Posts by bennyk

80

The real impact of "apostate" sites

by dozy in

in a recent discussion with a couple of district overseers and other heavies , the topic of the internet and apostate sites came up.

i asked what impact these were making , numerically , among jws.

the prevailing view was that , numerically , there was negligible impact.

bennyk

I agree that most only find the "apostate" websites AFTER they have already come to have serious doubts regarding the Organisation's claims and teachings. That the percentage of those DF'd for "apostasy" may seem unchanged (even if accurate [which I doubt]) does not take into consideration faders, nor those who are already secretly "apostate" (per WTS definition), but who are now caught in a moral lapse and officially ousted for reasons other than "Apostasy". The fact that the numbers of new converts in nations which are heavily internet-connected appear to be nearly uniformly DOWN suggests that the internet is having a significant effect on recruitment, which will bear its fruit over the long run.

I think it is also important to consider the effect on the "walk-away believers". In the past, many who left because of the stress of the Witness lifestyle, or the lack of love in the congregations, continued to believe that the Organisation was nevertheless correct. Even those who had been DF'd often felt they had been rightfully expelled (AKA "penance syndrome") and would sometimes encourage other individuals on the fringes of the Organisation to remain with the WTS. "I know it's the right religion, and someday I'll return; I just have to get some things straightened out first..." (I personally know some who engaged in informal witnessing while outside the fold.) No longer. Now once they're outside, they find it as an opportunity to investigate various facets of the religion, and those who do NEVER (TRULY) return. Furthermore, walk-away believers seldom had reason to be very vocal, even about such things as the shunning. Many "apostates" today may not be screaming it from the rooftops, but they are fighting to get their relatives and friends out. And the Internet has given them the ammunition to do so.

Perhaps the Internet may appear to be having only a small impact, but it is achieving results on a number of fronts, and the effects are beginning to "snowball".

15

Mennonite article on JW site

by undercover in

the article about the mennonite family becoming jws is on the main page of the wts website.. http://watchtower.org/library/w/2005/9/1/article_01.htm.

in the course of the article they give a little history of the sect but the juicy parts that would interest most of us here in "apostate land" are in the second half of the article.

some snippets:.

bennyk

The Old Colony Mennonites do shun in the manner that the article describes. Many other affiliations of Mennonites do not, and it also often varies from congregation to congregation within a given affiliation, because Mennonites have congregational church government, rather than an hierarchy over an entire affiliation. So there is nothing inherently suspicious (in and of itself) in the article. (Hats are probably especially tasty with mustard.)

However, it is exceedingly ironic that the article just as easily could have been written regarding JW's who consider leaving or do leave the Witness "fold". Maybe I was an Old Colony Mennonite all those fun-filled years...

2

Earthly Temple always to 1 high priest in DA heavens

by Sherwood in

once upon a time, jehovah god created adam and tested his perfect flesh, mind and heart as the first human regarding the spirit he would manifest, the soul he would become.

adam had the potential to be the father of mankind on earth for all eternity.

adam sinned in paradise on earth by being disobedient to jehovah gods rule (thus sovereignty) and lost that potential.

bennyk

The naos itself is specifically stated to be in Heaven in Rev. 11:19; 14:17; and 15:5.

The "Great Crowd" is in the naos (en to nao) according to Rev. 7:15.

Ergo, the "Great Crowd" serves in Heaven.

23

Possible New news

by why144000 in

jw
friends

there has been a lot of discussion regarding some 'news' to be released later in the year.

i have no inside whispers however i think that, if something new happens, it will be in regard to 'faders'.

many of us have faded and not attended meetings for some time.

bennyk

From a discussion regarding the possibility of DA'ing "faders", somewhat more than one year ago (16. June 2005):

The WTS is caught between the Devil and the Deep Blue Sea.
The congregations are filled with the weak and inactive. It may be that the GB fears that the level of apathy is reaching critical mass. JW culture is changing and it is becoming socially acceptable to ignore the shrill and strident calls for conformity and obedience. The Org may be willing to do a bit of pruning to preserve the hard-core elements from the erosive effects of the inactive and the faders. Following the debacle of 1975, the WTS lost many adherents, but these were soon replaced by new and significant growth. They may risk such a move (DA-ing faders) with a view to long-term potential for increase.
On the other hand, many less-than-zealous Witnesses remain only to preserve relationships with family and friends, or because they have no support network outside the Organisation. The GB must know this. If the WTS "offs" too many, they will inadvertently create such a support network. Watch the dam burst and the reservoir empty...

