jwfacts

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Posts by jwfacts

• 
  29

  I am 'no longer 1of JW's', and damn it feels good. Plus my letter to bethel

  by jwfacts in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  for anyone facing my situation i recommend not being scared.

  it is not money i am after, what it would be good to achieve is make the wts so scared of publically announcing anyone that they end up changing their d/f policy.. this is what happened.

  for anyone facing my situation i recommend not being scared.

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• 

  jwfacts

  Rabbit, elders are particularly contemptous about appeals as they start from the intial premise that the first body of elders are correct.
  
  When I pulled out the elders book they did not look shocked, they looked completely annoyed, especially as the Chairman had intially said that only elders are entitled to see it.
  
  When I accused him of lieing the response was total contempt, they had made up their minds and an appeal was just going to waste more of their time.
• 
  29

  I am 'no longer 1of JW's', and damn it feels good. Plus my letter to bethel

  by jwfacts in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  for anyone facing my situation i recommend not being scared.

  it is not money i am after, what it would be good to achieve is make the wts so scared of publically announcing anyone that they end up changing their d/f policy.. this is what happened.

  for anyone facing my situation i recommend not being scared.

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  2. 
  3. 
• 

  jwfacts

  Poztate, this will prove very costly to them in the end. For 10 years I did nothing about my doubts so as to avoid harrassment. When the elders got on my back I followed their advice, did research, and released an annonymous site. However to avoid being d/f I kept in cognito and relatively quiet.
  
  Because of d/f me I now have nothing to loose. As I truthfully told them in my final meeting, if they d/f I will take out 10 times the number of JW's as if they left me alone.
• 
  29

  I am 'no longer 1of JW's', and damn it feels good. Plus my letter to bethel

  by jwfacts in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  for anyone facing my situation i recommend not being scared.

  it is not money i am after, what it would be good to achieve is make the wts so scared of publically announcing anyone that they end up changing their d/f policy.. this is what happened.

  for anyone facing my situation i recommend not being scared.

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  2. 
  3. 
• 

  jwfacts

  Thank you for the messages and the great Congratulations signs.

  I think it is good to go out with a bang, or at least to talk to your friends about why you are leaving. For a true cult member and most of the elders it will just strengthen their faith. But it will plant seeds in the hearts of those that are searching. The more people that they see moving on will make them more likely to look a bit deeper and give them the strength to move on as well.

  I emailed a letter to my family members to find out which ones will talk to me. However I wanted to take the power away from them that they think they have. It disgusts me that a cult member thinks they get to decide whether or not to talk to me. So I wrote;

  "Dear xxx. I just wanted to clarify our relationship, and to say that I am willing to speak to you in case you ever feel the desire to call me. "

  Needless to say, the members that will not talk to me took great offense at that line.

  Anyway it feels good to have had my say. I am now totally prepared to move on with my life.
• 
  25

  Is it always ethical to try to help someone get out?

  by wanderlustguy in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  is it ever better or ethical to let someone go on believing in the truth even though it is a lie?

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  jwfacts

  Is it ethical to tell someone elses child there is no Santa?

  I don't think it always is ethical to help someone get out. It is a case by case basis and also depends on how well you know them, how they would react and survive without the Borg.

  A lot of people are followers. Being a JW is better than being a nothing, or them drifting into some other crack pot cult.
• 
  8

  JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES: FROM PUBLISHER TO ELDER IN SIX MONTHS- A real book

  by jwfacts in

  1. social
  2. entertainment

  i found this book for sale on the internet.

  the writer lives at bethel.

  the forward made me laugh.

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  jwfacts

  I found this book for sale on the Internet. The writer lives at bethel. The forward made me laugh. Now we know what all those evicted bethelites are going to be doing for a money.

  This self-help book is for men who have been constantly overlooked for the position of Elder in their congregations. If you are a publisher or a Ministerial Servant and have been waiting years to become an elder while brothers who came into the Truth after you have been appointed Elder, then this book is for you. We do not preach to you nor do we quote scripture. This book was written especially for you by very experienced Jehovah's Witnesses. This is a candid book that shows you exactly what you need to do to get the appointment of Elder that you seek. This book takes a sometimes lighthearted look at what it takes to be an Elder. We should never be so serious that we cannot laugh at ourselves.

