Check_Your_Premises

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Posts by Check_Your_Premises

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  22

  Those married to "still in" JWs

  by NikL in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  kind of got into it with my jw wife last night for the first time in a long time.. i try to not engage in conversations about doctrinal matters unless she asks me which she did.. anyway, i wont go into details but of course i am "not going to change her mind" and "why is it that you can't see when very smart people can?

  " yada yada yada.

  you probably can imagine.. it makes me so depressed.

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  Check_Your_Premises

  Cant say much that hasnt already been said. Just keep trying to build up every other part o your relationship and try to cultivate an attitude that it is no skin off your as if she is a jw. Any energy on your part that is against her faith in jw feeds it. Leave her to the burdensome life without any persecution complex. And just be friend. Hang in there
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  5

  What is in a name - God is Love

  by Check_Your_Premises in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  during my time dealing with the jw, i was always a bit annoyed by the whole "use god's name" thing.. one day i asked somebody the following:.

  "if i murder and torture a child, and claim to do it in jehovah's name, who did i serve.

  if i rescue, comfort, and help heal the same, and claim to do it in the name of satan, who then did i serve?".

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  Check_Your_Premises

  "A lot of people think that they are the "lovingest" people on earth. But ask their neighbors, wives etc you get a different story. "

  Ha! ain't that the truth. Well I specified that a person be about love, not merely be convinced of the fact.

  Why do I think Christ died? Because He loves us. He did it because we are helpless in our fallen state. He died so we could be made right with God.

  In the Christian faith being outside the kingdom is described as an eternal separation from God. What exactly that means, or who is to brought into that eternal separation, or what exactly is the criteria is not for me to know.
  
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  5

  What is in a name - God is Love

  by Check_Your_Premises in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  during my time dealing with the jw, i was always a bit annoyed by the whole "use god's name" thing.. one day i asked somebody the following:.

  "if i murder and torture a child, and claim to do it in jehovah's name, who did i serve.

  if i rescue, comfort, and help heal the same, and claim to do it in the name of satan, who then did i serve?".

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  Check_Your_Premises

  During my time dealing with the JW, I was always a bit annoyed by the whole "use God's name" thing.

  One day I asked somebody the following:

  "If I murder and torture a child, and claim to do it in Jehovah's name, who did I serve. If I rescue, comfort, and help heal the same, and claim to do it in the name of Satan, who then did I serve?"

  I hadn't thought a lot about that topic, until a few months back I heard a Christian witnessing to a Hindu. He was quoting the scripture, Acts 4:12:

  Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.
  

  I found myself getting annoyed again. I am a Christian myself, but I have come to resent those who try to reduce faith and salvation to a punch list of rituals of do's and dont's and checklists. God is not a formula, and neither is our relationship with Him.

  But I thought more about what that means. What is God. What is His name, his meaning. I also thought about our secular culture, and atheists who see Christians as harsh, judgy, caricatures of John Lithgow trying to keep Kevin Bacon from dancing.

  Really, I think, all you gotta know is that God is Love. (1st John 4:7-8) to the extent that what you do and say and put out to the world is about love, then you are in His service. Suppose you cannot stomach the idea that there is an all powerful mind in control of the universe, you still can be all about love. To me that atheist would be a better Christian than I have been all to often.

  I also found thinking of God this way gave me a new appreciation for Him and why my relationship with Him is so important. Why I want to be a Christian. Why I want to serve Him. He is Love. Truly there is no other thing under heaven that can save us.
  

  And you can extend that to all faith. If your behavior, that you think is grounded in your faith, is not coming from love, then you are doing it wrong.

  Love you all.

  CYP
  
  
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  12

  Heartbroken...advice please

  by SPARKLEY in

  1. social
  2. relationships

  i am a non-jw and have been in an unhappy marriage for a few years now.

  i met a nice man at work, we had a laugh together and got to know each other.

  we were both really attracted to each other.

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  Check_Your_Premises

  Sorry you have had this painful experience.

  I guess the answer you are looking for, is if this is a JW type behavior. I don't know. Hard to say. He may have some conflicting guilt over the things he has done on impulse maybe, and the behavior you see is a reaction to that.

