Ignoring other Verses of Scripture is typical of the silly apostates and the rebellious apostate types. do you conveniently overlook the Passages in the Gospels where Christ CLEARLY indicated, as you call it, "drudge and tension and pressure"??? "agonize to get in the narrow door" and "narrow road to life" (in other words not all that easy and convenient every single second) and ahhh "pick up your torture stake" (not portable CD player or IPod or tennis racket) "and follow Me continually" and Paul said "bear His reproach" and Peter: "if the righteous are BARELY saved, what chance do the ungodly and sinner have?" easy to forget all Verses of Scripture that deal with the matter, honestly. typical of the deranged Korah-like apostates. read the Bible all the way through more carefully, why don't you. without using Jehuda's pen-knife, when it suits you. you think Noah and his family had it all that easy?? wake up. and Christ said "just like the days of Noah" (Matthes 24,25, etc) so there's a balance to this "easy light load" stuff. there are people who find "refreshment" in Jehovah's congregation and peace and love and unity, not perfect of course, but free of worries that the unbelieving world generally have. Bush and Terrorism? God's Kingdom, hunny. later.
sweetscholar
JoinedPosts by sweetscholar
-
144
Is repititive imprinting of ideas a primary cult tactic?
by hubert inin a post by syn that lady lee has brought up again, there is this statement by syn.
i could underline my watchtower in 10 minutes, tops, and be sure that all the answers were right.
many esteemed researchers have shown that repetitive imprinting of ideas is a primary cult tactic, and i tend to agree with them.
-
-
-
144
Is repititive imprinting of ideas a primary cult tactic?
by hubert inin a post by syn that lady lee has brought up again, there is this statement by syn.
i could underline my watchtower in 10 minutes, tops, and be sure that all the answers were right.
many esteemed researchers have shown that repetitive imprinting of ideas is a primary cult tactic, and i tend to agree with them.
-
-
sweetscholar
you're point with that obviously is that it says not just "apostles and elders" but also "together with the whole congregation" and from that you surmise that there was no centralized authority. jumping the gun a bit I see. cuz notice what that part was talking about, not a heavy doctrinal decision, but in "favoring sending chosen men from among them to Antioch with Paul and Barnabas." So in a sense it's just the elders there REPRESENTING the whole congregation anyway, and if the the whole congregation had a part in that, it's not specifically in that Verse referring actually to the circumcision issue decision, and the other things mentioned a few verses later.
You cannot deny that it's the "elders and apostles" that are emphasized throughout these chapters in the matter of crucial decision making and directing and, as some might say, "imposing" stuff on the rest of the congregations. 23 "The Apostles and Elders (governing or leading body) to the BROTHERS in Antioch and Syria and Cilicia who are of the nations (Gentiles):...For the Holy Spirit AND WE OURSELVES (not the congregations in general, come off it already, but referring specifically in that immediate context to the Apostles and Elders of the First Century) have favored adding no further burden to you, EXCEPT THESE NECESSSSSSSAAAARRRRYYYY THINGS (not suggestions or optional things, but NECESSARY THINGS!) to keep abstaining from things stangled, and idols, and blood, and fornication."
it was specifically there the Governing Body Elders and NOT all the congregations deciding that. top down, not bottom up, which is why your Baptist Blockheads love to have it. democracy did NOT exist in the first century church. not really. it was more THEOcratic (top down). look throughout all of Paul's Letters, and James'. directions were given. there was no arguing it. they were binding on those local churches. Corinth, Rome, Ephesus, Galatia, Philipi, Thessalonika, and so forth. the point is that you believe what you WANT to believe, not necessarily what all the internal Biblical evidence (both "Testaments") actually FULLY indicate. people have this Korah-like rebellious independent-minded attitude, and the Bible warns agains that why?? FOR A REASON. look in the mirror and look at all your writings about this subject, and you can see why. later.
-
144
Is repititive imprinting of ideas a primary cult tactic?
by hubert inin a post by syn that lady lee has brought up again, there is this statement by syn.
i could underline my watchtower in 10 minutes, tops, and be sure that all the answers were right.
many esteemed researchers have shown that repetitive imprinting of ideas is a primary cult tactic, and i tend to agree with them.
