slimboyfat

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Posts by slimboyfat

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  69

  Austria Begins Closing Mosques and Deporting Imams

  by cofty in

  1. social
  2. current

  austria, a member of the eu since 1995, is a country of 8.8 million people with a muslim population of around 600,000 mostly turkish immigrants.

  in 2015 it passed an 'islam law' prohibiting foreign funding of religious groups and creating a duty for muslim organisations to have 'a positive fundamental view towards state and society'.. many mosques in austria have continued to receive money from turkish muslim organisations so the new right-wing government have decided to enforce the law.

  seven mosques have been identified for closure and 60 imams are to be either deported or refused visas.

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  slimboyfat

  Good luck learning proper German from Austrians. ;-)

  My experience of Austrians is that they are a bit insular and have long been, for want of a milder word, just a little bit more racist than we are accustomed to in the United Kingdom. I was told a number of times in the early 2000s by Austrians that, although I was a foreigner, I was an alright foreigner because I’m not dark. (Du bist nicht dunkel) This was stated as a matter of fact without fhe idea that the sentiment should be problematic. So my point is that I don’t think the refugee crisis has changed opinion much in Austria. They were sceptical about refugees from the start.

  As for the Turkish population and mosques and so on. I think it’s just that the Turkish minority has reached a certain level that makes some white Austrians feel uncomfortable, and right wing politicians are exploiting that. From what I’ve seen the Turkish minority is long established and were well on the way to finding their own fit within Austrian society. These laws that target mosques and make them feel unwelcome are not going to help that process. Unfortunately alienation and discord is exactly what the right wing politicians are hoping to achieve. So who knows how this will play out.
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  69

  Austria Begins Closing Mosques and Deporting Imams

  by cofty in

  1. social
  2. current

  austria, a member of the eu since 1995, is a country of 8.8 million people with a muslim population of around 600,000 mostly turkish immigrants.

  in 2015 it passed an 'islam law' prohibiting foreign funding of religious groups and creating a duty for muslim organisations to have 'a positive fundamental view towards state and society'.. many mosques in austria have continued to receive money from turkish muslim organisations so the new right-wing government have decided to enforce the law.

  seven mosques have been identified for closure and 60 imams are to be either deported or refused visas.

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  slimboyfat

  I checked the figure and it’s nearer 7%. I don’t want to fall into the common trap of exaggerating immigrant populations. I never saw any evidence of Turkish extremists in Austria. There may be some, of course.

  Closing down mosques alienates regular Turkish people who thought they were welcome in Austria, to say the obvious.
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  69

  Austria Begins Closing Mosques and Deporting Imams

  by cofty in

  1. social
  2. current

  austria, a member of the eu since 1995, is a country of 8.8 million people with a muslim population of around 600,000 mostly turkish immigrants.

  in 2015 it passed an 'islam law' prohibiting foreign funding of religious groups and creating a duty for muslim organisations to have 'a positive fundamental view towards state and society'.. many mosques in austria have continued to receive money from turkish muslim organisations so the new right-wing government have decided to enforce the law.

  seven mosques have been identified for closure and 60 imams are to be either deported or refused visas.

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  slimboyfat

  What measures do you think would work, SBF?

  The Austrian Turks I met were pretty regular people, not very religious, very “business” oriented, probably a bit more “traditional” in their view of women: basically they don’t like their wives talking to other men, is about as “extreme” as it gets. Where is the evidence of rampant extremism? No doubt there are a few individuals, because there always are. But is it worth alienating nearly 7% of your population over? Unless stigmatisation is actually the goal, not an unfortunate side effect. These measures look as if they are intended to target Turkish Austrians in particular. (Is the Catholic Church banned from sharing resources?) I don’t see how that helps anyone. It’s more likely to turn a few into radicals than it is to solve any problem.