  Probably would be overthinking it.

  It is very difficult to be in a relationship with a JW, even one who is "out" because they carry many of the same ways of thinking at behavior.

  So I guess I would chalk it up to good luck that you found out about this guy sooner than later.

  Dating is tough, and can be painful. Protect your heart dear. Remember this pain, and learn from it, so you don't repeat it. Take care.
  
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  51

  Your Opinion Pleeease

  by thankyou in

  1. social
  2. relationships

  jw girl non-jw guy.

  tenuous boyfriend-girlfriend relationship.

  what is more likely to strengthen a relationship?.

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  Check_Your_Premises

  thank you,

  One of Ben Stein's rules for ruining your life:

  "Become involved with someone with lot's of emotional problems and think you can fix them by nagging"

  Ok. Don't say I didn't warn you.

  Since you are likely to proceed despite all the warnings you have been given, you might as well do it properly.

  You have two choices:

  1. Become a dub
  2. Get her to leave the dubs

  Since the JW are widely accepted to be a cult by experts in the field (ex moonie and cult expert Steven Hassan), I would prefer you got her to leave.

  So how to proceed. First off, I would put romance out of your head. It isn't happening anyway. Just concentrate on being a good friend. She has given you a pretty definitive no go there. So at this point if you continue to pursue her romantically you are being a creepy bastard with obsessive-stalker tendencies. A great idea would be for you to move on romantically. It will put her at ease keeping you as a friend, get her off your mind in that way, and who knows... the law of supply and demand dictates that making yourself more scarce will elevate your value in her eyes... (presuming of course that she had any demand for you to begin with)

  So now that you have accepted that you are in the friend zone, cuz brother, trust me you are, you can proceed as one.

  My bonafides... (AKA why I can say I know what I am talking about) I had a wife join the JW, and through the help of the folks here I was able to stay out of the way long enough for her to find her way out.

  I recommend reading up on how to best proceed in helping someone exit a cult. The aforementioned Steve Hassan has some excellent books on the subject. His latest is book is Freedom of Mind. I can't speak to it since I haven't read it.

  I read Releasing the Bonds and the originally published Combatting Cult Mind Control. In my opinion Combatting was most helpful for me. I hear he has an updated version of that book that specifically addresses growing up in cults and even the JW specifically.

  Learn about cults, help her get in touch with her authentic personality (she has been imprinted with a false JW one) and through care and patience she might see her way out... and she still might not like you.

  Good luck. Seriously. I hope it all works out.

  CYP
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  26

  When does it end? My marriage is 90% great for the most part, except when it come to this cult

  by goingthruthemotions in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  i know marriage is tough and it takes work on both parts.

  we have been together for 27 years.

  the last eight have been involved with this cult.

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  Check_Your_Premises

  I was an unbelieving mate for several years. We are now both happy and JW free!!!

  Don't let them conflate your love for each other with love of the org.

  Keep showing her in every way you can, that you love her; In or out.

  Nothing will ever change that.

  Make sure she knows you will respect her; in or out. Don't let them put you at odds. If a wife senses you have a problem with her because of her decision to be in the org, expect her to dig in. If you have no issue, she can be at ease. Do everything you can to cultivate a mindset that you are at peace with her as a JW, and love her all the same.

  The hardest thing will be the children. The desire to keep the org from getting their hooks into them will give you a sense of urgency and make you want to fight. Don't. You will be better positioned to help the kids IN THE HOME. For a whole range of reasons not even related to the WT. Imagine your wife's new JW husband and the influence they will have with your kids. Don't let that happen.

  I can talk more about how to be OK with a JW wife with respect to the kids. You just have to cover a lot of bases.

  Let her see that you won't grow horns, go crazy, get killed by Jehovah for leaving.

  Love love and love. All you need is love.

