Victor

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Posts by Victor

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  45

  Owe Raymond Franz my life anyone else??

  by Witness 007 in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  so imagine a governining body member faithful slave who's uncle wrote the new world translalation bible and predicted 1975 would be armagedon writes a book in 1980 that changed my whole life...thank you raymond franz for setting me and my wife free love this man forever.

  true pioneer!

  👍 love ❤️ .

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  Victor

  Raymond was instrumental but I read every book I could get my hands on. They were titled or written by James Penton, I was a Watchtower Slave, Barbara Grizuti Harrison, and others.
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  16

  JW's were born and built through primitive religions dynamics

  by Victor in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  russel and his followers were a byproduct of the religious orthodoxy revolt that originated in europe.

  this revolution of ideas crossed over to america seeding all the fringe groups who russel then became a part of.

  this resistance to the establishment is similar to what we have seen recently with the q annon phenomena.

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  Victor

  Truth totally. When JFK did not show up in Dallas, they morphed into doing all kinds of twisted logic like the year 2014 and 1975.
• 
  16

  JW's were born and built through primitive religions dynamics

  by Victor in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  russel and his followers were a byproduct of the religious orthodoxy revolt that originated in europe.

  this revolution of ideas crossed over to america seeding all the fringe groups who russel then became a part of.

  this resistance to the establishment is similar to what we have seen recently with the q annon phenomena.

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  Victor

  Hoser no different. This is used often in banking. Make someone a Vice-President without a raise or nominal increase. Every status gesture in a corporation is generally meant to squeeze as much as they can out of worker and create hunger games to scale up.

  It never ends. Even those at the top have an insatiable desire for more status through wealth, press, power, etc.

  It is reported that Paul McCarthy fought to have his songs cowritten with John Lennon listed first. Crazy making.

  I saw through all the status seeking early on in the JW’s and just sat back to watch the stupidity and hard work to gain status.
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  16

  JW's were born and built through primitive religions dynamics

  by Victor in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  russel and his followers were a byproduct of the religious orthodoxy revolt that originated in europe.

  this revolution of ideas crossed over to america seeding all the fringe groups who russel then became a part of.

  this resistance to the establishment is similar to what we have seen recently with the q annon phenomena.

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  Victor

  Hoser look at all the prestige (status) doused on Bethelites. Common people made to be demigods. The ultimate disgrace is being dissfellowshipped from Bethel. I saw this first hand in my former congregation. The guy was destroyed. Some former Bethelites try to fight to hold on to the special status post Bethel by moving into the local elder ranks.
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  16

  JW's were born and built through primitive religions dynamics

  by Victor in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  russel and his followers were a byproduct of the religious orthodoxy revolt that originated in europe.

  this revolution of ideas crossed over to america seeding all the fringe groups who russel then became a part of.

  this resistance to the establishment is similar to what we have seen recently with the q annon phenomena.

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• 

  Victor

  I concur hoser. Innocent children begin to see the caste system being established early on with the smartest being favored by teachers. The prettiest being most popular. The sports jock gaming special status that everyone wants to be associated with save the lower class nerds.
• 
  16

  JW's were born and built through primitive religions dynamics

  by Victor in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  russel and his followers were a byproduct of the religious orthodoxy revolt that originated in europe.

  this revolution of ideas crossed over to america seeding all the fringe groups who russel then became a part of.

  this resistance to the establishment is similar to what we have seen recently with the q annon phenomena.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Victor

  Abraham pretty much. The only thing democratic in life is time.
• 
  16

  JW's were born and built through primitive religions dynamics

  by Victor in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  russel and his followers were a byproduct of the religious orthodoxy revolt that originated in europe.

  this revolution of ideas crossed over to america seeding all the fringe groups who russel then became a part of.

  this resistance to the establishment is similar to what we have seen recently with the q annon phenomena.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  Victor

  Russel and his followers were a byproduct of the religious orthodoxy revolt that originated in Europe. This revolution of ideas crossed over to America seeding all the fringe groups who Russel then became a part of. This resistance to the establishment is similar to what we have seen recently with the Q annon phenomena. When the poor and lower class masses reach the tipping point, they turn to upper class benefactors who feel themselves losing status to start the revolution.

