate that he would be willing to perform similar services under a court order of probation.”
How is this not the exact definition of “compromise”? Any Brother who performs alternate Civilian service under the Law as it stood and the same Brother performing alternate Civilian service under Probation differ not at all - except for the fact that Brother is disrespecting the authority of Caesar by dictating his own terms.
If a Policeman wants to give you a ticket for speeding but you insist he let you off without a ticket and only THEN you’ll comply with the speed limit - is this not disrespect and a high-handed sense of entitlement? Asking for or demanding “special treatment” would place JWs in an Elite category outside the law. Historically Christians have not demanded such privileges.
In a sense - by refusing Alternate Service we Brothers shot ourselves in the collective foot. Rather than being free to go door-to-door or conduct Bible studies in a regular community as well as rendering Samaritan-like aid to injured or sick persons in a hospital setting (as Alternate Service provides) - most of us placed ourselves in a strait-jacket of idle time constraints and the pressure and anxiety on our families was considerable.
(All the above is excerpted from Gerald Ford Presidential Library and Museum:) https://www.fordlibrarymuseum.gov/library/document/0193/18558946.pdf________
What follows is :
A Transcript from National Public Radio:
(4,500 Jehovah’s Witnesses during the Vietnam War. ¾ of 6,000)WHAT ABOUT: Alternate HOSPITAL WORK?
MILITARY SERVICE was off the table as soon as we announced we are Conscientious Objectors.
I was arrested and sentenced as a Youth and “Conscientious Objector” (age 20) to an indeterminate span of up to 6 years. (1967-1969 served. On parole until 1973))
While under the oversight authority of the Seagoville Federal Correctional Institution, I had been attacked and sexually abused. I was paroled at the age of 23. I have written the book, “I WEPT BY THE RIVERS of BABYLON (A Prisoner of Conscience in a Time of War) about my prison experience.
The month following my parole, this article was published.
"If you are a young person, you also need to face the fact that you will never grow old in this present system of things. Why not? Because all the evidence in fulfilment of Bible prophecy indicates that this corrupt system is due to end in a few years. Of the generation that observed the beginning of the "last days" in 1914, Jesus foretold: "This generation will by no means pass away until all these things occur."-Matt. 24:34. Therefore, as a young person, you will never fulfil any career that this system offers. If you are in high school and thinking about a college education, it means at least four, perhaps even six or eight more years to graduate into a specialized career. But where will this system of things be by that time? It will be well on the way toward its finish, if not actually gone!"
Awake! 1969 May 22 p.15
JW Reasoning:
Higher education? Who needs it now? Armageddon is coming SOON!
A career in Medicine? Who needs it now? Armageddon is coming SOONER!
Marriage and children? Not now - did we mention Armageddon?
Financial Planning for security in your old age? “You will never grow old …”
QUESTION: Were Jehovah’s Witnesses being guided, led, persuaded, pressured into abandoning a “normal” life by setting aside everything but the promotion of “imminent Armageddon” by Watchtower leaders? Or were they free to ignore the excitement and assurances and remain in good stead?
Most of us were taught, instructed, inculcated to view our governing leaders as reporting prophetic words direct from Jehovah! In fact, we were told we’d be “bloodguilty” if we did not engage in this message and lifestyle.As the “only” true religion headed by the “mouthpiece” of God (Faithful and Discreet Slave) were they prophets?
WT 7-1-73 p.402: Looks like they are answering the question right here.
This prophetic message had a dramatic effect on all of Jehovah’s Witnesses and especially young people such as myself. In 1974 the Kingdom Ministry reported that the number of pioneers boomed, with people commended for selling homes to spend the short time left in God's Service. Likewise, it was recommended to put off raising children. Was this only a “suggestion”? Or was it promoted with a dramatic certainty nobody on earth could afford to ignore?
I signed up for the regular Pioneer work at 100 hours per month starting the day I was paroled.
I mention this only to indicate my level of sincere determination and depth of commitment."Yes, since the summer of 1973 there have been new peaks in pioneers every month. Now there are 20,394 regular and special pioneers in the United States, an all-time peak. That is 5,190 more than there were in February 1973! A 34-percent increase! Does that not warm our hearts? Reports are heard of brothers selling their homes and property and planning to finish out the rest of their days in this old system in the pioneer service. Certainly, this is a fine way to spend the short time remaining before the wicked world's end."