  Then if she trusts you, and feels safe with you, at some point she may be willing to discuss your feelings about the WT and why you left.
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  14

  41 Theses on Blood: My "best of" questions/arguments on JW Blood Ban

  by Check_Your_Premises in

  1. watchtower
  2. medical

  on the earth you should pour it out as water.. from these verses it is clear that there is an old testament prohibition against eating blood.

  if not, why do you think it is sacred?

  so whenever a person took the life of an animal, they were to drain the blood and not drink it because the blood represents the life and not theirs to take without god's permission.

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  Check_Your_Premises

  I am proudly oblivious to any changes in the blood doctrine in the last 6 or 7 years.

  Just curious... Does this thing still hold up?

  I thumped a PO and his snooty, know-it-all wife with it a few years back. Thought I might dust it off.

  Thought it might help my son see that maybe, just maybe, the JW aren't "right about everything"
  

  Sorry it is so long.
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  22

  Years ago son raised a few years as a JW. Now struggles with depression

  by Check_Your_Premises in

  1. social
  2. family

  background:.

  i spent some time here awhile back as an unbelieving mate of a jw wife.

  i learned a lot, and was able to be supportive and understanding when she decided to leave the jw.. unfortunately, my son seems to have internalized many of the jw teachings.

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  Check_Your_Premises

  All,

  Thanks so much for the tips, advice, and support.

  Ughhhhh,

  Your name says it all. So sorry man. Been there.

  CYP
  
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  22

  Years ago son raised a few years as a JW. Now struggles with depression

  by Check_Your_Premises in

  1. social
  2. family

  background:.

  i spent some time here awhile back as an unbelieving mate of a jw wife.

  i learned a lot, and was able to be supportive and understanding when she decided to leave the jw.. unfortunately, my son seems to have internalized many of the jw teachings.

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  Check_Your_Premises

  Hey Carla. Yes I remember you. I remember Blondie and Talesin and Wasa, and I think Zeb. You all mean so much to me, for all the help you gave during my times of angst. Hope everyone is doing fine.

  He would have been actively attending from about 2003 to about 2005. So that would be from the ages of about 8 to 10.

  After that we had an arrangement where he would go to my church half time, and to the KH half time. After about 2005, field service was strictly optional for him as were holidays.

  My wife wandered away about 2007 or 2008?

  He has other family that is in. In particular an uncle he is very close to.

  I think he would be open to looking into some information. Like I said, he was never very involved, and does not choose it now for himself even though he is completely free to do so.

  My wife and I discussed it, and we think it would be better if she approaches him. I was always seen as the outside, resisting, unbelieving mate. I am beginning to introduce her to Hassan's approach, so that she can proceed in a well informed way.

  I am not sure how opposed he is to new info. If anything else it would be a matter of getting him to take the time, and to talk to us about it. But once I realized that this was a real problem for him, I began to approach cautiously so as to not trigger his cult personality.

  I appreciate everyone's thoughts and input. Thanks so much.
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  22

  Years ago son raised a few years as a JW. Now struggles with depression

  by Check_Your_Premises in

  1. social
  2. family

  background:.

  i spent some time here awhile back as an unbelieving mate of a jw wife.

  i learned a lot, and was able to be supportive and understanding when she decided to leave the jw.. unfortunately, my son seems to have internalized many of the jw teachings.

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  Check_Your_Premises

  We have been to a doctor/meds for YEARS. NOTHING seems to help. At best it only stabilizes the situation. I think as is commonly the case, many doctors don't understand or know how to diagnose the source as cult indoctrination.

  It was only recently that HE pointed to the JW as a source of his angst.

  I am very well versed in talking to people with a cult mindset. I lived it for about 4 years with my wife. It is actually almost second nature to me.

  I recently found an article on religious trauma syndrome that caught my eye. I would say the author has an anti-religious bias which tends to make her appear to not always argue in good faith. Nevertheless this little snippet rang quite true:

  Mistaken Identity

  Religious Trauma Syndrome mimics the symptoms of many other disorders –

  • post-traumatic stress disorder
  • clinical depression
  • anxiety disorders
  • bipolar disorder
  • obsessive compulsive disorder
  • borderline personality disorder
  • eating disorders
  • social disorders
  • marital and sexual dysfunctions
  • suicide
  • drug and alcohol abuse
  • extreme antisocial behavior, including homicide