  WHY WE WROTE THIS BOOK
  OVER the years we have seen men appointed as Elders who we would not trust to walk our dogs properly. We have also seen truly godly, sincere, truth loving men overlooked and tossed aside as if they were a pile of dust.
  No doubt you know or have known men who came into the Truth years after you did and were appointed Elders in a very short time. You may resent the fact that these new men are Elders and you are still waiting. Perhaps “resent” is too harsh a word. It does make you wonder though, doesn’t it? What have they got that you don’t have? What are they doing that you are not doing?
  Perhaps you have spoken to the Elders in your congregation regarding your goal of joining them. They have probably given you vague advice such as praying on it and continuing to “reach out”. The term “reach out” in the Kingdom Hall usually means mowing the lawn and performing other menial duties. If you have mowed the lawn. Vacuumed carpets and cleaned toilets until you are blue in the face and are still no further along in your goal to becoming an Elder, this book is for you.

  We approximate that between us we have appointed thousands of Elders and Ministerial Servants. Some of our appointments were good, God fearing men who truly deserved to be Elders. Some of the men appointed as Elders were of such shady character it made us wonder how they had the audacity to call themselves servants of Jehovah. They were appointed anyway. Sometimes because the Circuit Overseer said to appoint them because they had a beautiful wife and gorgeous children and their presence would cause others to follow them into the congregation. Sometimes because they were professionals, such as lawyers or doctors and the community would see that the educated were also Witnesses. Sometimes they were the owners of an SUV that could hold a large group of publishers and they could be counted on to participate regularly in Field Service. Appointments of Elders are made for a myriad of reasons some of which have absolutely nothing to do with spirituality. Take a look around your Kingdom Hall and see the men who are appointed as Elders. While some of them may be truly deserving men, you will no doubt notice that not all Elders are truly deserving of their appointment.

  We want nothing more by writing this book than to aid our brothers who are unhappy with their lot in the Kingdom Hall. Service to Jehovah should be a joyful thing. It cannot be joyful if you are sitting in a state of suspended animation waiting for your time to be appointed an Elder. So we decided to use our years of experience to outline exactly what is expected of brothers who want to become Elders in their congregations.

  REINVENT YOURSELF

  IF you are a baptized brother, have been in the Truth for many years and are still a publisher, you are in need of our help. Maybe you have advanced to the position of a Ministerial Servant. Odds are you have remained in this position for many years and you cannot seem to progress further ever though you feel you are doing everything right.

  If you see yourself in either of the examples above, and you really want to be appointed an Elder, then you have to think about reinventing yourself. Think of how some popular pop stars stay on top by inventing themselves every few years. By doing this they add freshness and surprise to their personalities and to their repertoire. They do not allow the public to take them for granted. Following this example and with the aid of this book you too will be able to reinvent yourself. You will be able to turn yourself into the brother that everyone sees as an Elder, a brother who is respected, held in high esteem and who people come to for encouragement.

  All reinventions take effort and work. Don’t be discouraged though, because it is not as much work and it won’t be as hard as you think. In the end you will have the appointment that you covet.

  Hopefully, you have been in the Truth long enough to be aware of the set up in the Kingdom Hall. You understand the different roles of the brothers and sisters in the congregation and you realize that there are actually hierarchies and cliques in the Kingdom Hall, with the Elders in the upper echelon. Of course, there should not be class distinctions and cliques in the Kingdom Hall but unfortunately we are not yet perfect and you cannot change human nature. In any event, you can use these imperfections to your advantage.

  Always keep your goal in mind. You want to be one of the Elders. The Elders are the ones that run things in the Kingdom Hall, they are the ones that give the major talks, they are the ones that are on the assembly programs, they are the ones that are in the dramas, they are the ones that know all the news, they are the ones that know all the gossip because the brothers and sisters seek them out to tell them their troubles and where they have fallen short. You want to be just like them.
  
  You should not be ashamed of wanting to be an Elder and being willing to work toward that goal. No one should condemn or judge you for working hard to achieve your goal. Of course, your reasons for wanting to be an Elder are your own. We just hope that power is not one of them and that you are motivated by a strong desire to truly be of service to your brothers.

  You should also not be ashamed that you want to be an Elder right now. You don’t want to wait years for the appointment like Brother Oldandtired. Every congregation has a Brother Oldandtired. He is that Elderly brother who has been waiting years to be an Elder and no matter what he does he is not noticed. As a matter of fact Brother Oldandtired is something of a laughing stock in the congregation, with his long, drawn out comments and prayers. Brother Oldandtired seems to believe that the longer his comments are and the longer his prayers are, the more spiritual he will be perceived. Sadly, he does not realize that it just does not work that way.
• 
  7

  A drinking game...

  by FaithfulDoubter in

  1. social
  2. humour

  disclaimer: this is meant in humor only.

  please drink responsibly, and be of legal age when drinking..... ok, if you're anything like me, you get copies of talks sent to you on a regular basis.

  now, when asked if i listen to them, i have to him and haw, and say no.