(Our Watchtower spirit-led leaders cheered selling your home and property- why would they later blame those same zealous Pioneers as erratic fringe fanatics rather than apologize for their own complicity?)
Kingdom Ministry May 1974 p.3 How Are You Using Your Life?"Today there is a great crowd of people who are confident that destruction of even greater magnitude is now imminent. The evidence is that Jesus' prophecy will shortly have a major fulfillment, upon this entire system of things. This has been a major factor in influencing many couples to decide not to have children at this time." Awake! 1974 Nov 8 p.11
Of course, there are always skeptics and critical thinkers like the
“Bereans who examine the scriptures daily to see if these things are so.”
To those people, the Watchtower and Awake! writers had surprising admonition:
“One thing is absolutely certain, Bible chronology reinforced with fulfilled Bible prophecy shows that six thousand years of man's existence will soon be up, yes, within this generation! (Matt. 24:34) This is, therefore, no time to be indifferent and complacent. This is not the time to be toying with the words of Jesus that "concerning that day and hour nobody knows, neither the angels of the heavens nor the Son, but only the Father." (Matt. 24:36)
To the contrary, it is a time when one should be keenly aware that the end of this system of things is rapidly coming to its violent end. Make no mistake, it is sufficient that the Father himself knows both the "day and hour"!
Watchtower 1968 Aug 15 p.494 Why Are You Looking Forward to 1975?It is now the year 2022. The “Faithful” Slave was dead wrong. Their handiwork was indiscreet. (Define Discreet: careful and circumspect in one's speech or actions, especially in order to avoid causing offence or to gain an advantage.
_______________________________________________
The words ABSOLUTELY CERTAIN came from our Governing Body. Should we ignore these words as incriminating in their complete lack of “careful and circumspect” language?
Can we honestly say this End Times warning came at “the proper time”?
LINK TO ABOVE: shorturl.at/bvUW7SHOULD WE really BE TALKING ABOUT THIS NOW?
(NOTE: Elders today become jittery, uncomfortable, and aggressive in my experience when anybody dares to raise the topic of WHAT HAPPENED in 1975.) The history of what really happened exists in print by the Society.
1975: Did it happen the way we all remember it – or not??
Have you heard the term “gaslighting?”
How often have we heard young Elders who didn’t live during the run-up to 1975 try to tell us “It didn’t happen that way”?
What I hear time and again is that only “immature” brothers and sisters got carried away. But following the Governing Body’s explicit admonition is not a “take it - or leave” choice for any member. Is it? Not unless you wish to be labeled “apostate.” See below the official pronouncement on the matter.
Really? Was it IMMATURE to take the Governing Body at its own printed word?
The Annual Yearbook of Jehovah’s Witnesses revealsa loss of about half a million members. Were they stumbled or just immature? Or worse- were they stumbled?
Those who expected THE END were definitely led to believe it.WE BROTHERS WENT TO PRISON specifically as a matter of FAITH in submitting to the Faithful Slave. That entity represents itself as the spirit-led official Truth from Jehovah.
Bible Only just doesn’t seem to fly. Instead, it is Bible (as interpreted) by Governing Body guesses.
Respect for the right of a government in Romans 13:1 Superior Authorities - to give us an “out”: Alternate Community Service meant our conscience could be clear if we worked in a hospital or hospice.
However ...
The Faithful Slave claimed authority to override our legal alternative choice and told us what to say and do. We did it. We were asked to do more than what the Bible required of us.
The current official policy is - it’s not anybody’s business; only a matter of personal conscience.
(That change in policy which came on May 1, 1996, WT does not mention or admit to any change in policy and makes no reference to the previous stand and its change from the stand previous to that.It is common practice for the WTS to omit mention of the previous doctrine when introducing changes. This hinders newer JWs from knowing what was taught previously and in the present instance means no apology is made to those JWs who went to prison needlessly or to their families who anguished as to their safety.
After all - didn’t we say “it is our conscience speaking and not theirs?”)Under Rutherford, brothers defied the governments thinking they were right to do so. Jehovah and Jesus were their Superior Authority.
Under Nathan Knorr and Fred Franz, the earthly government clearly had the Superior Authority to offer an alternative for people of conscience. It was Brother Knorr and Brother Franz who asked more of us - not the Bible.