36

18,136 More Publishers in March

by Joker10 in

jw
friends

the march service report shows 1,010,868 publishers.

that is 18,136 more than the same month last year.

with the exception of the month of august, this is also the most number of publishers reporting for any other month, ever.

bennyk

My honest response to your statement is:

"Here is proof that they are fudging the numbers."

28

Comments You Will Not Hear at the 6-25-06 WT Study (Survival)

by blondie in

who do the sons and daughter-in-laws represent (did they have children before the flood)?.

what does the ark represent?.

(2 peter 2:5) the true god gave righteous noah explicit instructions on how to build an ark for the preservation of life through a global flood.

bennyk

Witnesses manifest such qualities as love, peace, kindness, goodness, mildness, and self-control because they are led by God's holy spirit. (Galatians 5:22-25) (paragraph 6)

Perhaps the WTS could revisit this statement in light of Romans 8:14-17. (?)

This was interesting, also:

the cities of refuge in ancient Israel provided protection for the unintentional manslayer only if he first fled to such a city and then remained inside it until the death of the high priest. (Numbers 35:11-32) (paragraph 11)

Are we actually inside Jehovah's arrangement of spiritual protection? (paragraph 12)

The August 1934 Watchtowers defined the "Cities of Refuge" as the Organisation. Russell had stated (WT 15. Oct. 1907, reprint p. 4079) that the anti-typical "Cities of Refuge" were Christ Jesus. Russell taught that Jesus was important; Rutherford replaced Jesus with the "Theocracy".

32

How many times does "Jehovah" spuriously appear in the NT?

by AuldSoul in

we've all heard it, i'm sure.

"well, the nwt has restored the name jehovah where it should have been to start with.

" ever wanted to slap that smugness with an unarguable fact?

bennyk

Two points:

The 01. Dec. 2004 [?] Watchtower made reference to Jason BeDuhn's book Truth in Translation &c, which they claimed gave a favourable review of the New World Translation. And it did. However, in the Appendix it also included a (scathing) consideration of the interpolation of the word "Jehovah" in the New Testament. I guess the Society's scholars didn't read to the end of the book...

The Society also admitted to altering the New Testament. The Forward of the 1981 Englisch Edition of the New World Translation states on page 6: "An effort was put forth to bring about even greater consistency in the renderings of the related parts of the Holy Scriptures, such as in harmonizing with the original Hebrew readings the readings of quotations made in the Christian Greek Scriptures." This despite the fact that such quotations are often demonstrably taken verbatim from the Septuaginta -- NOT from the Hebrew text of the Old Testament.

11

Would the Watchtower have 'self destructed' if 1914 had been peaceful?

by AK - Jeff in

another thread sparked this one.. if 1914 had come and gone without the advent of wwi, would the sect of bible students have just faded into the woodwork?.

was the war [obviously heavily referenced as proof of their claims] the bouy that allowed and spurned the growth into what we see today?.

jeff .

bennyk

Would the Watchtower have 'self destructed' if 1914 had been peaceful?

I think not. In 15. December 1913 Watch Tower, Russell republished an article from 1907 entitled "KNOWLEDGE AND FAITH REGARDING CHRONOLOGY which stated:

If our chronology is not reliable we have no idea where we are nor when the morning will come. Bishop Ussher's chronology, as we have pointed out (DAWN II., p. 51) puts the end of six thousand years nearly a century future and would destroy every prophetic application as we have seen and profited by it.

