Well, I can only say I don't believe in the god portrayed by the JWs. FTR, I don't believe in the concept of hellfire. But I don't NOT believe in god because I don't want to believe that hellfire exists. It's obviously a man-made concept (hellfire, that is).
blacksheep
JoinedPosts by blacksheep
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32
Non believers in god please.
by Monster ina poster( don't ask who said, it i don't want argument with the person) here implied a while ago that many of the xjw here no longer believe in god because they cannot accept the "fact" that they willl be destroyed during armageddon.
in other words you are looking for ways to discredit that you ( you.
meaning anyone) will be destoryed.
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Are you the black sheep?
by sleepy in.
theres got to be quite a few here who, like me are the only onbe to turn "apostate" in their family.. although you know you've done the right thing, all your family think either you have been mislead by satan or you have turned evil.. how do you feel around your family,and do you wonder what they think of you?
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blacksheep
Hmmm...does my screen name tell you anything??!!!
I don't think there's any way I can fancy myself NOT to be the outcast of the family. My family's made that perfectly clear. Made the mistake of getting dunked at 13. Younger brother was smart enough not to, so even though he's led a pretty questionable life, he's in the clear...Older sister is being the good little dub: married an elder and everthing. During my last conversation with her (which will probably be the last for a LOOONG time), she kept pretty much scolding me for how "independent" I am. (Hmmm...let's see, I'm over 30, yes, I do make my own decisions, I'm stable, a mother of 2, lead a pretty decent life...only SHE and the JW's can make "independence" sound so horrible). She calls parents every week and plays their game, brother calls parents basically when he needs money (which is most of the time). No, he's not independent by any stretch of the imagination, but I guess that's GOOD. "Needy" is a good thing in my family....
Yes, I'm a family outcast. For thinking for myself. For rejecting the JW's. For having the audacity to make my own decisions and take responsibility for my own life. I'm not needy, I'm not contrite, I don't revere the organization (in fact, quite the opposite), I have little patience with the JW games, esp. their shunning activities. Somehow, if I was in prison, a drug addict, a single mom with 11 kids and terribly in need of help, I'd be more acceptable to them. They're funny that way.
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August KM Fall Out
by writerpen ini'm curious to know if anyone has noticed different behavior from their dub family and friends since the aug. km about disfellowshipped ones.
i've noticed that my mother is no longer emailing me, nor is she responding to my emails.
i really wish that she would just come out directly and state that she will no longer talk to me instead of just ignoring everything, thinking i will go away.
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blacksheep
Obviously, the JW leaders felt the need to refocus attention on the article because they perceive JWs have gotten lax with respect to shunning. Therefore, I think it is quite logical to expect our JW relatives to exhibit more "appropriate," stricter behavior with their DA'd, DF'd (or any variety thereof) relatives. Even though nothing has technically changed, the
WTS evidently felt people's individual behavior toward their non-active, etc., relatives was remiss.I'm glad to have found out this increased emphasis on how to treat non-active/DF/DA JWs: otherwise I'd have no exposure to it. Personally, based on my mother and sister's behavior toward me of late, I think they've definately taken the shunning emphasis to heart. I figured something was up, and I had already mentioned this to dh.
All I can say, is too bad for them. They made their bed: they'll lie in it. I'm simply not going to put up with their controlling behavior: I put up with it for 20+ years as a JW. Now that I'm out and free, I want them to know that I have absolutely no respect for their manipulative behavior. I don't need a relationship with them so badly that I sacrifice my dignity, self-respect, and that of my family. Their behavior of late is affecting their ability to see their grandchildren/nephews/neices who are infants. They'll have to live with THEIR decisions in this area.
I agree. I think too many people give their WBTS family WAAY too much control, even still.
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even if the "new system" never comes
by ConnieLynn inlast night i called to do the "check-in" thing on my mom.
she had just been to the assembly and she was all fired up and decided to give me an earful.
apparently, at the assembly all in attendance were told that "this is it" the end is nigh and they should do all they can to prepare for the impending destruction about to befall everyone.
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blacksheep
On the issue of JW's being lazy. I think many/most of them ARE lazy on the psychological, moral, and intellectual level. It takes more courage, energy, and strength of character to make you own choices and decisions in life. To exposure youself to various ways of thinking/believing. Witnesses basically turn over all that decision making to the society. Sure, many of them are industrious, but they are following a very narrow presrcibed course of action. That requires very little energy, no creativity, and really is the EASY way. The Society TELLS them how to live. That is the epitome of laziness IMO.
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even if the "new system" never comes
by ConnieLynn inlast night i called to do the "check-in" thing on my mom.
she had just been to the assembly and she was all fired up and decided to give me an earful.
apparently, at the assembly all in attendance were told that "this is it" the end is nigh and they should do all they can to prepare for the impending destruction about to befall everyone.
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blacksheep
My devout JW mom has said the same thing. Which at first floored me as well. I see that POV as (obviously alarming...) but indicative of (but not limited to) several things:
1. It shuts any argument down.
2. By the same token, paradoxically, it indicates that on some level, mom recognizes it MAY all be a hopeless lie. (I call this a chink in the JW armour. On some level, they are uncertain).
3. It reflects a total brainwashing. Think about it. They are basing their whole lives on the believe that Armageddon is imminent and that they will survive and live forever in paradise. This hope is SO ingrained in them, that even if it did not happen, they would prefer to live life as though it WILL happen. ?????
