Posts by Ingenuous

83

Toasting AuldSoul

by jst2laws in

jw
friends

about two minutes ago the announcement was made that auldsoul was "no longer one of jehovah's witnesses".

he and jst2laws one minute ago toasted to celebrate.

please join us.

I can't do it. Am I supposed to?

by Ingenuous in

my parents are acting loopy.

not toward me, but toward my sister.

she's not doing anything wrong, just experiencing the normal ups and downs and unplanned surprises of marriage.

Thank you all for that much needed slap upside the head! Mkr, Xandria, thank you for reminding me of my rights and responsibilities. Apostate Kate and Sherry, thank you for your compassion. AuldSoul, thank you for sharing your wisdom.

I did visit a therapist after the last incident with my parents, which was just under 6 weeks ago. In addition to keeping the keys, I stopped visiting my parents for about 3 weeks. I wanted to stay away from them for a while. That was a big step for me, since, after letting my folks know I was leaving the Org, my calls and visits have been more out of guilt and obligation than because I actually enjoyed visiting them.

My weeping and pleading during that "discussion" was a special low point. I was so completely unprepared for their behavior and so shocked that my parents weren't the people I thought they were. After leaving and getting myself together, I decided that I could no longer trust them. I decided that religion would no longer be an acceptable topic for discussion. Instead of calling them multiple times a day and spilling all the details of my thoughts and deeds - as I'd done all my life - I call a couple times a week and keep my plans and activities to myself.

It took writing this thread and reading your responses to refine things for me. While I can trust them to come through in an emergency and to feel what they consider love for me, I can no longer trust them in specific areas: with my more fragile emotions, with my privacy. And I've learned that when I disagree on an area as important to them as religion, they don't address the issues, but resort to attacking my motives and my integrity. They've got sore points that make them nasty when touched.

So now I have to decide if that's enough. I realized after reading the replies that part of the problem is that I'm still trying to hold to the old terms of our relationship: I do what they want, try to anticipate their desires and take responsibility for making them happy, and they will, in turn, give me their approval and displays of affection. A big part of the disappointment I feel after a decent conversation with them is from the fact that, unlike them, I can't act like everything is normal, and I know things will never be the way they were, no matter how much I want to get back to that fuzzy, nebulous, unbordered blob of codependency we called a relationship. If I'm going to maintain this relationship, I have to write new terms: I love them for the good I see in them and know is there and refuse to feed the sides of their personalities that have been warped by this religion. I have to inject some space into the relationship and, while giving up the responsibility for their emotions and happiness, take up the responsibility of caring for my own, independent from and regardless of anyone else.

And to just think that four months ago, everything was honky-dory and I was happily ensconced in an immature relationship with my parents and a spiritually abusive relationship with the Org!

15

I can't do it. Am I supposed to?

by Ingenuous in

my parents are acting loopy.

not toward me, but toward my sister.

she's not doing anything wrong, just experiencing the normal ups and downs and unplanned surprises of marriage.

Ingenuous

My parents are acting loopy. Not toward me, but toward my sister. She's not doing anything wrong, just experiencing the normal ups and downs and unplanned surprises of marriage. Instead of giving her credit for how far she's come in her personal development - learning lessons she she spend 20 years missing the point of - by living with her choices, accepting the consequences, and doing her best with what she's got, they harp on her bad choices, refusing to let go, move on, and deal with present reality. While all that is rough on my sister, it's working pretty well for me - I seem to be under the folks' radar and they've taken a break from emotionally blackmailing me over my choice to leave the Org.

I've been told that I should enjoy the break, enjoy the seeming sanity in our relationship for the moment, and not worry about what may come in the future. But I've found it impossible to do.

During the last "blow-out" with my folks, they showed me such disrespect and insulted me so deeply, that I was in too much shock at the time to react rationally to it. I just sat there and blubbered while they walked all over me. Begging - through tears - to be heard, to be respected, to be given the dignity of having my own feelings meant nothing. I wasn't nasty or disrespectful - I just told them not to put words in my mouth or thoughts in my head, to listen to me and believe me when I told them how I felt and thought. Nothing - they had drawn their conclusions and nothing could change that. I learned that my father had gone behind my back and engaged in a reconnaissance mission to my apartment when I wasn't there to see if he could find anything incriminating. (Since he didn't "rifle through any papers", he figures it was OK. And, no, my parents no longer have keys to my apartment.) Of course, their perspective is that they are just loving parents and I'm going to have to learn things "the hard way" since I won't take advantage of their wisdom.

