Posts by bjc2012

48

No Questions, No Answers!

by bjc2012 in

the road to god's "truth", divine truth, is the same.

it takes real, real "effort" before truth, divine truth can be achieved.

and therefore, they could not give it to us, this divine truth.

bjc2012

WT/JW SPIRITUAL "FORNICATION" BY INTERFAITH INVOLVEMENT! (Ezekiel 43:7, 8)

Please take note below:

Virginia Holocaust Museum 4 p.m. to 5:30 p.m., 2000 E. Cary St. Interfaith service for the museum's "new home for tolerance" will mark the dedication for the museum's new Shockoe Bottom home. Some of the scheduled speakers are Lt. Gov. and former Richmond Mayor Timothy M. Kaine, and Jay M. Ipson, a holocaust survivor and chairman and co-founder of the museum. Representatives from the Islamic Center, the Catholic Diocese and Jehovah's Witnesses will also take part. (804) 257-5400 or www.va-holocaust.com.

Please see this link (below) under specifically "Wednesday's" Ceremonies:

http://www1.richmond.com/output.cfm?ID=2161158&CFID=568503&CFTOKEN=77338460

They did say, "Interfaith Service", did they not? The Lt. Governor of the State of Virginia was a guest speaker. And the former Mayor of Richmond was also invited to speak. And who else will participate? Why, Jehovah's Witnesses are also said to have taken a part in the "interfaith service" along with representatives from the "Islamic Center" and the "Catholic Diocese", as of Sept. 11, 2002.

Hmmmmmm.

Jehovah spoke of this day by saying,

"In that day, is the utterance of Jehovah, I shall strike every horse with bewilderment and its rider with madness; ... and every horse of the peoples I shall strike with loss of sight." -- Zechariah 12:4

What you have read above is absolute proof Almighty God "strikes" His WTS enemy down with spiritual "madness", "bewilderment", and " and "loss of sight". Who would have ever believed we would see the type of things we are seeing today!

The WTS has gone over the deep end. No question.

Please read the following quote from the "Pay Attention To Yourselves..." Elder handbook. Of course, many thanks to "Elsewhere" for providing this information on the Main Board for us to consider. You can see it and what many other have to say about it under the thread entitled: "The WTS Has Disassociated Itself" found at:

http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/thread.aspx?id=39013&site=3

But I just want to "borrow" it to make my point on this specific thread.

"Pay Attention to Yourselves and to All the Flock"
UNIT 5 (1 )
Apostasy.
Apostasy is a standing away from, a falling away, defec-
tion, rebellion, abandonment; it involves teaching false
doctrines, supporting or promoting false religion and its
holidays or interfaith activities. (Deut. 13:13, 15; Josh.
22:22, ftn.; Acts 21:21, ftn.; 2 Cor. 6:14, 15, 17, 18;
2. John 7, 9, 10; Rev. 18:4)
If it is learned that a person has taken up association with
another religious organization, the matter should be inves-
tigated, and if verified, a committee should be formed.
If it is clearly established that the person has joined another
religion and intends to remain with it, the elders would make
a brief announcement to the congregation that suchone has
disassociated himself. (w86
10/15 p. 31 )

Nuff said.

bjc

Edited by - bjc2012 on 20 October 2002 22:12:1

Edited by - bjc2012 on 20 October 2002 22:13:57

48

No Questions, No Answers!

by bjc2012 in

the road to god's "truth", divine truth, is the same.

it takes real, real "effort" before truth, divine truth can be achieved.

and therefore, they could not give it to us, this divine truth.

bjc2012

Smitty,

Please read above message to you.

Thanks,

bjc

48

No Questions, No Answers!

by bjc2012 in

the road to god's "truth", divine truth, is the same.

it takes real, real "effort" before truth, divine truth can be achieved.

and therefore, they could not give it to us, this divine truth.

bjc2012

Hi Cicatrix,

Hi Bjc, I considered what you had to say, but you lost me at the responsibility for being ignorant part...I may be ignorant, but I will continue to search. Just not very much right now, because it still hurts.