We did not argue. We did not second guess. We did exactly as we were told to do.
The question is: Were we faithful to men or God? Sadly - to most of us that doesn’t matter. Wow! -
33
THIS is how Jehovah operates? Examining GB Jefffrey Winder's words
by Terry ingoverning body member jeffrey winder on jw dot org:“we are not embarrassed about ‘adjustments’ that are made; nor is an apology needed for not getting it ‘exactly right’ previously.
we understand: this is how jehovah operates.”
1952 no wt 6/1/52 p.338 1965 maybe they will be resurrected .
-
-
Terry
What you can say about the Watchtower as an organization is that
IT BELIEVES IN ITSELF just as much as it believes in Jehovah.
The men (always men) see themselves as SELECTED out of the many; CHOSEN.
Out of billions and billions of humans a very few are hand-picked
by the Eternal Living God.
That should take your breath away.
HOW IS IT DONE? Well - don't bother asking.
They JUST KNOW. Isn't that amazing and bewildering?
Men who "just know" how very special they themselves are get to make up shit and
over EIGHT MILLION PEOPLE will automatically agree, respond, and risk their lives to perform
even the most menial chores over and over - and for FREE.
It is nothing if it isn't astoundingly MENTAL.
You find this mentality in SCIENTOLOGY.
(One of my best friends was a Scientologists. He was absolutely convinced.)
You find this mentality in CHRISTIAN SCIENCE.
You find this mentality in insane asylums, prisons, and in UFO, BIGFOOT, FLAT EARTH cults, too.
I myself at the age of 20 willingly went into prison in 1967 and was paroled in 1969. WHY?
I WAS TOLD and I believed: it was the right thing to do.
Was I gullible? Stupid? Naive?
When I was released from prison I didn't have a job but I married a JW and had 3 kids
and Pioneered. I could b-a-r-e-l-y afford to pay rent, pay biills, and put food on the table.
IT WAS A MISERABLE LIFE.
Why did I do this to myself?
Well - it was just a very few years until 1975. (Hang on Sloopy...hang on.)
Countdown....
1969
1970
1971
1972
1973
1974 (Can you feel it coming in the air tonight...oh boy!)Suddenly - I had a breakdown.
There was only one year left to go. I was working as a janitor.
I was a rat on a rat wheel running breathless in circles.
Exhausted. Poor. Befuddled and - ANGRY at my life.
I packed up my wife and 3 very small kids into a 1970 Ford Maverick and headed WEST.
(Go west, young man - go West.)
I drove from Fort Worth, Texas to Rancho Cucamonga, California!
My Aunt Shirley took us in until I found a job as an "ARTIST."
Just as suddenly, I was born anew. Just like THAT!
I escaped.
I met REAL PEOPLE. (I made friends for life).
1975 came and disappeared like an almost sneeze (you almost sneeze but can't.)
NOTHING happened and all the JW's who held their breath went blue in the face.
A baptism of disappointment? No.
A NON-event event.
A tornado was coming that didn't arrive. One by one, they came out of the storm shelter.
Dusted off and went back to the rat-wheel ,,,
I flourished as an artist and as joyful as a frisky kitten!
THE SPELL WAS BROKEN. But for my wife, and JW friends NOTHING CHANGED.
I stayed in until I was kicked out.
I wept. I grieved. FOR WHAT?
I grieved for the years of my youth I'd never get back in which I sacrificed myself (my time) for
abso-fucking-lutely NOTHING. For people who claimed to LOVE me but instantly did NOT.
We all have a story sort of like that. Each a bit different. Some more tragic and some less so.
The thing is...MANY MILLIONS are stuck inside that sinking ship.
So many suspect it is a lie but can't say so.
This Discussion Group is a kind of oasis for travelers who have come through the desert exhausted,
burned to a crisp, used up, half mad - but (importantly) OUT OF THE MADNESS.
I still come here after 43 years out of the Borg. I dip my toe in the water.
I post comments. I tell my story. Over and over again.
IT IS MY WAY OF PAYING BACK by trying to pull people out of the icy water of fake paradise.
THE TRUTH just isn't true. It is a factory producing mental illness, wasted lives, delusional zombies,
empty existence and phony HOPE.
Your mileage may vary but I wish you well one and all...
