Posts by BrendaCloutier

17

Tell me about your "Dedication"

by ezekiel3 in

for jws, there is a two-step process for committing yourself to god.

before you get baptized in public, you are supposed to privately "dedicate" yourself to god in prayer.. i was a child who knelt in the corner of my room after completing my final "interview" of questions from an elder.

i tried to be sincere, but i was aware i had no emotional currency (i was only 13, give me a break!).

BrendaCloutier

I felt no personal relationship to God.

I didn't either. I did the prayer thing, sort of, after I passed all the questions, just like a test at school. I was 14. I was a good student. I did what I was supposed to do.

I got dunked, in an aboveground swimming pool set up for the int'l convention held in Portland, OR that year (1971, I think it was, maybe 72) at what is now PGE Park - local ballpark for the Padres farm team the Beavers, and soccer, etc. I even made my own modest swim suit!

When I came up, I expected some miraculous change in me. Some insight I hadn't had before, or some feeling of grace that I'd never had. Nada, nothing. Pffft. That's when the real questions began in me. "What did I just dedicate my 'life' to?"

I've since known Grace. It is the most awesome of experiences.

Hugs

Bren

132

Why does God need to be worshiped?

by Scully in

just curious about this question today and wondered if anyone else has pondered this.. is worship meant to be a reverent show of appreciation for life that god imparts to individuals?

if that's the case, and someone - by the mere accident of their birth - has a truly crappy life, why should these people worship god or show him "appreciation" for their unfortunate circumstances?

why should anyone who endures hardships worship god, particularly if they have been worshiping god and then all of a sudden a heap of trouble just plops into their lives, unannounced and unwelcome??.

BrendaCloutier

LT, FMZ

To dig a little deeper, yes, our love often does need an object. Sometimes we must bring our view of God down a notch to fit it in a human body, so that we can see him in a familiar way. This seems to be an effective (though flawed) way of giving God worship in a directed manner.

What about LOVE being a verb: To act in a loving manner and do loving things to everyone and everything.? It's not really difficult. It doesn't require money. It requires action.

By analyzing our actions and attempting to determine if that action was loving, or self serving, we learn more about love. A great book on the subject is "The Greatest Thing In The World" by Henry Drummond first pub. 1880. It is a thorough breakdown of 1Cor 13 on love, and one of the very few passages Paul wrote that I can accept (I don't like Paul).

And now abideth faith, hope, Love, these three; but the greatest of these is Love.--I COR xiii.

2 more cents

Bren

132

Why does God need to be worshiped?

by Scully in

just curious about this question today and wondered if anyone else has pondered this.. is worship meant to be a reverent show of appreciation for life that god imparts to individuals?

if that's the case, and someone - by the mere accident of their birth - has a truly crappy life, why should these people worship god or show him "appreciation" for their unfortunate circumstances?

why should anyone who endures hardships worship god, particularly if they have been worshiping god and then all of a sudden a heap of trouble just plops into their lives, unannounced and unwelcome??.

BrendaCloutier

I'm just trying to be more of an optimist lately, so I'm trying to look for the good things in religion :)

The good things in "organized religion" as long as they are tempered: Community of similar understanding. Basis and peers for morals. Religious community support. Solid upbringing for children. Counseling, encouragement, support. Especially when a church opens up to the community at large and embrases the support of 12-step groups and other open community programs.

In the past: The local moral government in a village or town. The source of community, spirituality, medical attention, archives, writing, maintaining tradition, safety and security.

-B

132

Why does God need to be worshiped?

by Scully in

just curious about this question today and wondered if anyone else has pondered this.. is worship meant to be a reverent show of appreciation for life that god imparts to individuals?

if that's the case, and someone - by the mere accident of their birth - has a truly crappy life, why should these people worship god or show him "appreciation" for their unfortunate circumstances?

why should anyone who endures hardships worship god, particularly if they have been worshiping god and then all of a sudden a heap of trouble just plops into their lives, unannounced and unwelcome??.

BrendaCloutier

My personal belief is that it was all just a clever ploy by people in power, who decided that it would be a good idea to use fear as a basis for worship.

I ditto that statement.

I find it interesting that the "old religions", usually polydeist, had a better balanced view of women, and natural science. OT, NT and Qoran do not. This includes the hebrews pre-Jehovah where women had more power and respect.

My opinion is that Polydeism probably more closely explains "god" and (He She It They) attributes than does a monodeistic, "one god" concept. The exception is when you get into the incestual roman and greek gods (and Norsk) and their excuses for natural "phonomena", but again, it was a human way to explain and understand the world around them, in human, understandable terms. But isn't that whe we are all trying to do, and falling far short of the goal?

Bren

21

Are JWs seeing signs of the end now?

by jws in

jw
friends

i was talking with my dad last night and during our call, he started talking about all the storms to hit florida, the earthquake in california (that didn't damage anything), and mt.

saint helens on the verge of erupting.. he didn't come right out and say it, but i got the feeling he was trying to slip in some kind of warning.

the old 'sign of the end' type of stuff.

BrendaCloutier

JW's have been seeing signs of the end since 1913-14.

