i know this has been discussed before, but i want to reopen the topic.
i am currently reading ray franz's memoir crisis of conscience and ran across this footnote with respect to the new world translation of the holy scriptures:.
"the new world translation bears no translator's name and is presented as the anonymous work of the "new world translation committee.
the people who "translated" the NWT also wanted to copyright it...in order to copyright something you have to make it original...
Copyright is a set of exclusive rights granted to the author or creator of an original work, including the right to copy, distribute and adapt the work.
both believe in the inerrancy of the bible (psalms 12:6, 119:89, proverbs 30:5-6, 2 timothy 3:16-17, 2 peter 1:20-21, rev 22:18-19) and in their absolute correct interpretation.both believe that the other is apostate (2 thessalonians 2:3-4).both believe that the others doctrine is influenced by the devil (genesis 3:1-15, john 8:44).both believe the other is condemned for their false beliefs (2 peter 2:1-3, 1 timothy 4:1-3, 2 timothy 2:16-19, hebrews 6:4-8).neither would darken the door of the others sanctuary, for fear of contamination.both would avoid casual association (proverbs 13:20, 1 corinthians 5:11, 15:33), and certainly would not marry the other (2 corinthians 6:14).both believe that armageddon is imminent and look forward to the purified world afterwards.both consider that the highest form of charity is to convert another.
practical works like feeding the poor are considered inferior.more?
can we make it a dozen (a more perfect number)?.
dear Janet...
I'm not really accepting your vague reason for this thread.
you asked others to give more examples of "How evangelicals and Witnesses are alike"...which doesn't jive with your statement, "I have had to challenge my own. During that deep analysis I had to admit where we were the same."...
you said NOTHING to indicate that this thread was intended as some sort of "challenge your own analysis" session...
"I'd rather he approach me as a fellow human being, and not dismiss me simply because of the slot he's put me in."...he might feel the same way at this point.
love michelle
both believe in the inerrancy of the bible (psalms 12:6, 119:89, proverbs 30:5-6, 2 timothy 3:16-17, 2 peter 1:20-21, rev 22:18-19) and in their absolute correct interpretation.both believe that the other is apostate (2 thessalonians 2:3-4).both believe that the others doctrine is influenced by the devil (genesis 3:1-15, john 8:44).both believe the other is condemned for their false beliefs (2 peter 2:1-3, 1 timothy 4:1-3, 2 timothy 2:16-19, hebrews 6:4-8).neither would darken the door of the others sanctuary, for fear of contamination.both would avoid casual association (proverbs 13:20, 1 corinthians 5:11, 15:33), and certainly would not marry the other (2 corinthians 6:14).both believe that armageddon is imminent and look forward to the purified world afterwards.both consider that the highest form of charity is to convert another.
practical works like feeding the poor are considered inferior.more?
can we make it a dozen (a more perfect number)?.
~I am more orthodox than you are. Stop trying to shove me in to your little slots.~Janet/jgnat
~You know, godrulz, every time a pioneer collars me they try and pigeonhole me, too.~Janet/jgnat
...says le artiste with le wide brush...
i really don't care much for jw's at my door, or at anyone's door.
this chauvinistic, fanatical bully-a-hole, however, is one of the worst examples of a christian i have ever seen.
the jw's handled themselves very well in the face of this ridiculous bullying and taunting by this so-called christian attempting to school the jw's about god and the bible.
dear godrulz...you have a PM...or two
gotta love pat.. "ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions.
ideas must be distinct before reason can act upon them; and no man ever had a distinct idea of the trinity.
it is the mere abracadabra of the mountebanks calling themselves the priests of jesus.
dear Tammy...
Jesus (the Son of Man) was positionally lower than the Father on earth...as is stated in the bible He humbled Himself in the incarnation thus limiting His power...God had to limit His power in order to show fallen man His love and mercy, otherwise His absolute Holiness would demand instant destruction of sin in His presence. man can not see God and live. in Jesus Christ we see God...the image of the invisible God.