  It's been said that by today's standards, Russel was probably a millionaire in partnership with his father. We know that many fringe religious groups were spawned during this era including but not limited to the Mormons, Adventists, Scientologists, and others. Whatever political and religious forces pushed this upper middle class down, it was the perfect storm to rebel against the establishment.

  If one looks at the pictures of Russel and his followers, they were lower class poor people. The only admission into this group was purchase of Russels books and a pledge of slave labor to disseminate this propaganda of the world ending and recruitment of new followers.

  Russel's first followers were a small tribe who labored at following his example and implied orders. He was the prophet through which God spoke to mankind. As humans, primitive tribal dynamics soon followed. Russels wife, Maria, knew him to be just an ordinary guy who claimed special status so she began to compete with him for status. This of course created political factions and she had to go. During this early stage in any tribe, status begins to form though being the most powerful, (how many placements and hours logged), the most pious (acts of sacrifice in behalf of the tribe), and the most successful (the public speakers who were business owners, etc). We know the pathological powering over by Rutherford who led this growing tribe after Russel died.

  This hub of a small tribe were brainwashed into believing they were the chosen of mankind. As this elite specially class of God, they had to follow in Russels footsteps and go start other tribes throughout the world. I remember the yearbooks being nothing but gloating stories of these Herculean special pioneers.

  As the tribes (congregations) grew Russelites became a nation. This nation would hold international conventions lasting days on end to indoctrinate more people with displays of God's favor. Attending these events became a status symbol to be present at the release of new propaganda and new messages from God.

  At the local level hierarchies of status were formed. At the top were the elders who were below the circuit and district overseers. Next came all men as women had no status at this level. A subset of this group was the ministerial servants who who did the elders' bidding. The next level I would argue was on the same tier, elders wives and pioneers with male pioneers having one leg up on females. Finally, came the lowest cast, the publishers.

  Every class status even the lowly publisher were made to be someone with class distinction coming from God. In general, many recruits were people who had no societal status in the community and were social outcasts. But being love bombed at the initiation and made to feel special with a promised paradise where all are equal is a powerful motivating force.

  Once baptized though, publishers quickly find out that they must play political hunger games. This is crazy making and many end up suffering mental and psychological problems.

  Exiting the organization or being expelled one starts the tribal group membership all over again. This is through joining another religion or subscribing to exJW groups.

  Having been a part of most modern day exJW groups, they status seeking just continues in finding one's tier of status. Can we escape this twisted trap? No, the human experience is about fighting for status. Even hermits fight for status as the most freed status seeking animal.

  If you look at group dynamics through this lens, you being to see why we play the games we do.
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  6

  The Divided States of America

  by Victor in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  the fault lines that have always existed in america were laid bare with the current multiple crises facing our nation.

  this explains in part the polarizing tribalism that cannot get the horse back in the barn of decency and common sense.

  if you want to read up on this history check out this article .

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  Victor

  Tottenkof that is a broad generalization. What evidence do you have to reach your conclusion?
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  6

  The Divided States of America

  by Victor in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  the fault lines that have always existed in america were laid bare with the current multiple crises facing our nation.

  this explains in part the polarizing tribalism that cannot get the horse back in the barn of decency and common sense.

  if you want to read up on this history check out this article .

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  Victor

  The fault lines that have always existed in America were laid bare with the current multiple crises facing our nation. This explains in part the polarizing tribalism that cannot get the horse back in the barn of decency and common sense. If you want to read up on this history check out this article

  https://medium.com/s/balkanized-america/welcome-back-to-the-divided-states-of-america-ff3522597689

  It reminds me of XJW 1.0 :)
  
  
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  13

  Culture Wars

  by Victor in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  with things going to hell in a hand basket, i’ve taken an interest in the clashes of mindsets.

  this of course takes me back to my own evolutionary mindset pre and post jw life of two decades.

  if you overlay the core beliefs of memetic tribes as postulated by the authors, i’m curious what the median tribe of jwd would be?

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  Victor

  Fink, I don't disagree with your DT comment but the culture wars have existed since the founding of the country. DT has exploited it to get into power and that power is now collapsing on itself.