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  jwfacts

  Cracked me up. I would be passed out on the ground before the end of the introduction with most talks. Very clever.
• 
  29

  I am 'no longer 1of JW's', and damn it feels good. Plus my letter to bethel

  by jwfacts in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  for anyone facing my situation i recommend not being scared.

  it is not money i am after, what it would be good to achieve is make the wts so scared of publically announcing anyone that they end up changing their d/f policy.. this is what happened.

  for anyone facing my situation i recommend not being scared.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  jwfacts

  Hi Ozzie, call me when you are back and free as I would love to catch up again.
• 
  29

  I am 'no longer 1of JW's', and damn it feels good. Plus my letter to bethel

  by jwfacts in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  for anyone facing my situation i recommend not being scared.

  it is not money i am after, what it would be good to achieve is make the wts so scared of publically announcing anyone that they end up changing their d/f policy.. this is what happened.

  for anyone facing my situation i recommend not being scared.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  jwfacts

  Thanks AuldSoul, i will remember that for next time.
  
  
• 
  29

  I am 'no longer 1of JW's', and damn it feels good. Plus my letter to bethel

  by jwfacts in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  for anyone facing my situation i recommend not being scared.

  it is not money i am after, what it would be good to achieve is make the wts so scared of publically announcing anyone that they end up changing their d/f policy.. this is what happened.

  for anyone facing my situation i recommend not being scared.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  jwfacts

  Anyway here is a brief overview of what happened. I asked for ideas last month and some of you said go, some said not to give them the pleasure. I went purely to see if there is any way to avoid being d/f when they have good grounds, and to learn the entire process to see if there are any holes or anything illegal. I tried threats of legal action against the individual lawyers, a lawyers letter, a letter to bethel for annulment, an appeal and another letter to bethel saying they will regret any announcement. Nothing worked. I am now going to explore any avenues of the law and the UN, but it is very unlikely to succeed, and I don't have the resources to take it too far. I would love to know if anyone has an ideas, and have wondered about the possibility of a class action. It is not money I am after, what it would be good to achieve is make the WTS so scared of publically announcing anyone that they end up changing their d/f policy.
  

  This is what happened. I received a phone call this morning at work from my cousins husband (an elder). He said 'Sorry, i must have dialed the wrong number. blah blah blah By the way, you were d/f last night. Blah blah blah, sorry that you aren't welcome in our house anymore'. It is very sad as they have an 18 month old child that so far has spent 4 months in hospital and I used to drop in to see him all the time. It was quite a shock as i had sent a letter of appeal to bethel on Monday and not yet received a reply. I had hoped for one more week, but whatever. Baptised for 20 years 4 months and 7 days, that sounds like such a long time, I don't even feel that old.

  I didnt get any work done today, too spun out. Rang a few JW friends in other congs before they found out. Dropped the bombshell and asked what they would do. Most said they don't want to get in trouble but could never totally shun me, so if they see me around they will say hello. I ended each conversation saying thanks, the WTS is not the truth so they do need to prepare for growing old, and if they ever want to know why it is wrong give me a call, and dont worry, I won't shun them either. One sister said she can't really speak to me anymore but is fine with me doing what is best for me as we all have free will. I agreed that God gave us free will and said it is a shame the WTS does not let the members have free will, such as insisting on who to shun. My grandmother said she would never shun me and I could always stay at her house, but my sister has already shunned me for six months and now a couple of cousins will too.

  Not to get all soppy and spiritual but I feel great. In fact i have felt great ever since the elders approached me one month ago. It is like Jesus said, 'take my yoke because it is kindly and light', I can truly say that the WTS yoke is heavy and it is great to finally have it removed. For anyone facing my situation I recommend not being scared. I wasted 10 years thinking it was wrong but hanging around for family and friends. However, that time did prepare me emotionally for this. I had enough time to make some truly wonderful friends that are are not JWs who as trustworthy as anyone I have ever met. I also had time to explain what I believed to my family. That in itself was a huge relief for me. They dont have to agree with me but at least they know, and i have caused enought doubt for some of them to not want to shun me. (One thing that happens when leaving is that you re-evaluate whether or not there is a god or the bible. I strongly recommend not telling any JWs. As soon as you say you are not sure if there is a God they loose total respect for you. If you say your only issue is with the WTS it strikes a chord as that is the only area in which they are unique from everyone else, and they all wonder somethings if the WTS really is the truth, and far more likely to get them to listen to you.)

