SBF- thanks for the link. The information is fairly general, so does not really present any solid conclusions. It is interesting to see that the growth of Mormons has not collapsed as much as JWs. Although their beliefs seem crazier than JWs, (although the "never die" teaching of JWs is crazy with far greater ramifications) they are more integrated into society, which seems to go a long way in those involved being content not to look elsewhere.
jwfacts
JoinedPosts by jwfacts
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49
The Internet is worse for the Watchtower than 1975 was: here's proof.
by ILoveTTATT2 ini am translating jwfacts to spanish.
i am doing the "statistics" section.here are two graphs that show that the statistics have never been worse for the watchtower:quantity of hours required for 1 baptism: note how low it went in 1974-1975, and note that 2016 is much higher than the slump of 1978... about double, to be exact.
2016 was a historical record in this statistic (higher is worse for watchtower).. this stat is the baptisms as a percentage of the publisher average.
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49
The Internet is worse for the Watchtower than 1975 was: here's proof.
by ILoveTTATT2 ini am translating jwfacts to spanish.
i am doing the "statistics" section.here are two graphs that show that the statistics have never been worse for the watchtower:quantity of hours required for 1 baptism: note how low it went in 1974-1975, and note that 2016 is much higher than the slump of 1978... about double, to be exact.
2016 was a historical record in this statistic (higher is worse for watchtower).. this stat is the baptisms as a percentage of the publisher average.
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jwfacts
Pornography
I am surprised this is not getting a mention. Internet pornography is changing attitudes to sex. It is readily available and IMO a reason there are a shortage of brothers reaching out. The higher that people get up the cult ladder, the harder to leave. Conversely, all those that are holding back for reasons of porn based uncleanness are more likely to become inactive or fade.
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The Internet is worse for the Watchtower than 1975 was: here's proof.
by ILoveTTATT2 ini am translating jwfacts to spanish.
i am doing the "statistics" section.here are two graphs that show that the statistics have never been worse for the watchtower:quantity of hours required for 1 baptism: note how low it went in 1974-1975, and note that 2016 is much higher than the slump of 1978... about double, to be exact.
2016 was a historical record in this statistic (higher is worse for watchtower).. this stat is the baptisms as a percentage of the publisher average.
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jwfacts
SBF - Mormons did an analysis of their figures and concluded the Internet was not an important factor in growth or decline.
I would like to see their reasoning.
When it is said that the internet is not the only factor, do they mean that apostate sites are not the only factor, or the internet in general. Whilst apostate sites have limited reach, the Internet is critical to the collapse of Watchtower and religion in general.
There are a range of factors in addition to apostate sites. The generation changes since 1995, 100 years of no-show from Jesus in 2014, porn and the relaxation of attitudes to sex, the rise of acceptance of homosexuality, finding support groups through social media. Each of these have some relationship to the internet and access to information in general.
The decline of religion in general is largely to do with information, which is being more and more rapidly dispersed due to the internet. There are two areas that information helps, the shrinking God of the Gaps due to Science, and the realization that it does not make sense to say God resides in only one religion, when religion affiliation is mostly decided by one's place of birth.
I don't know how it would be possible to work out how much affect each attribute has to the overall decline of Watchtower, but it needs to be recognized that the internet is tied very much to so many of the reasons for declining growth.
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JWs biggest problem is not doctrinal issues
by Chook init's biggest problems are associated with its lack of genuine love and concern for the rank& file.
the average person doesn't need a food critic to tell them their hamburger is shit, in the same manner the average person can discern kindness and love.
gbs fake love and concern is evident in the way head office deals with victims of sexual abuse by jw clergy.
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jwfacts
Doctrine is rarely the way to convince a JW that the religion is wrong. Most don't feel qualified to question doctrine. If they trust the Governing Body they will dismiss inconsistencies and questions. It is emotional and trust issues that are more likely to raise doubts.
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103
New Research at AJWRB
by Lee Elder inthe latest research article published at ajwrb estimates the number of jehovah's witnesses who have died from following or being coerced to follow watchtower's blood policy.
the numbers are staggering.
http://ajwrb.org/jehovahs-witnesses-and-blood-tens-of-thousands-dead-in-hidden-tragedy.