I "feel" your pain. I've been there, really. But as along as you continue to "search", you will win. -- Matt. 7:7, 8, 14

However on the question of "ignorance", we must remember Paul spoke of a special kind of "ignorance" at 1 Corinthians 14:38. This special type of "ignorance" must be avoided since it is "willful", and self-induced. Remember, the heart is "treacherous" and "desperate...who can know it?" (Jeremiah 17:9) So "willful ignorance" on our parts must be avoided at all costs. Notice the comment I made to "Onacruise" which is quoted below:

"...Therefore, I think its time that we make a serious effort to truly come to an understanding of God's Will and stated purposes in scripture, as written. No more "skipping over" verses" (like the WTS did when they wrote the "Know Jehovah" book on the contents of Ezekiel). And of course, the information about God's "Chieftain" (Ezekiel 44:1-3) is a good place to start. We have to do this, in all good conscience, BEFORE we conclude the Bible is such a wondrous paradox, and God hasn't done HIS JOB and provided for mankind. When the truth be told, actually God has provided. But the problem is, we have "skipped over" his provision, which has led to UNTOLD problems and difficulties in understanding His Will for mankind."

If we do the above, we are "willingly ignorant". -- 2 Peter 3:5 KJV

That was my point. Hope this helps.

Peace,

bjc

Edited by - bjc2012 on 20 October 2002 18:44:32

Edited by - bjc2012 on 20 October 2002 19:5:49

48

No Questions, No Answers!

by bjc2012 in

the road to god's "truth", divine truth, is the same.

it takes real, real "effort" before truth, divine truth can be achieved.

and therefore, they could not give it to us, this divine truth.

bjc2012

To "Link":

I didn't say I knew ALL of the "Truth", did I? I could see a person being a litle leary of someone saying that. So please go back and check what I said. We get "all truth" from the "Spirit of the Truth" as it "guides us into ALL TRUTH", so the Bible says. And I'm certainly NOT the "spirit of the truth". I make no such claim. -- John 16:13

To "Onacruise":

...I agree. I used to find such elaborate investigations intriguing, and though I could wade right on in with all kinds of "stuff," I much prefer: Keep It Simple.

I can appreciate where you are coming from. But please consider this.

Ezekiel 44:1-3 which speaks about God's "Chieftain, who eats bread in God's Presence" IS SIMPLE. So what's complicated or "elaborate" about it?

When we think about it, the study of God's "Chieftain" is NOT an "elaborate investigation" after all. No but it simply is a integral part of holy prophecy which mankind continually and consistently OVERLOOKS. Mankind does it deliberate too, just as many are doing on this discussion board. But really, there is nothing "elaborate" about it. It is quite simple in fact.

The "Chieftain" prophecy has been there, in the book of Ezekiel, right there in bold print for everyone's eyes to see for the past 2,500 years. No can deny that. But is anybody trying to "UNDERSTAND" it. Now, that's the question.

So, that being the case, I think its high time we started learning something from Holy Scripture, and quit "dancing around" holy prophecy. (I'm not talking about you personally, but mankind in general.) That's why we don't learn anything and we keep going in circles. We, in all good conscience, choose, that's choose to OVERLOOK things we shouldn't. And then we say, "I don't understand the Bible." But I say, we are the ones at fault, if we "skip over" these powerful prophetic thoughts of God. Then, the picture will always be INCOMPLETE, as long as we continue to "skip over" important details of scripture. And that is what we have done in the past, and that is what we continue to do, mankind in general I'm am speaking of. We have become "skip over" experts. No wonder we don't understand anything. How can we learn anything if we keep this "skip-over-important-verses-in-the-bible" stuff up?

I say, its just not "gonna happen" people. We're not gonna get "Divine Understanding". Simple.

The real truth is, the "Chieftain" information is vital, extremely important. And we simply can't skip over it any longer folks, if we ever, ever expect to "understand" the bible. Even the WTS, made this mistake, as have so many other religions. It seems, everybody who claims to be "christian" is "guilty" of doing this.

Therefore, I think its high time we start making a serious effort to truly come to understand God's "Divine Will" and stated purposes in scripture, as written. No more "skipping over" verses, (Like the WTS did when they wrote the "Know Jehovah" book on the contents of Ezekiel wherein whole chapters of Ezekiel was conspicuously not commented upon. This is truly unforgiveable.) And the information about God's "Chieftain" is a certainly and without a doubt, a very good place to start. We have to do this, in all good conscience, BEFORE we conclude the Bible is such a wondrous paradox, and God hasn't done HIS JOB and provided for mankind. When the truth be told, actually God has provided. But the problem is, we have "skipped over" his provision, which has led to UNTOLD problems and difficulties in understanding His "Divine Will" for mankind.