  I had several visits from elders this year trying to get the dirt on me, even though i stopped going to meetings 12 months ago. They found out about my site 4 weeks ago so arranged a judicial committee on grounds of apostasy. I refused to go to see if they would just give up, but they didnt, so i appealed the decision on the grounds that they did not give me reasonable notice of the meeting and i would have gone if i could. I then had to appear before 6 elders, including three from bethel and a CO. All very interesting, but really it was all formality as they had already decided I was guilty. I do think at least one of them must be agonizing over some of the things I said. I then appealed to bethel. I have pasted the letter below. They obviously were not intimidated by it as they went ahead and announced me anyway. I rang bethel today to ask why they did not have the courtesy to at least answer me, that in the corporate world there is enough integrity and honesty to at least put things in writing. One thing I noticed about the Service committee guy and the two Chairman of the committees is that they were all so cold. Though the other elders chatted, the ones in charge all refused to answer questions, all kept replying with "we are not here to answer your questions, we are here to determine your repentance", it must be part of 'how to climb the ladder' training. Reminded me of the cliche good cop/bad cop routine.

  Anyway here is my final letter, it is long and didn't achieve anything, but cathartic so I thought some of you may like to read it:

  Service Department of the Watchtower Society

  Anyway here is a brief overview of what happened. I asked for ideas last month and some of you said go, some said not to give them the pleasure. I went purely to see if there is any way to avoid being d/f when they have good grounds, and to learn the entire process to see if there are any holes or anything illegal. I tried threats of legal action against the individual lawyers, a lawyers letter, a letter to bethel for annulment, an appeal and another letter to bethel saying they will regret any announcement. Nothing worked. I am now going to explore any avenues of the law and the UN, but it is very unlikely to succeed, and I don't have the resources to take it too far. I would love to know if anyone has an ideas, and have wondered about the possibility of a class action. It is not money I am after, what it would be good to achieve is make the WTS so scared of publically announcing anyone that they end up changing their d/f policy.

  This is what happened. I received a phone call this morning at work from my cousins husband (an elder). He said 'Sorry, i must have dialed the wrong number. blah blah blah By the way, you were d/f last night. Blah blah blah, sorry that you aren't welcome in our house anymore'. It is very sad as they have an 18 month old child that so far has spent 4 months in hospital and I used to drop in to see him all the time. It was quite a shock as i had sent a letter of appeal to bethel on Monday and not yet received a reply. I had hoped for one more week, but whatever. Baptised for 20 years 4 months and 7 days, that sounds like such a long time, I don't even feel that old.

  I didnt get any work done today, too spun out. Rang a few JW friends in other congs before they found out. Dropped the bombshell and asked what they would do. Most said they don't want to get in trouble but could never totally shun me, so if they see me around they will say hello. I ended each conversation saying thanks, the WTS is not the truth so they do need to prepare for growing old, and if they ever want to know why it is wrong give me a call, and dont worry, I won't shun them either. One sister said she can't really speak to me anymore but is fine with me doing what is best for me as we all have free will. I agreed that God gave us free will and said it is a shame the WTS does not let the members have free will, such as insisting on who to shun. My grandmother said she would never shun me and I could always stay at her house, but my sister has already shunned me for six months and now a couple of cousins will too.

  Not to get all soppy and spiritual but I feel great. In fact i have felt great ever since the elders approached me one month ago. It is like Jesus said, 'take my yoke because it is kindly and light', I can truly say that the WTS yoke is heavy and it is great to finally have it removed. For anyone facing my situation I recommend not being scared. I wasted 10 years thinking it was wrong but hanging around for family and friends. However, that time did prepare me emotionally for this. I had enough time to make some truly wonderful friends that are are not JWs who as trustworthy as anyone I have ever met. I also had time to explain what I believed to my family. That in itself was a huge relief for me. They dont have to agree with me but at least they know, and i have caused enought doubt for some of them to not want to shun me. (One thing that happens when leaving is that you re-evaluate whether or not there is a god or the bible. I strongly recommend not telling any JWs. As soon as you say you are not sure if there is a God they loose total respect for you. If you say your only issue is with the WTS it strikes a chord as that is the only area in which they are unique from everyone else, and they all wonder somethings if the WTS really is the truth, and far more likely to get them to listen to you.)

  I had several visits from elders this year trying to get the dirt on me, even though i stopped going to meetings 12 months ago. They found out about my site 4 weeks ago so arranged a judicial committee on grounds of apostasy. I refused to go to see if they would just give up, but they didnt, so i appealed the decision on the grounds that they did not give me reasonable notice of the meeting and i would have gone if i could. I then had to appear before 6 elders, including three from bethel and a CO. All very interesting, but really it was all formality as they had already decided I was guilty. I do think at least one of them must be agonizing over some of the things I said. I then appealed to bethel. I have pasted the letter below. They obviously were not intimidated by it as they went ahead and announced me anyway. I rang bethel today to ask why they did not have the courtesy to at least answer me, that in the corporate world there is enough integrity and honesty to at least put things in writing. One thing I noticed about the Service committee guy and the two Chairman of the committees is that they were all so cold. Though the other elders chatted, the ones in charge all refused to answer questions, all kept replying with "we are not here to answer your questions, we are here to determine your repentance", it must be part of 'how to climb the ladder' training. Reminded me of the cliche good cop/bad cop routine.