The problem that psychologically healthy individuals have with #3 is that we perceive the tremendous FUTILITY of living one's entire life based on a dream that WILL NEVER HAPPEN. No attempt to really experience the richness of life, of relationships, of creating something, of enjoying present existence....all is cast aside for a pipe dream. Forget the past and present and look to the future (which we all know their vision of the future will not happen).
I've come to believe that you cannot be a JW have a reasonable degree of psychological health. I'm not saying this to be cutesy or snide, or bitter. I'm saying it because it's true when you assess JW doctrine.
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On The Art Of Fading
by expatbrit inin october of 2000, i faded away from the watchtower.
like most people, i have family and friends who are jw's (including my wife and parents).
fading is generally the best method for people in that situation.
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blacksheep
Another thing, Expatbrit. As I read your post, I cannot help but be amazed by the level of self-awareness and profound philosophic reality you've embraced. As a fellow ex-JW survivor, it touches me to see others who have emerged from the JW hell with a great deal of character and healthy perspectives to share with others.
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On The Art Of Fading
by expatbrit inin october of 2000, i faded away from the watchtower.
like most people, i have family and friends who are jw's (including my wife and parents).
fading is generally the best method for people in that situation.
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blacksheep
Excellent post. Just to reinforce your comments about maintaining a happy, healthy demeanor around JWs: don't underestimate the importance of this. My experience is that JWs generally revel at the problems of non-JWs, ESPECIALLY those who leave. If you give every indication of doing well, they cannot use this card.
A few years back my JW sister even commented, almost in amazement "you're doing so well!" No, since leaving the JWs I didn't become a druggie, a prostitute, a satan worshiper, whatever other horrific profile they'd like to paint leavers of the "truth". She expressed a genuine surprise. One that I hope she thinks about (but am not holding my breath...)
My experience and observation is that they will use ANY opportunity to leverage any bad that happens to you. Obviously, bad things happen to almost everyone, but it's the attitude toward them that's important. Any bitterness and/or regret you show will just be exploited by them.
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Do you still read societys literature?
by haujobbz in.
i still got my insight books,bible,song book,revelation book,isiahia book,some tracts,awakes @watchtowers.
i did throw a lot of my magz away but still got these,what shall i do keep them,sell them to second hand book store,give to charity shop,or read them all again and brainwash myself with jw ideology.
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blacksheep
No--I don't have them around the house. I was raised as a JW, so grew up on them. A few times, when I encountered them in the last few years, I'd try to read through them, just to keep up on what the WTS was saying. And honestly, I found them so hopelessly boring, so sleep-inducing, I couldn't even make it though a few paragraphs. I'm pretty well-read, and honestly, there's something about the WT literature that's strange; I can't quite put my finger on it. But even when I'm trying to understand and nail some silly point they have to make, most of the time I cannot even make it through all their odd jargon and sentence structure to even pinpoint their errors. It's just not worth it. Bad writing is bad writing.
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New Tract-Youths What Will You Do With Your Life
by Scarlet ini was wondering if any of you have read this tract that was given out at the district convention .. i found in this tract they are pushing the fulltime ministry more than ever before.
they in so many words say if you are not a fulltime minister you are not serving god.
it stated that youths today should not strive for academic success.
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blacksheep
I agree with the above post. I have nephews and neices who have been fed the same garbage. I'm REALLY getting to the point that I think that the JWs need a bit more public exposure to what they are pushing, particularly on their young. I remember distinctly getting called into the principle's office as a teen. She wanted to know, in view of my exceptional grades and school record, what plans I had for college, and how she could help me get more involved in school activities to help highlight my skills, etc. Of course, being the good brainwashed dub that I was, I told her I wasn't interested. I cannot recall what EXACTLY I told her, but I know it didn't make the society look as bad for holding me back as it really should have.
I wonder what a few more public statements about their stand on college, further education in general, pursuing careers, shunning, etc., would do. I really don't think the outside world has enough of a picture of what the organization promotes. It's not until you are sucked in (or in my case, raised without a choice about it, and therefore come to view it as a "norm"), that you see what it really teaches.
My belief is that the WTS is very selective in whom and how they push their agendas. I'd like to see some of these messages get a bit more publicity. Any suggestions?
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Would you condone abortion?
by haujobbz intoday i questioned my mother about the fact that she told me ?
yrs ago how she lost 2 kids through a miscarriage but then later told me she aborted them,well i didnt know what to say, but then later questioned her about this i asked her why she did it, she told me that she was already bringing up me and my sister and financialy impossible to look after two more kids,well i didnt agree with that reason or any reason to kill the unborn she then said she wasnt in the truth then "huh what difference does that make".
then she gave an illustration of reasons when you should condone abortion and it goes like this, if you were raped and later found out you were pregnant what would you do she seemed to say she would abort it,i said i wouldnt if that happened to my wife i said i would probably end up having it adopted,after all its better than murder.. how has this affected my familys view on abortion i wonder, well i have 5 sisters and 1 more brother,and already my brother in cold blood made his girlfriend abort hers due to the inconvienience,and also my older sister had hers aborted 2 yrs ago because the father didnt want to know with out a hint of regret,so im now starting to see a pattern in my family,whos to blame them or my mother as a role model.. so to cut a long story short do you think killing an unborn child is murder,would you do it under certain scenarios.
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blacksheep
"why is it being narrow minded to question precious life being destroyed by irresponsible humans."
Hmmm....don't you think your language is a bit LOADED here?? (Sounds straight out of the WT, btw. Their style is unmistakeable).