Therefore, I'd say God really has "kept it simple", as you suggest. Because He is using the same M.O. or mode of operation, that He has, for the past 6,000 years. It is simple and God keeps it that way. It is mankind who always tries to complicate the matter, by OVERLOOKING important details of His Stated Will. Let me explain.

This is the "Bible Research" Forum. Therefore, all of us should be "searching" for truth.

However, most people here, actually think of the Bible as being a message that is BEYOND human understanding or comprehension. An INCOMPREHENSIBLE message from God. A book which is IMPOSSIBLE for one to understand. We think that the message from God presents a formidable "paradox WITHOUT a reasonable solution", a great mystery BEYOND the scope of mankind. But this is NOT true.

Instead of thinking the Bible is a "paradox" beyond our scope, we should think, the Bible is a "Sacred Secret". God's Religious Secret that He has held tightly in His Hand for a purpose, UNTIl the designated person arrives to dispense His knowledge. And, in the meantime while we are waiting, we should always note the "details" that are unexplained, knowing a plausible, reasonable, understandable "explanation" will surface and God will have provided as usual. That should be our attitude of the matter. We should know, and fully expect God to send us the designated person, the "Chieftain" of Ezekiel 44:1-3. And then, and only then, will be rightly expect God to release the tightly held sacred information, that He has up to this time, wisely kept privy only to Himself. At that time, we should expect, the sacred information of God, to be released, at God's discretion. Its release comes at the designated time foretold in scripture, "in the final part of the days" when "Israel" is in "great distress". -- See Jeremiah 23:20; 30:7-9, 24.

So God has kept it simple. God simply releases His sacred "understanding" of His purposes, by way of the "Chieftain". He grants true "understanding" of His Will to this chosen one. It is God's choice, God's Chosen One. And we should expect the Bible to speak openly about this one. And it does. His role is to explain things, as we would expect of a coming "messiah", like Jesus. (John 4:25) This one is spoken of in God's "scroll". But the holy "scroll" is held in God's Hands only. So since the "scroll" is held tight within His Grasp, as Revelation 5:1 shows, everything is proceeds according to God's discretion. And the holy "seals" on this "scroll, "seals up" the bible. This holy "scroll" has upon it, seven "seals" or seven (7) great, cataclysmic events untold to mankind that blocks "understanding" of God's Sacred Purposes. 7 unrevealed truths which work to "seal" the Bible up, until Jehovah the Almighty gets ready to reveal these things. 7 "religious secrets" of God. After all, Jehovah God is the "Great Revealer" of Secrets. -- Daniel 2:47

So since this is the case, God keeps his Religious Secrets to Himself until, until its time to reveal these powerful events as "religious secrets" or "Sacred Secrets" to the "Chieftain". God "grants understanding" to his Chosen One, the "Chieftain" as depicted in Ezekiel 44:1-3 "eating bread" in God's Holy Presence. In turn, the "Chieftain" reveals it to mankind, but to spiritual "Israel" [JWs] first. This Divine Pattern, was first established by Jesus Christ as revealed in Matthew 10:6 and Matthew 13:11.

Other verses back this up. For example, Revelation 6:2 shows this. The "Chieftain" is revealed as the rider of the mysterious "white horse" who receives a "crown" of favor from God, in these last days. He is also shown in scripture to be "Shiloh", who is supposed to show up "in the final part of the days". -- Gen. 49:1, 10

So then the "plan" is quite simple as Amos 3:7 shows, this is God's designated M.O. [modus operande], His pattern of operation. As stated above, the "Chieftain" is allowed to "eat bread" in the Holy Presence of the Almighty, in His Future Temple in fact. A "Temple" that was previously abandoned by God for becoming guilty of committing "fornication" with its filthy, disgraceful "king's" activity. These worthless "kings" [Governing Body of JWs] are the ones who presumptuously "put their doorposts" right up beside "God's doorpost" and caused the Temple to be "defiled" in God's eyes. Now the Temple must be "purified" before God will come near them again. (Ezekiel 43:22-27) A "defiled" Temple that now, because of spiritual "fornication" being committed by the "kings" [G.B. UN/NGO Disaster], that now has to be cleansed and "purified" before God would accept them again. As Ezekiel says of this new Temple Arrangement, "This is the law of the House...all around is something most holy. Look! This is the law of the House." In other words, Jehovah is primarily interested in this "House" being kept dutifully "Holy", spiritually clean, in His sight, before He will deal with them again. -- See Ezekiel 43:7-12.