  Left to their own devices Austrian Turks were well on the way to adopting “western” attitudes and behaviour. Now? Who knows!
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  69

  Austria Begins Closing Mosques and Deporting Imams

  by cofty in

  1. social
  2. current

  austria, a member of the eu since 1995, is a country of 8.8 million people with a muslim population of around 600,000 mostly turkish immigrants.

  in 2015 it passed an 'islam law' prohibiting foreign funding of religious groups and creating a duty for muslim organisations to have 'a positive fundamental view towards state and society'.. many mosques in austria have continued to receive money from turkish muslim organisations so the new right-wing government have decided to enforce the law.

  seven mosques have been identified for closure and 60 imams are to be either deported or refused visas.

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  slimboyfat

  Call it what you will; public opinion is different now than it was just a few years ago when Schlager singers were highlighting the plight of these refugees in their music.

  Austrians were never eager to accept Syrian refugees. It was Angela Merkel who invited the refugees to Germany. Austria’s main role in the crisis was to block refugees at the Hungarian border until they recieved assurances from Germany that the refugees would pass through Austria and straight into Germany.

  I should explain I have personal experience of this. I was in Munich in September 2015 when many Germans lined the streets to welcome Syrian immigrants. I was in Vienna Westbahnhof in the same month when they were processing the Syrians coming off the train. There was no one there to welcome them to Austria, to say the least. Austrians have not “lost patience” with refugees because they were never eager to accept them in the first place.
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  69

  Austria Begins Closing Mosques and Deporting Imams

  by cofty in

  1. social
  2. current

  austria, a member of the eu since 1995, is a country of 8.8 million people with a muslim population of around 600,000 mostly turkish immigrants.

  in 2015 it passed an 'islam law' prohibiting foreign funding of religious groups and creating a duty for muslim organisations to have 'a positive fundamental view towards state and society'.. many mosques in austria have continued to receive money from turkish muslim organisations so the new right-wing government have decided to enforce the law.

  seven mosques have been identified for closure and 60 imams are to be either deported or refused visas.

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  slimboyfat

  TD I don’t think the comparison is between the People’s Party and the Nazi party in Austria, rather their junior partner in government the Freedom Party. The Nazi links of the Freedom Party, both personal and ideological, are not difficult to locate. It was founded by a former SS officer.
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  69

  Austria Begins Closing Mosques and Deporting Imams

  by cofty in

  1. social
  2. current

  austria, a member of the eu since 1995, is a country of 8.8 million people with a muslim population of around 600,000 mostly turkish immigrants.

  in 2015 it passed an 'islam law' prohibiting foreign funding of religious groups and creating a duty for muslim organisations to have 'a positive fundamental view towards state and society'.. many mosques in austria have continued to receive money from turkish muslim organisations so the new right-wing government have decided to enforce the law.

  seven mosques have been identified for closure and 60 imams are to be either deported or refused visas.

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  slimboyfat

  TD, Austria is a good civilised country and has accepted many asylum seekers over the years. That’s not my point. You said that both Germany and Austria had both “lost patience” with refugees. I’m pointing out that this description obscures an important difference between Austria and Germany. The difference is that Germany welcomed huge number’s of refugees, often with enthusiasm, during the Syrian refugee crisis. So it perhaps makes sense to describe Germany, or many Germans now “losing patience” with those refugeees. Austria on the other hand never had any enthusiasm for accepting the refugees. They took as few as they could and sent as many as possible on to Germany as fast as they could. So there has not been as dramatic a change of opinion in Austria as there (arguably) has been in Germany. Austrians haven’t lost patience with refugeesa because they never wanted them in the first place.

  Plus as I posted out, the focus of the right wing government in Austria appears to be Austrians with a Turkish background. These are not new arrivals. If anything they are a well assimilated minority. Which makes these developments all the more concerning.
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  69

  Austria Begins Closing Mosques and Deporting Imams

  by cofty in

  1. social
  2. current

  austria, a member of the eu since 1995, is a country of 8.8 million people with a muslim population of around 600,000 mostly turkish immigrants.

  in 2015 it passed an 'islam law' prohibiting foreign funding of religious groups and creating a duty for muslim organisations to have 'a positive fundamental view towards state and society'.. many mosques in austria have continued to receive money from turkish muslim organisations so the new right-wing government have decided to enforce the law.

  seven mosques have been identified for closure and 60 imams are to be either deported or refused visas.

