If someone has a scan of that JD book, can they post it? -ithinkisee
ithinkisee
JoinedPosts by ithinkisee
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7
Deception defined in new WTS publication
by blondie in*** jd (live with jehovah's day in mind) chap.
9 p. 115 par.
9 dealing with others as god desires ***.
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I Figured Out The Easiest Way To Expose Jehovah's Witnesses!!!!
by minimus injust say the truth.
don't embellish.
just give the facts to people.....for example, tell people that jws don't think it's wrong to actually lie if they believe that telling the truth to a person could hurt them.
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ithinkisee
Some JWs like to tell ex-JWs that the Society has never said in print to shun people who just leave.
This is true, but tell that person the moment you try to put up Xmas lights and two JWs see it, you can be disfellowshipped, and then the shunning occurs.
-ithinkisee -
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For women: your view of strip clubs
by Paralipomenon ini have heard two vastly differing viewpoints on this subject over the years.
regarding your significant other, would you care if they went to a strip club or not?
some examples: .
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ithinkisee
I don't see a problem with a night out on a milestone birthday or bachelor party. But I don't get the guys that make it their regular weekend hangout. Seems so empty and vapid. Just my opinion though.
-ithinkisee -
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My Letter of Disassoc-part 3 elders are after me
by love2Bworldly inany comments?
i'm thinking of mailing this letter.. .
march 13, 2007. to west c elders of jehovahs witnesses religion:.
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ithinkisee
I agree with sinis.
If they don't know you anyways, a letter like that is just gonna come across as a crazy woman from out of town.
Make them waste their time - because it's the last thing they want to do.
-ithinkisee -
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ithinkisee
bttt ... for lurkers
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Those raised as JWs-Do you recall the path of doubts that led you to leave?
by ithinkisee ini posted a similar topic a year and a half ago.
i thought with all the new people it would be interesting to ask it again.
so i began to research ... and here i am.
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ithinkisee
Another doubt I remembered the other day:
We would always read the scripture in Revelation about "a Great Crowd that no man was able to number, out of every tribe nation people and tongue.".
I remember thinking SEVERAL times, "If it is a great crowd no man is able to number, then why do we have these extensive reports every year in the Jan 1 WT? Why do we obsess about attendance figures and baptism figures?"
-ithinkisee -
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Update- My fade and the elders inaction
by OnTheWayOut inhere's the story in a nutshell.
i stepped aside as elder in a foreign language congregation with a resignation letter in august.. i cited doubts in doctrine concerning "this generation" and 1975, and also said i don't "know".
the governing body well enough to teach their doctrine.
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ithinkisee
It wouldn't surprise me that Bethel tells COs to not even bother with people like you and leave that to the elders to deal with. My guess is they don't want COs to wake up and smell the coffee either.
Like everything else, they dump it on the elders who are on the frontline.
I have no proof. Just a hunch.
As a side note (and I may have missed this):
If you want to fade, why are you so obsessed with the elders talking to you. Seems like a showdown would negate your fade. Wouldn't it?
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49
Those raised as JWs-Do you recall the path of doubts that led you to leave?
by ithinkisee ini posted a similar topic a year and a half ago.
i thought with all the new people it would be interesting to ask it again.
so i began to research ... and here i am.
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ithinkisee
I posted a similar topic a year and a half ago. I thought with all the new people it would be interesting to ask it again. I'll start with mine:
Doubts as a child:
- Warnings in the literature that the "the devil transforms himself into an angel of light" and can appear like the truth. I used to think - "well, that might mean Satan could be posing as Jehovah's Witnesses too."
- The age-old fallacy: How do we know the Bible is from God? Because it says so in the Bible! (I didn't even know what fallacies were back then ...)
- Birthdays and minor holidays like mothers day, fathers day, etc. I had a hard time finding the evil in them.
- Beards too. I would ask myself "if it really is a conscience matter why do they make people with beards feel like crap?"
- My mom and the congregation telling me my dad is really Satan trying to turn me away from Jehovah.
- Constant pressure to conform by using guilt. I remember thinking when they read scriptures about how we serve out of "love for our creator" that I did not feel that. It was just because I felt guilty I wasn't doing what they said I was "supposed" to be doing.
Doubts While at Bethel (19 yrs old):
- General obsession with money and position by almost all at Bethel - especially the higher-up ones.
- The Society's fascination with their buildings, and their constant bragging about them (anyone who has been on a Bethel tour knows what I am talking about) When my non-JW dad toured bethel while I was there he remarked how proud they seem to be of their g*ddamned elevators.
- The creature worship of the Governing Body by Bethelites and visitors..
- You move move ahead ENTIRELY by who you know and who you make alliances with.
- Very high up and longtime brothers at Bethel who seemed very unhappy - and downright rude and mean.
- Told by a brother in writing department under his breath, that they had a UN membership and would go to the UN to research - trying to identify the King of the North - and to listen in on meetings to see if anything would tip them off to the Great Tribulation.
- Told by a brother in Writing Dept that the reason they came out with another Creation book so soon after the other one was because they were threatened with lawsuits because of the misquotes.
- Learning from brothers in writing and service departments that often the articles written in the magazines and talks at the conventions are meant to address specific problems - and the problem isn't usually readily apparent in the title or general subject of the talk/article.
Doubts After Bethel. Married - Without Kids:
- Going out in service and meeting a pastor at the door. He calmly set us down and did some "seed-planting", methodically showing me and my wife how the New World Translation twisted texts to fit their doctrine by blatantly adding to scripture (or leaving stuff out). Rendering the same word differently in different places. His final words to me were - "If you don't listen to ANYTHING I tell you, listen to this - PLEASE go back and study the original Greek."