Simple.

And to set this whole stage of events for us, dutifully Almighty God reveals His "confidential matters" to this foretold designated person, who fully carries out God's Will toward wayward "Israel" [JWs]. He becomes the "Servant" of God; the one God "chooses" for this work. -- Isaiah 49:1-7

So God chooses the "Chieftain", who then despenses the "knowledge" to the deserving ones of "Israel" first. The ones God has chosen. Therefore, the "kingdom of God", becomes repatriated, restored "Israel". The ones that are restored from apostasy to God's favor. The spiritual nation of Israel [JWs]. And that means, we today who accept God's arrangement for peace, we who accept Ezekiel's "Chieftain", restored Israel, become the "kingdom of God", reborn on earth, the kingdom that we have all waiting for all of this time. God's Kingdom is now, upon earth, where God "dwells" forever and ever. In other words, we as "Jehovah's Witnesses" become the long-awaited "Temple" Arrangement that had to be pulled up from spiritual "fornication", because of the disgraceful sins of the Governing Body of Jehovan's Witnesses, but later will have the inestimatable privilege to have God Almighty Himself "reside in the midst of the sons of Israel to TIME INDEFINITE". -- Ezekiel 43:7-9; 48:35

So the story does have a happy ending, after all.

This is a blessing, if we can "see" the whole picture. We can today become the holy, blessed "arrangement" of God. But first, we must come to understand the role of the "Chieftain". Again, keeping it simple. We must come to understand the "Chieftain" is the one that God invites to "eat bread" in His lofty presence, the only one. And he will provide proper directions for us, Israel. Israel can recovery from spiritual disaster, only if they accept the spiritual help from the "Chieftain", and thus benefit fully from this horrible WTS "experience". This is our only, only way out. -- Ezekiel 44:1-3; Daniel 2:34, 35, 44

I hope this helps.

bjc

Edited by - bjc2012 on 20 October 2002 15:14:47

Edited by - bjc2012 on 20 October 2002 15:26:44

Edited by - bjc2012 on 20 October 2002 16:56:50

Edited by - bjc2012 on 20 October 2002 17:42:6

Edited by - bjc2012 on 20 October 2002 19:2:12

48

No Questions, No Answers!

by bjc2012 in

the road to god's "truth", divine truth, is the same.

it takes real, real "effort" before truth, divine truth can be achieved.

and therefore, they could not give it to us, this divine truth.

bjc2012

Smitty you said,

I'm familiar with the group that was originally formed with MDS and BJC. I also studied his material on my own. His first following (1990) was quite sizable and collectively found several scriptural jewels. But once they saw where it was leading, nowhere, they split. Even today they say he's waiting on a WAR. When the Gulf War didn't prove to be the Big One, they knew he was another doomsayer .

also,

MDS taught Saddam Hussein was the king of the north in 1990 during the gulf war. And the "Mother of all Battles" was the great one mentioned in the book of Daniel.

Produce the "proof" that MDS said this.

If not, you are a liar.

bjc

Edited by - bjc2012 on 20 October 2002 8:52:22

48

No Questions, No Answers!

by bjc2012 in

the road to god's "truth", divine truth, is the same.

it takes real, real "effort" before truth, divine truth can be achieved.

and therefore, they could not give it to us, this divine truth.

bjc2012

Smitty,

The only reason I am posting to you is to inform others who wish to know more about our message.

Smitty, if MDS actually taught that type of garbage about Saddam H. and the "Gulf War", I'd be right in there with you calling him a false prophet. But MDS has never ever taught such absolute nonsense.

I have been with MDS from the beginning. The movement STARTED in 1991. That has been stated on this board many, many times so its a matter of public record. MDS and I left the JWs movement in Spring of 1991 together.

We have never, ever taught anything about the year of 1990 and a war coming at that time. If memory serves me right, the "Gulf War" you mentioned above started in January of 1991, long before we even left the JW Organization. MDS and I were active JWs at that time, foolishly following the WTS and out teaching their false doctrines from door-to-door at that time. In other words, Smitty, the "Gulf War" had started and was over, BEFORE we could leave the JW Organization!!!

So either you have never read his early material and are terribly misinformed, or you are maliciously lying and fabricating thoughts.