  Anyway here is my final letter, it is long and didn't achieve anything, but cathartic so I thought some of you may like to read it:

  Service Department of the Watchtower Society

  2-4 Zouch Road

  Denham Court NSW Australia 2565

  DATED: 08/01/2006

  Request for Appeal on basis of serious error in judgment:

  I wish to appeal the decision of the second judicial committee held 7/1/2006 to disfellowship me.

  In their eagerness to prove charges of apostasy against me I believe both the initial and second judicial committees failed to take into consideration both Biblical and Watchtower guidelines as how to best deal with the situation.

  In this letter I will attempt to highlight

  Why disfellowshipping is practiced in an unscriptural manner by the Watchtower Society
  In what way my judicial committee meetings were not conducted in line with either Watchtower of Bible guidelines
  Why disfellowshipping me will be extremely damaging to the name of the organisation and the members of numerous congregations
  Why what transpired paves the way for legal action
  Proposed solutions

  As the Service Committee is made of mature brothers I am sure you are no doubt aware that the manner in which the Watchtower Society practices disfellowshipping is not in line with Christian principles. I believe the bible describes the best way to deal with my situation.

  Paul states at 1Co 5:11 “But now I am writing YOU to quit mixing in company with anyone called a brother that is a fornicator or a greedy person or an idolater or a reviler or a drunkard or an extortioner, not even eating with such a man.”

  In 1 Corinthians it does not say to totally avoid a brother who is a wrong doer, rather it says to quit mixing in company with such a person and not eat with such a man. As the Watchtower itself has at times explained, this scripture indicates that we are not to socialise with these people as friends.

  Kingdom Ministry August 2002 p.3 Display Christian Loyalty When a Relative Is Disfellowshipped

  “God’s Word states that we should ‘not even eat with such a man.’ (1 Cor. 5:11) Hence, we also avoid social fellowship with an expelled person. This would rule out joining him in a picnic, party, ball game, or trip to the mall or theater or sitting down to a meal with him either in the home or at a restaurant.”

  This statement does not mean that this type of person must never be spoken to. If they are at a meeting it would be reasonable to talk to and encourage them. Most certainly a polite greeting is acceptable.

  Paul and then John gave some stricter advice in regards to a particular type of person.

  Romans 16:17 Now I exhort YOU, brothers, to keep your eye on those who cause divisions and occasions for stumbling contrary to the teaching that YOU have learned, and avoid them.

  Paul says to avoid those causing divisions, which would indicate he was referring to apostates. Paul is not referring to people that disagree with the Watchtower Society, he refers to people disagreeing with the words of Jesus and those recorded infallibly in the bible, not the fallible words of a human directed organisation.

  2 John 7, 9-11 7Many deceivers, who do not acknowledge Jesus Christ as coming in the flesh, have gone out into the world. Any such person is the deceiver and the antichrist…10 If anyone comes to YOU and does not bring this teaching, never receive him into YOUR homes or say a greeting to him.

  2 John it takes a far harder line than that of either Jesus or Paul, stating not to even greet such a person. But what type of person is it referring to? The Antichrist. This type of person should be totally avoided as they can damage a person’s faith. It is only the Antichrist that is stated as the type of person not to even be greeted.

  The Watchtower Society uses the statement of that single scripture in 2 John and applies it to every single person that does not follow a long list of Society dictated rules, many of which are never stated as reasons to be shunned. If a witness gambles, smokes, or has a blood transfusion they can be disfellowshipped for life. Every single one of their Witness friends is told not to ever greet them again, unless they repent and return to the Organisation. Parents are directed to shun their own children for life, and I know of many that have. Such extreme shunning is only ever stated once, and was only supposed to apply to the Antichrist. Even then it does not say that this should be extended to family members.

  Paul actually warned against the way in which the Watchtower Society practices disfellowshipping when he said at 2 Corinthians 2:5-11; “5 Now if anyone has caused sadness, he has saddened, not me, but all of YOU to an extent—not to be too harsh in what I say. 6 This rebuke given by the majority is sufficient for such a man, 7 so that, on the contrary now, YOU should kindly forgive and comfort [him], that somehow such a man may not be swallowed up by his being overly sad. 8 Therefore I exhort YOU to confirm YOUR love for him. 9 For to this end also I write to ascertain the proof of YOU, whether YOU are obedient in all things. 10 Anything YOU kindly forgive anyone, I do too. In fact, as for me, whatever I have kindly forgiven, if I have kindly forgiven anything, it has been for YOUR sakes in Christ’s sight; 11 that we may not be overreached by Satan, for we are not ignorant of his designs.” The Watchtower procedure leads to a high percentage of disfellowshipped people never returning to the organisation, as these words warn it would.

