Posts by slimboyfat

14

G.B.Are they Manipulative Lying S.O.B.`s / Not Genuine in their Beliefs ?

by smiddy3 in

i raise this question for many reasons really ,thinking back on their past history and how they have responded to past failures .that they explain away as human imperfections.. on the one hand they claim to be gods spokesperson on earth .the only true religion god is using to dispense his truths at the proper time.

and that members of the gb are the f&ds class assigned to do this.. or do they deliberately manipulate witnesses vulnerability about world events ,disasters ,earthquakes etc ,to prey on those fears about the gt /armageddon.. that they are constantly warned about .

and that it is impending.. producing videos that show how jw`s will be persecuted round up and imprisoned simply for being a jw .on a worldwide scale .. the bunker video ?.

slimboyfat

I only have to consider my own mind at different times to realise how complicated a question this is. Who is a true believer? Who really has no doubts? In some ways the nature of true belief is to have doubts. Because to take anything seriously involves thinking about it deeply.

Which perhaps raises another question. Are there any on the GB who don’t take it seriously? I don’t think there are real signs of that. (Compare some TV evangelists where the signs are rather obvious) There do seem to be genuine signs of mental fatigue from a couple of members, in particular I think of Loesch and Herd. They no longer appear as confident or enthusiastic as they once did. Their early exuberant support of the organisation and its mission may have mellowed into some form of accommodation rather than outright cynicism.

They all have personal lives, and health issues, and families, and mundane organisational issues and other things that occupy their minds. I would not be surprised if big picture questions about truth and the nature of the religion they oversee is mostly crowded out by other concerns.

One thing I’ve become increasingly aware of is the ability of people to avoid thinking about things that, from the outside, it seems should be a serious concern. People on the whole are not terribly reflective, especially if reflection would interfere with getting on with life in a way they find immediately comfortable.

23

Are the younger generation taking on roles in the Cong?

by purrpurr in

jw
friends

i notice that several of the congs i've been to seem to have a majority of the male roles performed by older men.

very few young men are wanting to be ms or elders etc.

it also seems like very few young people are being pioneers either.. would you agree with this?

slimboyfat

What younger generation? What I see is mostly people who joined around the 1970s who are now in their 60s or 70s. Their children and grandchildren have 80% upwards left, nowhere to be seen, apart from the odd memorial.

58

THIS IS IT Tony Morris Identifies King of Norht

by scotoma in

jw
friends

this is the announcement we have heard “about” but now it has been released to the whole world.

its in the 2nd of a three part serries about the jw annual meeting (oct 2018).

to minute 52. .

slimboyfat

Morris said Russia’s King-of-the-North “allies” cooperated with them in the biggest war games since the Soviet Union. According to this article it was China that joined Russia in war games in 2018.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/asia_pacific/war-games-and-business-deals-russia-china-send-a-signal-to-washington/2018/09/11/35371ff2-b5b9-11e8-a2c5-3187f427e253_story.html?noredirect=on&utm_term=.8cb32dbb8d51

194

Is Being a “Manly Man” a Bad Thing?

by minimus in

jw
friends

so much is said regarding men , in a negative way.

shaving commercials are now lecturing us as to how bad we really are.

men should be less masculine.

slimboyfat

I don’t know where this is all headed.

On a basic level I agree with gender and sexual equality. But at the same time I do wonder if society can function if it hollows out the distinct roles of men and women? I’m not so sure. It’s a very strange world we seem to be heading into, in lots of ways.

It could be it’s a problem without a solution. If we are committed to equality and we also want healthy functioning societies. It could be these goals are incompatible, unfortunately. Then what do we do?

16

Reinstatement

by Pinky in

what questions do the elders ask you when you are in your meeting requesting to get reinstated ?.

slimboyfat

Something to be careful about:

I know brother who got DFed and went through the reinstatement process just to speak to family and for no other reason. He had to attend meetings for about a year and fake genuine obedience to Watchtower to get reinstated. When he was reinstated he didn’t attend another meeting! The elders were so angry that they had been “duped” that they watched this brother for years and got him DFed years later (when he had moved to a different town) for something else.

So if you get reinstated just for family it’s probably best not to rub it in their faces. At least attend the odd meeting afterward and fade. All depending on your ultimate goal, of course, but it’s worth bearing in mind that elders can be vindictive if they think you have “played the system” as they would see it.

25

Does any other denomination change Doctrines as often as JW's?

by TerryWalstrom in

would i err in stating most religions and denominations have set doctrines?and yet, the watchtower's version/rendition of christianity is riven with contradictions which stem from changing predictions, policies, doctrines, and interpretations seemingly adrift from foundation or principle.wouldn't you think the constant upheaval, sifting, churn, and reorganization bespeaks whim, mood, uncertainty, and wilful speculation more than divine guidance?there's something endemically jittery and insecure about this religion which i would opine has more than a little to do with unstable mental affect than mere whimsy.what's your take on this?.

slimboyfat

There is a huge variety of opinion among Seventh Day Adventists on the authority and relevance of the writings of Ellen White. Some hold it up almost like scripture and others don’t look to it at all, with every shade in between. I think the overall trend is away from adherence to Ellen White among Adventists.