We released the book, "The Report", in 1994, of which, many, many people on this board have a copy. The book tells what we believe. Namely, JWs are modern-day Israel in captivity to the WTS, Babylon the Great, and are in need of a special "release" by God. (Rev. 9:13, 14)

In fact, MDS has taught from the beginning, that 1991 (spring) was the beginning of the "FIRST WOE", a spiritual attack upon the Governing Body itself, alone. The TWMC group believed itself to be a part of that particular bible fulfillment. A special 5-month plague on the Governing Body of JWs. (Rev. 9:1-12) We knew then, the "Great War" of Daniel 10:1 was in the future. And in Volume II of "The Report" it shows this clearly. If you had read this, you would know how we see the tie-in with the "White Horse" activity with the "Red Horse" activity of Revelation 6th chapter, and how this affects the JW Organization. Now, Smitty, we had that information from the beginning, some of it even before we left the organization. And everybody associated with this movement knew that did not teach anything about a War supposed occurring in the early 1990s period.

So I think you have confused us with some OTHER group.

Again, you will find that we mentioned that fact many times in posts on this discussion board. As well as the relationship of the "Fiery-colored" Red Horse (War) and after its resulting aftermath upon JWs worldwide as a international organization. Volume II of the "Report" discusses this in detail.

In fact, there are many people around who are familiar with what we taught in the early years, so I'd have to say you are greatly mistaken or have mixed us up with some other group. (There was a group in Canada that fits the description of what you said above, and the timing is about right. I am familiar with that particular group and what they taught, but was never a part of it.) Of course I know about the group called TWMC, and know exactly what we taught since I was there when it was formed in Spring of 1991.

On a more personal basis, you addressed none of the points I mentioned in my last post to you. Which tells me, you are not really interested in discussing scriptural matters, but only arguing and accusing. Therefore, I do not have any more time to waste here on this thread. Its clear to me, you are not interested in our message but only in arguing and mindlessly accusing people for no reason. And a whole lot of fabricating and spreading lies without trying to truly obtain the facts before hand.

So you are not someone in whom I wish to communicate anymore on this thread or on this discussion board.

Now on the other hand, if in the future you have a change of heart (because I know people do change), or seek to understand something scripturally about what we teach in the future, then in that case, I would be open to a rational discussion of the matter. My email is open.

But, the first place we are going to start is,

WHO IS THE MYSTERY "CHIEFTAIN" of Ezekiel 44:1-3, 45:22, 46:16, 17?

What -- did you think I was going to forget you dodged the issue again?

A little humility would help you and a few others here following this thread, I think.

No, you don't know about the "Mystery Chieftain", and many others here don't know either. Thus, my point exactly when I started this thread and its title.

As I said before and I will say it again, you have only to wait another 6 months of so, and then we will know for sure, whether what MDS teaches is from God, or he is teaching a man-made message. Spring of 2003 will tell the story. (John 7:17)

But, the "Great War" is something you will probably NOT have to wait for much longer for. Smitty, terrible War is ahead, in fulfillment of Revelation 6:4. And with that realization, finally, we will all find out, just who is the "King of the North" that is foretold to overrun a spiritually low "Land of decoration", BEFORE it becomes an exalted "Mountain of Decoration" in God's eyes. -- Daniel 11:40-45

Let's just wait and see. Okay?

bjc

Edited by - bjc2012 on 19 October 2002 10:23:51

Edited by - bjc2012 on 19 October 2002 10:38:49

Edited by - bjc2012 on 19 October 2002 10:59:28

48

No Questions, No Answers!

by bjc2012 in

the road to god's "truth", divine truth, is the same.

it takes real, real "effort" before truth, divine truth can be achieved.

and therefore, they could not give it to us, this divine truth.

bjc2012

Smitty,

BJC2012. I have to admit though, MDS is a brilliant bible scholar. It's no refuting that. I've studied his material; quite brilliant to say the least. I can see how people can be mislead to following men. His teachings are very convincing. The only thing I see that can refute his claims is time disproves his words.

You say his "teachings are convincing". That is, the "teaching". Then you'd better read John 7:17.

Actually, Smitty, whether MDS is "brilliant" from a human standpoint, is not the point. I agree he is. But what you need to focus on is whether his "teachings" are scripturally based. Are his teachings convincing to you because, because they are firmly rooted in scripture. If one knows his bible, there is no problem here. I happen to be one who knows my bible. I've just completed my 50th year in dedication to Jehovah God, that's 1952 - 2002, so I'm no novice of scripture. I'm a senior citizen who wasn't born yesterday, if you get my drift.