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jwfacts
A very good article and the figures calculated are reasonable, erring on the side of caution. I mentioned this on a radio interview recently. Because the deaths happen silently and over a longer span of time, there is not the outrage and attention that Jonestown received, despite the net affect being far higher and ongoing.
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Quotes: "Since 1914 and 1918 enemies have become more vicious"
by TheWonderofYou inthis is a proof for 1914!.
enemies, .
https://archive.org/stream/enemiesbyjudgerutherford1937/1937-enemies#page/n11/mode/1up.
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jwfacts
Another comment to prove Rutherford a fraud.
In Bible times, the Israelites were instructed to commit genocide. Well not quite, the Israelite soldiers were allowed to keep the virgins to rape. Through most of history, war has resulted in the enemies being slaughtered, including civilians and soldiers. Look at war now. If a civilian is accidentally killed in war, it is a major scandal.
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332
The most successful teaching of Jehovah's Witnesses and an amazing new book on the divine name
by slimboyfat injehovah's witnesses have had to revise their chronology and various doctrinal interpretations due to events and scholarly corrections.
but the one teaching where they have been consistently ahead of the curve is the importance of jehovah's name.. .
i'm going to run through a (necessarily selective) timeline of jw events and scholarly publications that demonstrate the phenomenal success of this teaching in the last days.
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jwfacts
Surely not killing each other is a very basic Christian requirement.
How? Christianity accepts the Bible, not just a few choice quotes from Jesus, and killing non believers is a key message of the Bible.
On another track, the concept of pacifism is impossible without a dominant force the protect the pacifists, and JW's would not exist if it were not for Christians that have used violence to protect their freedom.
This is a totally different topic though.
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The most successful teaching of Jehovah's Witnesses and an amazing new book on the divine name
by slimboyfat injehovah's witnesses have had to revise their chronology and various doctrinal interpretations due to events and scholarly corrections.
but the one teaching where they have been consistently ahead of the curve is the importance of jehovah's name.. .
i'm going to run through a (necessarily selective) timeline of jw events and scholarly publications that demonstrate the phenomenal success of this teaching in the last days.
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jwfacts
jwfacts I was agnostic leaning toward atheism. Now I'm agnostic leaning toward belief in God. I'm really not sure what to believe but I think there must be something bigger than ourselves and that JWs have good points as well as bad points.
It is true that JWs have good points. I would argue that every organisation has good points. Even the most violent totalitarian system offers community, purpose and brotherhood. The leader may offer good direction in health advise, moral guidelines etc.
There are many great reasons to be a Jehovah's Witness, but I would never recommend a person join. There are numerous other groups to direct a person to. The reason that you concentrate on JWs is it is your comfort zone, and area of expertise. Yet Watchtower is high control group that uses coercive persuasion, and as such is a dangerous group. The fact that they stole a lucky guess about 1914, have an interesting but unrealistic perspective on war, and may (or may not) be correct about using the Divine name does not make up for the destructive force they have been in millions of lives.
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There are only 4 ways to leave the Jehovah's Witnesses
by new boy inthere are only four ways of leaving the jehovah’s witnesses.
so there are four ways that could lead to shunning.
i say “could” because options three and four has some loopholes.
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jwfacts
Alanv- Fading doesnt need to be a tricky one.
I don't agree. Fading means you will still be shunned by most of your friends. You will also need to constantly be aware of what you are doing that may be observed and get you disfellowshipped for many years to come.
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The most successful teaching of Jehovah's Witnesses and an amazing new book on the divine name
by slimboyfat injehovah's witnesses have had to revise their chronology and various doctrinal interpretations due to events and scholarly corrections.
but the one teaching where they have been consistently ahead of the curve is the importance of jehovah's name.. .
i'm going to run through a (necessarily selective) timeline of jw events and scholarly publications that demonstrate the phenomenal success of this teaching in the last days.
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jwfacts
Phoebe, do not be confused by this thread. The opening post is a thought experiment, by a poster that does not believe in Jehovah or the infallibility of the New Testament. He does not believe the outlandish claims he made about this being a topic that vindicates Jehovah's Witnesses, all I can imagine is that he is playing devil's advocate. It is unfortunate that the way SBF's opening post was framed was irresponsible, and has affected you.
If it turned out that the Divine name appeared in some original manuscripts of New Testament books, it would not vindicate Watchtower, and would end up creating other theological issues around their interpretation about the nature of God.