  I would certainly appear that the words of Jesus apply to the practices of the Watchtower Society in this regard. Luke 11:42 states; ‘But woe to YOU Pharisees, because YOU give the tenth of the mint and the rue and of every [other] vegetable, but YOU pass by the justice and the love of God! . . .”

  The manner of judicial proceedings is also highly unscriptural and illegal by being done in utmost secrecy. Both the Israelites and early Christian congregations kept matters open to ordinary persons. Rather than being done privately in front of elders only, matters were done at the city gates so a fair discussion with onlookers could be made. This prevented the injustice that can take place before small bodies of elders.

  At each of the meetings I have had there has been strong resistance to telling me in advance the details of the meeting, the elders have refused to put the details of the meeting in writing, refused to allow me to tape record the proceedings or to have an observer with me. Meanwhile six elders were present at one meeting to act as witnesses for each other. You must be able to understand that this is highly biased and illegal by all standards. For instance, corporate law insists that all proceedings be done transparently. How can an organisation that claims to represent God act at a lower standard than the so called commercial systems of Satan? It certainly indicated to me that there was no intention for things to be done scripturally, honestly or justly.

  When a person was disfellowshiped the congregation was to know why. Paul openly told the congregation of the wrong conduct of Peter, Hymenae´us, Alexander and Diotrephes. To avoid legal problems, the Society warns against following God’s direction in this area. The extent of the disfellowshipping announcement is now stated in Organised to do Jehovah’s Will (2005) p.154 to be restricted to;

  “[Name of person] is no longer one of Jehovah’s Witnesses.”

  Finally, both Paul and Jesus applied the process of shunning to people professing to be brothers only. 1Co 5:11 says not to eat with “anyone calling themselves a brother” who commits certain sins. (See also Matthew 18:15-17)

  As my disfellowshipping relate to none of the reasons the scriptures list as offences there are no grounds to disfellowship me scripturally. My only issue is with a self confessed fallible organisation, not the bible or Jesus. (I understand that the Watchtower Society attempts to say that speaking against the Watchtower Society is being referred to by Paul and John as it is the same as speaking against the words of the bible. This is apparently supported by a vague parable about a faithful and discreet slave. That is certainly a misrepresentation of scripture, but would take a book to debate and beyond the scope of this document.) As I do not call myself a brother then shunning can not be applied to me in any case.

  The Watchtower Society has made a highly legislative arrangement that ignores the effectiveness of the simple process described in the bible, a process that is working satisfactorily in my current situation. The bible does not describe judicial committees or the need to announce each situation. I am already shunned by most of my so called friends that are Jehovah's Witnesses because they have personally come to the conclusion that I am no longer following the Watchtower Society. In other words, the process is currently working as described in the bible; I am recognised now as one of the world and treated as such.

  When compared with Watchtower procedure I also believe the judicial committees are both in error. Pay Attention to Yourselves and all the Flock states on page 99 that the following criteria need to be considered;

  “Baptized persons who have not associated for some time.

  If you learn of serious wrongdoing on the part of such a person, the matter should be investigated if it poses a threat to the congregation's cleanness and welfare or causes a public scandal.

  Consider the following:

  · Does he still profess to be a Witness?

  · Is he generally recognized as such in the congregation and/or the community?

  · Does the person have a measure of contact or association with the congregation so that a leavening, or corrupting, influence exists?

  · How did the matter become known to the elders?

  · Is the person willing to meet with a committee, thus admitting accountability to the Christian congregation? “

  Consider my situation:

  · I have not associated for some time,

  · I do not profess to be a Witness

  · I am not recognised as one in the community (I have not actively preached for several years)

  · I am not a corrupting influence in the congregation

  · I made it quite clear to BR Y and Peter that I was not willing to meet with the committee.

  · The matter became known due to a person from another state insisting I tell her what I now believe, despite me repeatedly warning her it would be better if I did not, as I do not want to cause trouble. The situation became known to the elders by her husband, a man raised a Witness who is a violent, adulterous, previously disfellowshipped person who had been inactive at the time.

  Therefore, on every ground Iisted above I should not have been disfellowshipped.