Smitty, let me give you some good advice, and you'd better pay close attention to what I'm about to say. You need to go back and re-read the material you have from MDS. And then, you need to ask yourself is MDS "rightly dividing" the word of God or not? (2 Tim. 2:15 KJV)

You don't need to wait for anything. You don't need time to help you decide what to do. No, you do not. A Bible-trained Servant of God, can know exactly what God's wants him to do. And there is no need to wait for anything.

You say MDS is a worthless, lying false prophet and time will prove this to be true. But he is "brilliant," and has a convincing argument, like the WTS. So for the time being, that's all we can do. We really can't do no more.

Actually that statement, shows that you are not a very good student of scripture, even AFTER leaving the WTS foolish teachings. You are telling me, Fred Franz, CT Russell, Judge Rutherford were BRILLIANT BIBLE SCHOLARS representing the WTS? All of the false doctrine they taught, and they are brilliant?

No, but they were all idiots. And we were idiots to follow them too. It doesn't take but 5 minutes to prove every JWs completely wrong on all of their major doctrines. 1914, invisible parousia, 607, 144,000 going to heaven, Jesus not our mediator, and on and on. Only a fool would really believe such things. And yet, that is precise what you and I believed. So then, were we as the fabulous JWs of our day, were we "brilliant" bible students, Smitty? Ha! Ha! We were not brilliant bible students by no means. We were not "Beroeans" by no means. And because of that, the WTS made complete fools out of us! Didn't they?

But we learned better, Smitty. We improved.

But now you suggest that I am a fool still. I'm still following a "man" and not God's Word. Is that it? I haven't learned from my mistakes, huh? I haven't learned from my mistakes from following the WTS?

Well if you think this, you are wrong. I am a "beroean" now. I prove everything nowadays, before I believe it.

But, the big question you need to carefully consider is this: whether MDS teachings "comes from God" or not. Take the Bible and prove him wrong. That's all you've got to do.

Show him that the "Mystery Chieftain" is really Jesus Christ. Prove that, Smitty. Can you do that? Yes, Smitty, who is the "Mystery Chieftain" of Ezekiel 44:1-3. Can you answer that?

Otherwise, Smitty you and all the other "cronies" on this board who chide the mention of this potent scriptural information of the "Mystery Chieftain", is an idiot! Plain and simple.

Jesus said at John 7:24,

"Stop judging from the outward appearance, but judge with righteous judgment."

If you can't do this "Smitty," then just shut up. Because you are not making yourself look good to someone who knows what the Bible teaches when you make those kind of idiotic remarks about someone who is teaching scriptures correctly.

Judge the man on what he teaches "Smitty", and not by your personal prejudices, please.

Case in point, what Jesus said at John 7:17. I've quoted that powerful passage below in case anyone else is reading this post.

So Smitty, if "time" is the only thing that PROVES him to be a false prophet and PROVES his "message" false to you, then you stand in an unenviable position I'd say. Its not a scriptural position, my friend.

Especially since your can't prove him wrong SCRIPTURALLY using the Bible, as you should. Jesus discharged you, a christian, with the distinct responsibility to PROVE all false prophets wrong, scripturally using God's Word. Their message is flawed and according to Jesus, and it should be proveable, exposable. You ought to be able to do it.

Like the "Mystery Chieftain". Take that information and PROVE HIM WRONG, Smitty. That's all you you've got to do to convince me of anything.

Here are your scriptures:

Ezekiel 44:1-3; 45:22; 46:16, 17

Who is this person, Smitty?

If you don't know, then just shut up, will ya?

"Even anyone foolish, when keeping silent, will be regarded as wise; anyone closing up his own lips, as having understanding." -- Proverbs 17:28

Even a fool is regarded as wise when he shuts up, "Smitty". And scripturally speaking, you are an idiot.

And in the meantime, learn to "test" the message, for a change. And quit talking about, "well...we have to wait on time and see for ourselves."

If that is all you can come up with, you are a pitiful example of a christian follower of Jesus. Simply because you can't "TEST" THE MESSAGE. You show your own inability to examine the message, in the light of Proverbs 18:17 and make a scriptural cross-examination and prove the message wrong, SCRIPTURALLY. That's scripturally, which admittedly is something you cannot do.

So, the only thing you can do, is presumptuously call him a false prophet, BEFORE THE FACT REVEALS THEMSELVES. Which is of course, quite stupid on your part.