Personally, the acts of 9/11 and Bush's attack on Iraq have me concerned regarding the King of the N and the King of the S. One of which I was taught was US and the other the Middle East (Arabia). The earthquakes, wars, weather and floods, volcanic erruptions? Well, with global communications it fulfills Revelations "reports of" in prophesy.

Do I continue to worry about it? Nah.

Bren

132

Why does God need to be worshiped?

by Scully in

just curious about this question today and wondered if anyone else has pondered this.. is worship meant to be a reverent show of appreciation for life that god imparts to individuals?

if that's the case, and someone - by the mere accident of their birth - has a truly crappy life, why should these people worship god or show him "appreciation" for their unfortunate circumstances?

why should anyone who endures hardships worship god, particularly if they have been worshiping god and then all of a sudden a heap of trouble just plops into their lives, unannounced and unwelcome??.

BrendaCloutier

I find your posts and this whole thread very enjoying.

Me to, LT and all! Good inspirational "debate", better than Bush/Kerry!

-B

15

"Draw Close to Jehovah"

by robhic in

my jw girlfriend (i know that's a topic in and of itself) is sick and confined to bed.

yesterday a pioneer lady dropped by with a bunch of magazines and an eight audio cassette tape library of the same name as the title to this thread.

eight tapes in a special, titled, plastic folder/binder to hold them?

BrendaCloutier

"Draw Close to Jehovah"

Off actual thread but: I tried when I was "in" and found it impossible to do... Now that I've been out for a long time, I find "god" much easier to draw close to.

-bren

132

Why does God need to be worshiped?

by Scully in

just curious about this question today and wondered if anyone else has pondered this.. is worship meant to be a reverent show of appreciation for life that god imparts to individuals?

if that's the case, and someone - by the mere accident of their birth - has a truly crappy life, why should these people worship god or show him "appreciation" for their unfortunate circumstances?

why should anyone who endures hardships worship god, particularly if they have been worshiping god and then all of a sudden a heap of trouble just plops into their lives, unannounced and unwelcome??.

BrendaCloutier

The "God" (He She It They) I have come to believe in has laws that MUST, and I mean MUST be obeyed! We are all familiar with many of them: The laws of gravity, the laws of magnetics, the laws of light and sound, the laws of the universe. THESE are god's true laws. The only way we can appear to "skirt" or "override" them is by using them to our advantage in the form of airplanes, space travel, satelite communciations, etc.

I also believe that we, the human race, all creatures on the planet, and the planet itself along with the entire universe are of god. Thereby, they require our respect, admiration, compassion, care. I think this is the only form of worship "god" requires.

Buddhism and it's lack of a godhead appeals to me as it sanctifies every living entity. Following is from an interesting site that offers interesting angles on the topic of this thread:

BUDDHISM AND GODBuddhism is sometimes said to be an agnostic religion. Certainly there is no concept of God as the vindictive, judgemental, time-subservient warlord of the Old Testament, or the infantile boogieman of the Koran.

http://www.geocities.com/scimah/God.htm

I was off on a women vs men sanctity rant here, but I decided it wasn't appropriate on this thread... so I'll end here.

Hugs on y'alls journey to enlightenment.

Brenda

132

Why does God need to be worshiped?

by Scully in

just curious about this question today and wondered if anyone else has pondered this.. is worship meant to be a reverent show of appreciation for life that god imparts to individuals?

if that's the case, and someone - by the mere accident of their birth - has a truly crappy life, why should these people worship god or show him "appreciation" for their unfortunate circumstances?

why should anyone who endures hardships worship god, particularly if they have been worshiping god and then all of a sudden a heap of trouble just plops into their lives, unannounced and unwelcome??.

BrendaCloutier

Whilst the points raised may, or may not, have merit. I'm at odds to point out that the manner in which this topic is being discussed may be construed as offensive.
Whatever happened to have a modicum of respect for people's belief's (however wild you may view them)?

LT, you're opinion is just as valid as Scully's question, and everyone's response, no matter how critical. ANY topic, or response, can be offensive to someone, in this case, you have taken exception to it. It is still a thread of opinions. And there is (usually, unless someone is cranky that particular post) respect here.

Simply, if you don't like what's being said, it is probably hitting a soft spot of your own (one finger pointing produces three pointing back) possibly your own doubts being triggered? That's always scary.

Don't get me wrong, I have great respect for you and everyone on this board. I also respect that this board is open to freedom of speech - something that JW's and many other organized religions, political parties, President Bush, governments, etc., oppose.

Hugs, LT

Bren

10

Kentucky presiding overseers obfuscate facts in print

by Gopher in

here's a puff-piece in the danville, kentucky, usa newspaper.

it looks like it was written by a public relations representative of the wts and published word-for-word.

the news was that a spanish congregation has been added.

BrendaCloutier

Gopher (love your handle) I caught those three-plus contradictions, too. If JW's are not unpatriotic, but only support God's kingdom and government, then why are they allowed to vote and join the military? And voting and military service for which governments? Hmmm. I'm not even commenting on the subversive organization bit. False publicity from a false prophet? Or just a confused carpet cleaner and janitor sniffing too many chemicals?

Hugs

Brenda