  After BR Y summoned me to a judicial committee I had expected to either be left alone due to the legal letter I sent, or I expected to be possibly disassociated. It was only due to BR Y'S incorrect decision that I should be disfellowshipped that opened the way for me to appeal. The reason I appeared before the second committee was not to admit accountability to the Christian congregation, as I made very clear that I do not believe the Watchtower Society represents the Christian congregation. I appeared purely to uncover what was known by the committee and advise of my intention to pursue legal avenues if I am further defamed or harassed. However the second appeal committee did not attempt to uncover the motives for my appearance or whether I fit the criteria above, their only interest was whether I believe in the Watchtower Society. For this reason they too came to the incorrect conclusion that I should be disfellowshipped rather than that I should be left alone or that my actions show that I have disassociated myself.

  BR XXX made clear that the criteria the committee used to consider whether to disfellowship me was if it was necessary to:

  1. Prevent further reproach on Jehovah’s name

  2. Prevent me from corrupting the congregation

  3. Bring me back to the Watchtower Society.

  I can assure you that disfellowshipping me will achieve none of the above; the way to achieve those three points is to cease all further contact and harassment of me. In fact to disfellowship me will have an extremely counter productive result. Rather than holding my tongue as I have attempted to do in order to avoid trouble up to this point, if any announcement is made to the congregation about me being disfellowshipped or disassociated I will do everything in my power to alert people to the unchristian operations of this organisation, be that by legal means, print or electronic media.

  As I mentioned in my judicial committee, if you are concerned that a person may loose their faith after spending an hour reading information that I may have supplied about the Watchtower Society, despite many years of ongoing indoctrination, you must have grave concerns yourself as to whether you have the truth, and the power of God’s Word and his Holy Spirit in the lives of Jehovah's Witnesses. Up to this point that is all that has occurred. I have predominately submitted anonymous information to various internet sites. This has not been to mislead active Jehovah's Witnesses, as such people should not be reviewing the sites I submit to. The people that would be reading any information I provide are showing disrespect for the Societies guidelines and so therefore must be looking for other viewpoints.

  However, because of the detrimental effect on how I am treated by my family for the remainder of my life, should any announcements be made about me to the congregation, I am willing to do all in my power to stop other people being affected by the same evil system. I will begin to spend money on directing people to information I believe can prevent interested people becoming entangled within the organisations indoctrination. There are 10’000’s of active Jehovah's Witnesses that are currently searching the internet for answers to the doubts they are having and I will pay money to ensure I reach as many of these as possible.

  My step children are a good example of how disfellowshipping will be counter productive, and will bring considerable damage to the congregation and the Watchtower Society. My 19 year old son is inactive but believed the Watchtower Society to be the truth, and my 13 year old daughter was too young to really know. Neither wanted me to talk to them about it. However the harassment of the last weeks and statements from various members of my family that they will no longer talk to me if I am disfellowshipped have firmly convinced them that the Watchtower Society is a cult. My son finally asked me to discuss my concerns about the Watchtower with him. I then overheard him for the first time discussing religion with his friends and actively preaching against the Watchtower organisation.

  I have discussed my situation with various lawyers and also feel that I do have what will amount to a successful case against Luc Kikkert personally, the person that announces any decision in regards to my standing in the congregation and possibly the other brothers involved in my committee meetings and the Service Committee.

  Luc’s inability to follow the law and also Watchtower guidelines have certainly opened the way for me to sue him personally. During BR Y'S years in the Parramatta congregation I have heard ongoing complaints about his actions by elders, active witnesses and previous Jehovah's Witnesses alike. In his eagerness to enforce the letter of the Watchtower Society law he has failed to appreciate that Christians should be guided foremost for love of God and neighbour. In my own situation he has consistently harassed me over the past year, demanding appointments at his own convenience, turning up at my door in the dark unannounced, stating he is not subject to the laws of the land when dealing with me, conference calling me without advising me there were other people listening in and calling me three times even after I advised him any further contact other than in writing would result in legal action or an Apprehended Violence Order, doing so both verbally and in writing from my lawyer. This has resulted in me needing to seek medical treatment, and currently being on Aropax and referrals to a psychologist. On one occasion BRY demanded to see me on a certain night without being willing to say what for. This was despite me saying I would be forced to rearrange an engagement with family that were here on holidays, and the resultant stress and my behaviour afterwards has caused a huge and un-repaired rift in my family. With the current judicial proceedings he went ahead with the first judicial committee within a week of contacting me about the need to have one. I made clear to him that I have an exceptionally busy life, was heading off on holidays and asked for scriptural reason why things could not to wait till a convenient time for all. Of course he could offer none. By going ahead with the judicial committee without giving me a suitable option to be present he failed to follow the guidelines on page 110 of Pay Attention to Yourselves and all the Flock that “Suitable arrangements should be made as to the time and place of the hearing.” I believe this is has led to him subsequently making the wrong decision in my situation.