But, in the meantime, after carefully reading his material, you proclaim to the world "he is quite brilliant", "convincing" even, and you cannot disprove his teachings scripturally, as a "Beroean" should be able to do, using God's Word. (Acts 17:11) But you say, don't believe him, time will prove him to be a false prophet. And that's all you can say about the matter.

How stupid!

Smitty, my opinion of you is that you are the one who is running ahead of Jehovah, since your can't take the scriptures and PROVE MDS wrong. You can't show him, for instance that the "Mystery Chieftain" is not correctly taught. So you are the one presumptuous here and not making proper use of the scriptures. -- Ezekiel 44:1-3

"TEST THE INSPIRED EXPRESSION" (1 John 4:1)

John 7:17

If anyone wants to do His will, he will understand whether the teaching is from God or if I am speaking on My own. (Holman)

Acts 17:11

: The people here were more open-minded than those in Thessalonica, since they welcomed the message with eagerness and examined the Scriptures daily to see if these things were so. (Holman)

2 Corinthians 13:5

: Test yourselves to see if you are in the faith. Examine yourselves. Or do you not recognize for yourselves that Jesus Christ is in you?--unless you fail the test. (Holman)

1 John 4:1

: Dear friends, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to determine if they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world. (Holman)

1 Thessalonians 5:21

But test everything carefully; hold on to the good; (NIV)

Revelation 2:2

: I know your works, your labor, and your endurance, and that you cannot tolerate evil. You have tested those who call themselves apostles and are not, and you have found them to be liars. (Holman)

Smitty, this what first century christians were able to do. They were able to "test" the message. Why can't you?

bjc

Edited by - bjc2012 on 17 October 2002 23:50:45

48

No Questions, No Answers!

by bjc2012 in

the road to god's "truth", divine truth, is the same.

it takes real, real "effort" before truth, divine truth can be achieved.

and therefore, they could not give it to us, this divine truth.

bjc2012

Daniel 8:23 happened.

9/11 & Osama bin Laden. Got it?

Please read.

Daniel 8 Chapter

8:23: "And in the final part of their kingdom, as the transgressors act to a completion, there will stand up a king fierce in countenance and understanding ambiguous sayings."; So, OSAMA BIN LADEN HAPPENED!!!!!!!!!!

The "transgressors who act to a completion" [Governing Body of JWs] also happened.

Now, here is the future...

8:24: He [Osama bin Laden] will become very strong, but not by his own power. He will cause a shocking amount of destruction [to the King of South] and succeed in everything he does. He will destroy powerful leaders and devastate the holy people [Israel, JWs].

This is my last post to you, for the time being, okay?

bjc

48

No Questions, No Answers!

by bjc2012 in

the road to god's "truth", divine truth, is the same.

it takes real, real "effort" before truth, divine truth can be achieved.

and therefore, they could not give it to us, this divine truth.

bjc2012

Smitty,

You asked,

Hi again.
What of these things you mention have come to pass, that we can see, of course? Or are these new prophecies that we are to await?
What about the prophecies that were to occur in fall 2001. Remember???

Here is the great significance of the event. October 7, 2001.

Please read Daniel 8:23, 24. Thanks.

Daniel 8:23, 24 = shows 2 great events occurring around the same time, pertaining to God's People, JWs.

(a) First, 9/11 (Osama's Grand Entrance).

(b) Next, October 7 - The Great "Hosanna" as observed in Israel [Psalms 118:24-26]. It is the "Day" Jehovah saves His people. (See footnote Psalms 118:24 NWT.)

This is shown or revealed by the magnificent release of Jehovah, when the UN/NGO situation is addressed by the G.B. It is where they ADMIT GUILT by withdrawing from UN and thus, change the real agenda for the October 7th meeting. The agenda of the infamous meeting had to be changed, because of what God had done. God saves his people on that day. The date commemorates the time when Jehovah officially LIBERATES his people from the wicked clutches of the G.B., by exposing their wicked deeds done in secret back in 1991. Afterwards, to redeem themselves, the G.B. uses "theocratic strategy" and subsequently lies about secret UN affiliation for 10 years.