From reading the bible we can understand that Jesus the Son of Man was not always a human being but came into human "being" at the incarnation...but Jesus as the Son of God is eternal. He has no beginning and He has no end as God...but as the scripture states Jesus the Son of Man will henceforth be seen sitting at the right hand of the power.(mat.26:64)...Father glorify Me with the glory I had with You before the world was.(john 17:5)...even before He was the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world. to explain it another way...there is a veil on the eyes of the jewish people to this day when the OT is read...in Christ the veil is lifted...now we kiss the Son. (2 cor 3:13-16, psalm 2:12) if the veil is not lifted that we don't kiss the Son...we perish in the way...we(the bride) would not be known to the Lord (the Groom)...mat.7:21-23 luke 7:36-50... love michelle
post on here and i will send you a message.
can't promise it will be funny or clever.
most likely be just a gabble of words, but the thought will be there.
gotta love pat.. "ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions.
ideas must be distinct before reason can act upon them; and no man ever had a distinct idea of the trinity.
it is the mere abracadabra of the mountebanks calling themselves the priests of jesus.
dear whereami...
"WOW. I didn't know by posting this that it would casuse a shit storm between believers."...
may I suggest that you see THAT because you want to see that instead of people communicating their faith.
matthew 6:22
love michelle
gotta love pat.. "ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions.
ideas must be distinct before reason can act upon them; and no man ever had a distinct idea of the trinity.
it is the mere abracadabra of the mountebanks calling themselves the priests of jesus.
dear Tammy...
you said: "There is nothing like that in the bible. The trinity is an extrapolation and interpretation. No one who believes that has any right to look down on those who do not. "...
I'm not looking down on you...I think that you are worth time and effort to help you understand. I think that the nature of God is very important in knowing God...don't you? Isn't wanting to know and understand the details of a persons life the difference between wanting a friend as opposed to wanting an acquaintance?
the scriptural evidence that can be obtained regarding the nature of God as three persons is there for a reason...if there was no scriptural evidence to extrapolate then we could be confident that the triune nature of God is false...but there is evidence and it can't be dismissed.
I don't think that the nature of God was questioned in the first church of the apostles(col 1:15-18)...by the time they were called "the church" they knew who and what they were talking about and this most important doctrine would have been the first to be elucidated in order that the congregation would be of the same mind and speak the same thing as disciples who would spread the gospel(1 cor 1:10)...paul made it his duty to remove and spoke about people who were not of the same mind as the apostles. why is it that you believe that somewhere between the apostles and the nicene council there was or might have been some kind of dramatic move toward apostasy? the church was interested in the truth and relaying the truth in the manner that they received it...it was taught from one disciple to another to another...the gospels and epistles were an additional reminder in which one could confirm that what the other/later disciples were teaching was correct(col 4:16)...there was a continuity of thought and practice...a unity of the body.
love michelle
gotta love pat.. "ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions.
ideas must be distinct before reason can act upon them; and no man ever had a distinct idea of the trinity.
it is the mere abracadabra of the mountebanks calling themselves the priests of jesus.
dear PSacramento...
I know the context of the scripture I quoted and thank you for giving the "backdrop" of the discourse...Paul and Barnabas tore their clothes in distress at being called gods when they were in nature the same as their audience...
in mark 14:62-63 and matthew 26:63-65 the pharisees also tore their clothes in distress that Jesus would call Himself Son of God and then Son of Man...
the pharisees could/would not accept that God could dwell with them in a human body...the apostles and paul contrast this with their teaching that God did dwell with them in a human body the God/Man was a different nature than man alone and God alone (the Word became flesh)(col.2:9). as christians we are partakers of the divine nature through Jesus Christ (2 peter 1:4) but we are not God/Man...as Jesus the only begotten Son of God is.
love michelle
gotta love pat.. "ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions.
ideas must be distinct before reason can act upon them; and no man ever had a distinct idea of the trinity.
it is the mere abracadabra of the mountebanks calling themselves the priests of jesus.
dear Tammy...
you said: "Which is why I say that it is Christ who needs to be embraced, more than the bible. The bible can be a tool to help, but it can also hinder, as you say."...
Jesus taught the jewish people to embrace Himself (Jesus Christ) as the long awaited Messiah...when paul preached the gospel to the gentiles he taught that the gentiles should "turn" or repent or embrace the living God.
But when the apostles Barnabas and Paul heard this, they tore their clothes and ran in among the multitude, crying out and saying, “Men, why are you doing these things? We also are men with the same nature as you, and preach to you that you should turn from these useless things to the living God, who made the heaven, the earth, the sea, and all things that are in them, who in bygone generations allowed all nations to walk in their own ways. (acts 14:14-16)
love michelle