  I also have a case against any person involved in an announcement against me on the grounds of defamation. Defamation is “an act of communication that causes someone to be shamed, ridiculed, held in contempt, lowered in the estimation of the community, or to lose employment status or earnings or otherwise suffer a damaged reputation.” I can prove that the statement “Paul Grundy is no longer one of Jehovah's Witnesses” is not a factual assertion. I am more a Jehovah’s Witness than I have ever been. Studying the bible rather than being guided by misinformation supplied in Watchtower publications has given me more respect for it’s contents and a far greater love of Jehovah than I ever had believing the assertions invented by Rutherford in the late 1920’s that God would kill all but the small band of people following his man made organisation. I also have far greater love of Jesus now that I know he is my mediator and the New Testament was written for me, not a small number of anointed followers of the Watchtower Society. (Insight on the Scriptures, Vol. 2, pp. 360-362 shows that Jesus is the Mediator of the new covenant and that those who are in the covenant number only 144,000 and states, "Jesus' mediatorship operates solely toward those in the new covenant"). I also find it highly offensive at how regularly Watchtower publications attempt to indicate the Watchtower organisation between us and Jehovah in place of what was written to apply to Jesus.

  I can prove that from any statements about my standing as one of Jehovah's Witnesses I will suffer financial loss from both of my businesses, and that even the prospect of being disfellowshipped has already cost me financially due to the emotional stress it has caused. I can show that such an assertion will also cause me to be held in contempt, as encouraged by the statements within the Watchtower that tell those in the congregations to view me as a person who is;

  rebelling against Jehovah w93 10/1 p.19
  presumptuous w80 8/1 p.20
  loathsome, odious, filthy, to be hated and detested, w52 10/1 p.599
  spreading lies and misinformation, siding with Satan w00 5/1 p.9
  a self-seeking heretics not to even be greeted w83 4/1 p.24
  a spiritual drunkards wallowing in doctrinal vomit w90 1/15 p.28

  I hope I have made it clear that by Watchtower, Bible and legal standards I should no longer be harassed and that no announcement should ever be made about me to any congregation associated with the Watchtower Society.

  I also request that my letter for the annulment of my baptism dated 20/12/2005 be reconsidered. I understand that you believe my signing of subsequent written contracts with the Watchtower Society to indicate that I was reaffirming the contract made as a minor. My inclusion of the practices of cults that use misinformation as a form of persuasive coercion was to indicate that even as an adult I was continuing to suffer mental bondage up until the beginning of 2005 when I first requested for Luc to annul my baptism. I believe it is possible for a man to annul a marriage 20 years after the event when he finds he was unknowingly married to a man that had undertaken a sex change, as the length of time in a contract is not always the primary issue. If you would like for me to supply more examples of dishonesty within the publications I can supply scores of pages of such information. I believe BR XXX and probably BR LAWYER have in their possession Jehovah's Witnesses, Blood Transfusions, and the Tort of Misrepresentation by Kerry Louderback-Wood, and that is a good place to start in order to see the way in which Watchtower publications use selective quoting to lead its members to false conclusions.

  It is perfectly clear that Holy Spirit does not direct the Watchtower Society, as shown by ongoing major change to doctrine. Nor does it direct the elders involved in judicial committees. If you believed that it did in regards to disfellowshipping me the elders manual would not need to give the option of an appeal. You must also be aware that Holy Spirit does not direct the Service Department at Bethel. BR OLDTIMER was in the Service Department and in MY OLD congregation and so involved in appointing ..... as an elder in Bradbury congregation whilst I was there. That was despite ... carrying on a seven year affair at the time of his appointment with his wife’s best friend. Clearly it is an organisation led by men. Please do not take it upon yourselves to judge me and affect the relationship I have with my extended family for the remainder of my life. Leave that up to Jehovah.

  Regards
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  22

  Lurkers:How To Leave The Organization Quietly And Discreetly

  by metatron in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  an ever growing number of witnesses would like to leave the organization - but how?

  you may have an extended family "in the truth".. all your "friends" ( and that word "friends" deserves to be put in quotes ) may be "in the truth".

  you may not be in any position to make.

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  jwfacts

  Good topic Metatron.

  I couldnt really fade because of knowing too many people and being related to too many, so had no end of harrassment from the elders. But I spent the last few years preparing my mind for being shunned, so now it has happened it is actually a relief. One really important thing was to make new friends before the shunning. I have heard of too many people that got d/f without knowing any non JWs and it was emotional hell for them for a long time.

  Mr Beaker, welcome, nice to see another person from NSW.