So now, when they speak cheerfully when I call, when they act normal, when they do things that would normally make me feel safe around them, I can't buy it. My trust in them has been completely demolished. I cannot enjoy their seeming pleasantness when I don't know if it's a put on, a set-up, a ploy. I can't relax when I don't know if they will attempt to confront me tomorrow, when I know that, at the sound of a single sentence from the elders, they will treat me as if I'm dead. My father has told me plainly that they will have nothing to do with me if I DA or am DF'd. I have no interest in or need to do either, but just typing that sentence makes me wonder why I bother trying so hard to maintain this relationship.

I want to tell them what I'm feeling, but I've already been ignored once, and that in the midst of tears and pleading. Am I missing it? Am I too prideful or bitter or heardhearted? Is there some joy or blessing in this situation that I'm preventing myself from experiencing?

78

WTS Letter to Congregations re. HLC

by doinmypart in

.

the christian congregation of jw sent a letter to all congregations regarding hospital liaison committees.

this letter will be read the week of january 30, 2006. i can email a pdf of the letter to someone willing to post it here.

Ingenuous

It is wise to seek HLC assistance, especially in the following situations:
…
Pregnant sisters: Complications can arise throughout pregnancy. Identifying an experienced, cooperative doctor and medical facility in handling situation involving hemorrhage or other blood-related situations can save valuable time, often safeguarding the health and life of the sister and her child.

This makes me so mad - a carry-over from my (brief) days as a doula, I guess. As if an expectant mom doesn't have enough to worry about. Pregnant women already have to deal with hospitals treating them like problems to be fixed. Now sisters are supposed to make arrangements with the HLC so a bunch of unknowledgable, misguided non-professionals can invade the personal territory of pregnancy and childbirth. Women have no right to privacy since a natural process unique to women is now fair-game for the Compliance Police.

39

A concerted effort during a watchtower study?

by mkr32208 in

was thinking about this today!

what we need to come up with is something like crazies 586/7 list from watchtower sources showing the kings list.

then next time they have a prophecy watchtower study we could all go to different halls where no one would know us and have a prepared answer typed up with watchtowerese language something like;.

Ingenuous

What does bttt mean?

Bump To The Top - On forums where messages are listed based on activity, those with the most recent replies are put at the top of the list of threads. People will "bump" a thread to move it to the top of the listing where it's more likely to be seen. Doesn't really work that way on this forum, though the folder changes color when additions have been made since your last visit.

9

Simple Proof of WTS claims to be "Inspired" Prophet

by crazies in

(deutrernomy 18:20-22)

however, the prophet who presumes to speak in my name a word that i have not commanded him to speak or who speaks in the name of other gods, that prophet must die.

21 and in case you should say in your heart: how shall we know the word that jehovah has not spoken?

Ingenuous

Nicely done, crazies. I'm saving that post.

15

BABIES ON THE WAY!

by colorado5591 in

i am so happy!

i have looked up alot of information on cainine whelping that seems helpful but do any of you have any advice or personal experiences in the doggie birthing process?

i still feel kinda nervous about the whole deal.. .

Ingenuous

It's great that you're researching, reading, and asking for advice - keep it up. However, I'd avoid asking questions on certain boards - like Petfinder - because you will be flayed alive for not having her spayed before now.

One thing you can work on - if you haven't already - is finding good homes for all the pups before they're born. Talk to potential owners and meet them, if possible, so you know the pups will be taken care of well and will be in their homes for a long time - hopefully for the rest of their lives.

You may want to purchase a book on the process so you have a reference at hand during the big event. It also wouldn't hurt to know the location of the closest emergency vet's office.

Getting Mama spayed after the birth is still a good idea, as it will cut down the risks of some very nasty illnesses in the future.

39

A concerted effort during a watchtower study?

by mkr32208 in

was thinking about this today!

what we need to come up with is something like crazies 586/7 list from watchtower sources showing the kings list.

then next time they have a prophecy watchtower study we could all go to different halls where no one would know us and have a prepared answer typed up with watchtowerese language something like;.

Ingenuous

I told those bastards to leave me alone...

LOL

The only problem is that - if any of the Halls I've been in are any indication - the response would be:

Conductor: "Thank you, Sister Ingenuous. By the way, could someone correct the sister's math and give us the right date for the fall of Jerusalem. Yes, sister?"

Four-year-old prompted by her parents: "607!"

Conductor: "Thank you, sister. Now, moving on to the next subheading..."

13