But let us suppose a case far from our expectations: Suppose that A.D. 1915 should pass with the world's affairs all serene and with evidence that the "very elect" had not all been "changed" and without the restoration of natural Israel to favor under the New Covenant. (Romans 11:12,15) What then? Would not that prove our chronology wrong? Yes, surely! And would not that prove a keen disappointment? Indeed it would! It would work irreparable wreck to the Parallel dispensations and Israel's Double, and to the Jubilee calculations, and to the prophecy of the 2300 days of Daniel, and to the epoch called "Gentile Times," and to the 1260, 1290 and 1335 days, the latter of which marking the beginning of the Harvest so well fulfilled its prediction, "Oh, the blessedness of him that waiteth and cometh unto the 1335 days!"

True: the world's affairs did not remain "serene". But there was no "Rapture", nor was Israel"restored" (especially not under the New Covenant). Despite the fact that this ' worked irreparable wreck to the epoch called the "Gentile Times" ', the WTS did not collapse, and the Society to this day points to Russell's prediction regarding the Gentile Times ending in October 1914 AS THOUGH IT WERE TRUE.

68

Sorry, another 607 question? I'm confused.

by lost_light06 in

im trying to figure something out concerning the wts 607-1914 chronology that has me confused.

i thought they based the chronology on when jerusalem was destroyed.

however, the following is taken from the daniel book and it seems to base it on something else.

bennyk

That's how we arrive at 607 a the correct date, because even historians acknowledge that the exile lasted 70 years and ended in 537.

Really? What historians?

Not Josephus. The SEVENTY years of SERVITUDE (Antiquities 11:1:1) run from 609 B.C.E. (following the Assyrian Empire's crushing defeat at Haran and the subsequent vassalage of Judea to Babylon) until 539 B.C.E. (when Babylon itself was defeated). The FIFTY years of DESOLATION for the Temple (Apion 1:21) run from 587 B.C.E. (when Jerusalem and its Temple were destroyed) until 537 B.C.E. (when the foundations of the Temple were laid [second year of Cyrus]). The accounts in Josephus indicate that the temple (and Jerusalem) lay desolate FIFTY years (Apion 1:21), which fifty years were a part of the SEVENTY years of SERVITUDE (Antiquities 11:1:1). Apion 1:19 does NOT contradict this; it confirms that the fifty year's period of desolation occurred "during the interval of seventy years". The several deportations occurred at various times during the seventy years, but the SERVITUDE of Judea as a nation need not begin with any of the deportations as recorded in the Bible. The prophecies as recorded in Jeremiah do not even require deportation and exile at all: cf. Jer. 27:7,8,11-13,17; 38:17,18

The WTS' chronology is wrong not only because Jerusalem fell in 587 B.C.E., but more importantly, because Daniel chap. 4 has nothing to do with foreshadowing the Messianic Kingdom. See also Luke 21:8.

One might also add that the events predicted by Russell for 1914 (see Studies in the Scriptures, vol. II "The Time is at Hand" pp.76-78) did not occur, proving C. T. Russell a FALSE PROPHET (Deut. 18:20-22).

55

Hemoglobin-Based Oxygen Carriers - August 2006 Awake!

by AnnOMaly in

i think this is the first clear, official statement regarding hemoglobin-based products.

awake!

august 2006, front page title "blood: why so valuable?".

bennyk

However, compared with other blood fractions, the HBOC presents more challenges to conscientious Christians, who seek to obey God's law on blood. Why?

That's what I'd like to know. I fail to see why this is more of a challenge to consciencious Christians, compared to other blood fractions. After all, the other fractions are likewise "derived from blood".

One, the HBOC carries out the key function of a primary component of blood, the red cells.

Of course. That is what makes it useful as a medical therapy. Is this the old "Alternative Service" rejection theory back to haunt the WTS adherents?

Two, hemoglobin from which the HBOC is derived, makes up a significant portion of that component.

Where would one find scriptural evidence that the Biblical prohibition against EATING blood need somehow be dissected by such terms as significant/minor, whole/component, etc.? Or even that it applies to TRANSFUSIONS?

These Pharisees make me nauseous.