Instead, the G.B. tell the library card "lie" which persists today. This is the "wine of her fornication". So, Babylon the Great's [WTS'] "wine of her fornication" is the Library Card "Lie" told by Governing Body told to make ALL JWs earthwide "drunk". (Rev. 14:8; 17:2)

So, I'm pleased with MDS' explanation of the significance of October 7, 2001. I feel I've learned a lot from him so far.

bjc

Edited by - bjc2012 on 16 October 2002 15:24:19

Edited by - bjc2012 on 16 October 2002 15:33:31

Edited by - bjc2012 on 16 October 2002 15:36:52

48

No Questions, No Answers!

by bjc2012 in

the road to god's "truth", divine truth, is the same.

it takes real, real "effort" before truth, divine truth can be achieved.

and therefore, they could not give it to us, this divine truth.

bjc2012

Smitty,

You brought up the person who calls himself "MDS". Yes, I'm familiar with Deut. 18:22 and the claims of "MDS". In fact along that line, "MDS" (the person who claims to be the Mystery "Chieftain"), said the following some time back in the very same link I mentioned above,

...In my writings, under the name of "MDS", I personally have responded to questions raised by various persons frequenting JW Discussion boards over the years. I've been asked me a number of questions, about dates, when the "1,260 days" of prophesying of the "Two Witnesses" would begin. I have obliged such individuals by providing inquiring individuals with the actual the beginnings, time-frames and lengths of
(a) The "Measuring" Period of Revelation 11:1, which precedes
(b) The "1260 days" of prophesying of the Two Witnesses, and
(c) The "Trampling" period of "42 months" upon "Jerusalem," and
(d) The "3 1/2 days" of shame and disgrace for the "Two Witnesses"
each running approximately 3 1/2 years for each period, starting with Spring of the year of 1996 which begins the "Measuring" period of Revelation 11:1...the Fall of 1999 for beginning of "1260 days" of "prophesying" of Two Witnesses...next period, the Spring of the year of 2003 starts the "trampling of Jerusalem", and finally, Fall of 2006 for the beginning of the "3 1/2 days" of death and shame of the "Two Witnesses," inflicted by the "Small Horn" of Daniel 8:23.
I have provided the "details"...as Acts 13:40, 41 shows.

So I think thats enough to show where he stands on the question of "time" and Bible prophecy.

But "Smitty", let me give you something that you can really sink your teeth in. Something that you can really run your mouth about. Okay?

THE IDENTITY OF THE "SMALL HORN" -- Daniel 8:23; 11:23

Smitty, "MDS" also teaches the "Small Horn" of Daniel 8:23 mentioned above, is OSAMA BIN LADEN. Surprise, surprise. That's right, Osama [or Usama] bin Laden, will prove to be someone actually mentioned in Bible prophecy who makes himself (by Divine permission) the "bloodiest", deadliest enemy of Jehovah's Witnesses worldwide, ever. The near future will bear all of this out. But at this time, I think, all of this really needs to be said on record, openly, publicly.

And I think this should be also mentioned too. Bible prophecy reveals the terrifying "Small Horn" will prove to be someone who will (in the impending "Great War" shortly upon us now thanks to President Bush's recent efforts), show himself to be America's worst nightmare militarily-speaking and will surprise the world at large with his military prowess and genius. No, he is NOT dead, and Yes, his many "intrigues" will accomplish much against the "King of the South". -- See Daniel 7:19-21; 8:9-12; 8:23-25; 11:23; 11:40, 41.

No, we haven't seen the last of Osama bin Laden people. No, not by a long shot.

So when it comes to truly understanding these earthshaking, pivotal events in human history, "Smitty", you know nothing but only show yourself to be a complete idiot. (Yes, I've read your explanations of Revelation. Its a joke.) In other words, "Prepare to meet your God, O Israel", Jehovah's Witnesses. Because of sinning against Jehovah as a people and nation, your experience will be like being 'chased by a lion, and running up on a bear.' -- Amos 4:12; 5:18-20

Whether we believe it or not, we today are looking down-the-barrel of the great fulfillments of Daniel 10:1, Matt. 24:7 and Revelation 6:4 in the most unique way. War people, real war! Yeap, people its "crunch-time". So "Smitty", when this all occurs your great personal dilemma will understandably be, the only person on earth who actually UNDERSTANDS these future events facing us, is the very one you delight in BLASMPHEMING. The one who calls himself, "MDS". That will be your personal dilemma, "Smitty".

So in reference to Deut. 18:22 "Smitty"...hmmmm.....we will see.

Peace to all,

and,

blessings and praise to the Name of "Yehowah" [Jehovah] always,

bjc

Edited by - bjc2012 on 16 October 2002 14:14:27