By comparison there is little disagreement among JWs about the role and place of Charles Russell, to the extent that JWs are interested in the topic, they tend to accept whatever the latest Watchtower says on the subject. Which incidentally appears to be that Russell was not part of the faithful slave ans doesn’t have any clear role in Bible prophecy.

25

Does any other denomination change Doctrines as often as JW's?

by TerryWalstrom in

would i err in stating most religions and denominations have set doctrines?and yet, the watchtower's version/rendition of christianity is riven with contradictions which stem from changing predictions, policies, doctrines, and interpretations seemingly adrift from foundation or principle.wouldn't you think the constant upheaval, sifting, churn, and reorganization bespeaks whim, mood, uncertainty, and wilful speculation more than divine guidance?there's something endemically jittery and insecure about this religion which i would opine has more than a little to do with unstable mental affect than mere whimsy.what's your take on this?.

slimboyfat

I think a major reason JWs make so many changes is a function of the huge number of dogmatic positions they take, over issues where they really don’t need to take dogmatic positions. It’s just part of JW culture now, to expect, and to receive, official judgements on minute points of Bible interpretation and life issues.

Take Matt 13:32 for example. As I recall the birds in this verse in Watchtower literature used to be agents of Satan. Whereas the latest Watchtower references insist that these birds are in fact rightly disposed humans.

On the other hand I once attended a Christadelphian Bible Study where the speaker suggested that the birds of this verse indicated a corrupting influence, whereas others in the ekklesia said they understood the birds as positive, and indicating the growth of the kingdom. There was open disagreement about the exact meaning, and no need for a dogmatic position to be adopted.

On minor issues like this, most churches simply don’t take a dogmatic position in the first place, so the issue of flip flops doesn’t arise.

So a major reason why JWs have so many flip flops is because they make so many dogmatic pronouncements on so many minor issues.

42

Discontinue unproductive bible study - jw broadcasting

by Gorbatchov in

jw
friends

https://tv.jw.org/#en/mediaitems/latestvideos/pub-ism_2_video.

interesting video explaining how to end a bible study.. watch the kind of uber behaviour of the witnesses: make a choice or we leave.... so hard, so not christian.

no love for the person.. g..

slimboyfat

It’s a bizarre approach, because it’s not like they are overloaded, and have people lining up wanting Bible studies. From what I gather, in the 1970s, leading up to 1975, there was actually a period when JWs had so many Bible studies it probably made sense to prioritise. But now? I think they’re deluding themselves.

Then again, it’s probably not about making the best rational use of time. It’s more about giving JWs a sense of self importance about their ministry. Plus the whole organisation works on the principle of “do more or you are not good enough”, so projecting this attitude toward people who are only at the early stages of entering the movement is a natural extension I suppose.

49

Dilemma of Shunning Policy

by Drearyweather in

apologies if this topic has been discussed earlier.. i was thinking of whether demanding for a ban on shunning policy would be beneficial for the larger society.

following are some things that we need to remember while advocating the issue:.

1. shunning is not limited to jw's and for many americans, it is not that controversial as it seems.. 2. jw shunning is not a dark secret policy.

slimboyfat

Of course dropping shunning would change the organisation dramatically - for the better. The crazier ideas would need to be dropped because they would be exposed to scrutiny. That’s not a threat, it benefits everyone, including the leaders who are probably embarrassed by some of these teachings themselves.

But I think you’re wrong to say it would take a long time to change the shunning culture. Shunning is simply not natural and many JWs would drop it instantly if sanctioned to do so. On the other hand many JWs would continue to have strained family relations inside and outside the religion - as is human nature. They just wouldn’t have the “cover” of disfellowshipping to explain their nasty behaviour any more. Plus there’s also the issue of people who have been shunned for years or decades. Would they forgive JW relatives who now resume contact? That’s a choice individuals would need to make in these complicated situations.

49

Dilemma of Shunning Policy

by Drearyweather in

apologies if this topic has been discussed earlier.. i was thinking of whether demanding for a ban on shunning policy would be beneficial for the larger society.

following are some things that we need to remember while advocating the issue:.

1. shunning is not limited to jw's and for many americans, it is not that controversial as it seems.. 2. jw shunning is not a dark secret policy.

slimboyfat

doubting bro I think it’s pretty easy actually to make the case that organisations that harm the public should not be given tax emeption or charitable status. (We wouldn’t want to support groups that promote self harm for example) That would seem a pretty basic and reasonable requirement for an organisation to receive any sort of support from society.

I also think it’s pretty easy to demonstrate that shunning is a harmful practice. Even Watchtower literature implicitly concedes this point, for instance when it talks frankly about the psychological pressure applied to people who lose all their friends and family. And when it talks about the heartache of disfellowshipping. (Blaming the victim of shunning for the situation, rather than the system of shunning itself of course)