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  slimboyfat

  Patience in both Germany and Austria seems to be running out.

  TD you may know Germany well, but this comment suggests to me you don’t know Austria at all. The attitude toward migrants was very different in Austria than Germany from the start of the refugee crisis. Austria never welcomed migrants open arms in the first place. So to say that both Germany and Austria have “run out of patience” is to musunderstand what is going on in Austria. At best Austria was willing to allow migrants to pass through Austria on their way to Germany. There was little public or political will to welcome them as residents at any stage.

  Turkish people on the other hand have been resident in Austria for decades and generations have been born there. Many have small business or professional training and many are quite secular in outlook. I can’t see any good coming from marginalising or targeting this group of Austrians. They are well on the way to becoming regular, secularised Europeans. If anything this sort of stigmatisation is only likely to alienate and radicalise a few who would otherwise not be bothered. It was the same in Nazi Germany, of course, Hitler chose to stigmatise and target Jews precisely at a time when they were integrating in German society, and posed the least real “threat” to the dominant culture.

  What's really happening here is that a ring wing party has gained influence in Austria and is using its power for the usual ends of right wing politics: marginalisation of minorities at home, and isolationism abroad. You’d think Austria of all places would have learned the lessons, but unfortunately Austria did not learn the lessons of the Nazi period as well as Germany did. Because Austria has tended to understand itself as a victim of Nazi aggression rather than a collaborator and participant. A clear demonstration, if ever one was needed, that an honest recognition of history has important implications for the present.
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  138

  LEAKED: WHQ Accounts: 2016-2020 Budget

  by Fay Dehr in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  leaked: whq accounts: 2016-2020 budget [part 1 of 5] https://youtu.be/g08tw2v3b4s.

  leaked: whq accounts: 2016-2020 budget [part 2 of 5] https://youtu.be/rpceb5v0vbe.

  leaked: whq accounts: 2016-2020 budget [part 3 of 5] https://youtu.be/2xa08ukc_6i.

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  slimboyfat

  Scientology has rich members and are experts at extracting their money.

  Watchtower has poor members and are hopeless at extracting their money.

  For example, in response to an unprecedented appeal for money by Stephen Lett in 2015, where he said WT had an urgent need for extra funds, JWs on average responded by contributing less than $4 extra each. That’s probably less than most people carry in loose change. (Those who still carry change. I do.)
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  138

  LEAKED: WHQ Accounts: 2016-2020 Budget

  by Fay Dehr in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  leaked: whq accounts: 2016-2020 budget [part 1 of 5] https://youtu.be/g08tw2v3b4s.

  leaked: whq accounts: 2016-2020 budget [part 2 of 5] https://youtu.be/rpceb5v0vbe.

  leaked: whq accounts: 2016-2020 budget [part 3 of 5] https://youtu.be/2xa08ukc_6i.

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  slimboyfat

  I like that you’re now calling it an “eminent” collpase by the way, because it will be very auspicious indeed.

  I say we call the WT collapse imminent, eminent and immanent: near, grand, and all encompassing!
• 
  138

  LEAKED: WHQ Accounts: 2016-2020 Budget

  by Fay Dehr in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  leaked: whq accounts: 2016-2020 budget [part 1 of 5] https://youtu.be/g08tw2v3b4s.

  leaked: whq accounts: 2016-2020 budget [part 2 of 5] https://youtu.be/rpceb5v0vbe.

  leaked: whq accounts: 2016-2020 budget [part 3 of 5] https://youtu.be/2xa08ukc_6i.

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  slimboyfat

  You seem to be coming round Morph, slowly but surely. Watchtower is in serious financial trouble and they are trying everything to prevent disaster. If seems doubtful they will succeed, but I am open to any contrary evidence.