- Generation change in 1995,1996. This is the main thing that HAD kept me going in the truth - based on the Awake! masthead - a promise from Jehovah. A prophesy from the Society in Jehovah's name. Once they admitted they were wrong on this - I thought to myself - they could be wrong on everything! I realized at that moment I would die in this system. I lamented not going to college.
- My parents divorce - my dad had an "apostate" lawyer. This apostate lawyer (I now realize in hindsight) also used this opportunity as seed-planting. He basically went through the entire range of JW teachings - with the apostate slant - in the court papers. Our whole family read these papers. These affected me greatly, and certain points from these papers would come back to haunt me from time to time.
- Also during my parents divorce, the Society provided us with a booklet that detailed "How" to respond to questioning in court. I remember being a little disturbed at how the responses we were to give weren't entirely truthful.
- About the same time as the divorce I started going to college (now that the Society had given the OK). One of the first classes I took was called "Logic and Reasoning". We spent the whole semester learning about logical fallacies. Over the years I began to identify them in the Society's literature.
- A bible study my wife and I conducted with a young, but very Christian family. The husband - very nice and sincere - said that with all honesty that he could (and had) read the entire New Testament (multiple times) and felt that the Trinity was very clearly taught in scripture. I was annoyed with him because I took the WT line that "anyone who reads the bible with an open mind could not POSSIBLY come to the conclusion that Jesus was God. (This reminded me of the old pastor encouraging me to study the original Greek.)
- Off and on I would make lists of things that bothered me I wanted to research. For various reasons (WT scant revealing of quotes, date inconsistencies I blamed on myself being unable to figure out, feelings of guilt that I was being presumptuous or nitpicking) I gave up. This happened probably a dozen times.
After Bethel & Married - With Kids:
- The "Generation change" continued to gnaw at me.
- Wife pregnant with first child. Was not fully convinced in my mind that "no blood" was something I wanted to commit to. She had to actually break the ice with the doctor regarding the blood issue. I couldn't bring myself to do it.
- UN Scandal. Came across my Google News feed - the UK Guardian article. I remembered my old friend in the Writing Dept telling me about this when I was a Bethelite in the early 90's.
- Pedophile scandal. NBC Dateline Story and I was struck by how no JWs wanted to talk about it.
- Recognizing more faulty reasoning in the magazines - fallacies.
- Increasing frequency of Circuit Overseers (in the congregation) and Bethel speakers (at assemblies) saying, "Even if what the Faithful Discreet Slave says does not make a bit of sense to you, just DO WHAT THEY SAY. THEY are the CHOSEN channel."
- A bethel speaker at an assembly said, "Apostates and other opposers of truth will attempt to use LOGIC to persuade you that this isn't the Truth."
- More and more articles, and talks from CO's encouraged getting baptized very young. Without saying a SPECIFIC AGE - they still said if a kid is in high school, they should have been baptized. I felt this is wrong - and even voiced as much to my wife. Baptism talks always state that "this is one of the most important decisions in your life". If that is so, and they are old enough to make a decision that affects their whole life - then they should also be able to get married, and make many other life-altering decisions. To me it felt like recruitement - "Get em while they're young and lock em in so that if they leave they would also lose their whole family."
- My oldest daughter got to school age and my own feelings as a child of not eating a cupcake on the day of someone's birthday came flooding back to me. I began to regret what my daughter was going to have to go through in school.
- Off and on I would make lists of things that bothered me I wanted to research. For various reasons (WT scant revealing of quotes, date inconsistencies I blamed on myself being unable to figure out, feelings of guilt that I was being presumptuous or nitpicking) I gave up.
- Spending money and time we didn't have to spend a weekend at the assembly, and walking away from the assembly feeling guilty that I wasn't doing enough. Also feeling guilty because I wanted to better myself or make more money or pursue a hobby. General feelings of guilt and getting tired of feeling guilty for things I didn't feel were wrong.
- 10-year wedding anniversary was 6 months away. I realized that my doubts had gradually increased over the years to the point that my wife and I would not talk about longer-term goals for our family. Our communication got less and less - and in fact, probably never really was. I looked back over the past ten years and really examined what it was that caused the communication rift. It was my doubts. Plain and simple. I did not want our next ten years to lack this kind of communication.
- So I began to research ... and here I am.
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Told wife that I don't like going to the meeting
by XBEHERE infinally said it out loud even though my actions have been showing it for quite some time.
a fight ensued and now she isn't talking to me.
the wierd thing is when i just didnt go she didn't say much (she hasn't been for over 2 mos for a medical reason) but god forbid i should actually vocalize that i don't want to go... i didn't want to give her any fuel to call me an apostate so i just blamed discouragement and my dislike of the elders which she already knows.
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ithinkisee
The WT is right about one thing, the more you miss the easier it gets to keep missing them. They claim its satanic or worldly influence but in reality the meetings just completely suck!
Yeah, it's called "unplugging from the Matrix". Heh.
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Christian Congregation of Jehovah's Witnesses??? huh?
by cultswatter indoes christian congregation of jehovah's witnesses = watch tower bible & tract society?.
i have noticed more and more boe letters and congregational letters that are written by the "christian congregation of jehovah's witnesses".
letters from the society are supposed to come from the watch tower bible & tract society.
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ithinkisee
All the JW-owned Convention Sites are now called "Christian Convention Centers".
It works the same way with Mormons. They want people to believe they are Christian so they call themselves:Church of JESUS CHRIST of Latter Day Saints.
It's all in the marketing.
-ithinkisee