-
-
sweetscholar
you reaise some deep issues. and I promise (if you're sincere about this whole thing with the spirit of learning from the matter, as I myself am trying to do as well, instead of a puffy huffy I know I'm right attitude). let's try to study this together in a congenial spirit. cuz I agree it's not always so black and white every second. but this is the point (and I can't get too deep into the matter at present, but soon I will): IT SAYS CLEARLY IN ACTS 15:2 that it was NOT this silly Baptist-like democratic (from the bottom up) thing, but a THEOCRATIC top down orderly thing, "APOSTLES AND ELDERS" not just any average Christian witness and congregant. I know that Korah-like (why is it in Jude as a warning for true Christians that whole matter with Korah, Dathan, and Abiram, who rebelled and thought too that they didn't have to humbly subit to Jehovah's appointed LEADERSHIP ??? Jude makes the warning for Christians too. I wonder why, if it's all independent Baptist Baloney ways that are ok with God. hmmmm Jude 11, compare 2 Peter 3:7). Also, I don't think that the beloved Watchtower said that it's ONLY "circumcision", but I agree with you, the Mosaic Law in general, but TYPIFIED AT THE TIME with the circumcision issue. cuz that's specifically what was brought up. but notice PLEASE. and yes Roman Catholics have used the same argument for THEIR church (but the only problem is that Romanism is so pagan and warped and worldly and corrupt that they can't be God's true church), that it says "the Holy Spirit AND US" meaning the Apostles and Elders, "saw fit to add nothing unto you BUT THIS, abstain from blood, fornication, idolatry, etc". not just "oh the Holy Spirit guides me individually" blah blah blah. especially nto in the Last Days. in pivotal times in history, the Lord Yahawah NEVER worked in such a chaotic conflicting confusing way, but always in an organized centralized arrangement. You'll tell me that Mosaic Israel was not organized and arranged and binding????? Read Exodus and Leviticus a bit more closely why don't you. Noah told his family EXACTLY what needed to be done as far as the measurements of the Ark and the food and the lower beasts, etc. You see it in Acts and in the Letters for the True Christian Church too. First Century Biblical Christianity does NOT resemble the Southern Baptist Convention or the "Independent Baptist Churches" or the "United Pentecostals" or Presbyterians who fellowship with Lutherans on committees. I'm not saying that it resembed the elaborate weird heirarchy of the Roman Catholic Church either. You don't see the terms "cardinals" or "arch-bishops" or "pope" or "his holiness" or "father McNeal" or "diocese" or "Mass" or "Vatican" or "Holy See" or whatever else. but again, it was NOT so loose and independent and chaotic in the first century either. Paul and Peter and James and John directed things, buddy. human nature tends to want to rebel against authority. people never learn from history. "do not even say a greeting to such a man" is for what then? "do not murmur" is for what then? "beware the rebellious talk of Korah" is for what then??? "BE OBEDIENT TO THOSE TAKING THE LEAD IS FOR WHAT THEN"???? son, it's NOT just "one or two verses". it's a host of passages and principles, from both "Testaments". but anyway, as I said, I appreciate your thoughts, though I disagree with like 98% of what you're saying. and I'll get more into the specifics of what you brought up at later dates, as I do more research both in the Word of God, and in some dictionaries and volumes that I have, both Witness and non-Witness stuff. but the stuff I said so far is really enough for you and others to undestand (Acts 15:2) that it was not this free-for-all thing that you're saying, but leadership and direction and central oversight, with decisions that were BINDING on all the local congregations. there's no getting around those hard stubborn facts. not matter how much Scripture juggling or twisting or smooth sophistry you may use at times. but we'll talk more about it. thanks for correspondence. peace.
-
42
exjw, is there a script
by carla inis there any one scripture (or more) that really suprised you once you took the wt glasses off and just read the bible as is, without all the extra literature?
-
-
sweetscholar
ignoring other Verses of Scripture is typical of the silly apostates and the rebellious apostate types. do you conveniently overlook the Passages in the Gospels where Christ CLEARLY indicated, as you call it, "drudge and tension and pressure"??? "agonize to get in the narrow door" and "narrow road to life" (in other words not all that easy and convenient every single second) and ahhh "pick up your torture stake" (not portable CD player or IPod or tennis racket) "and follow Me continually" and Paul said "bear His reproach" and Peter: "if the righteous are BARELY saved, what chance do the ungodly and sinner have?" easy to forget all Verses of Scripture that deal with the matter, honestly. typical of the deranged Korah-like apostates. read the Bible all the way through more carefully, why don't you. without using Jehuda's pen-knife, when it suits you. you think Noah and his family had it all that easy?? wake up. and Christ said "just like the days of Noah" (Matthes 24,25, etc) so there's a balance to this "easy light load" stuff. there are people who find "refreshment" in Jehovah's congregation and peace and love and unity, not perfect of course, but free of worries that the unbelieving world generally have. Bush and Terrorism? God's Kingdom, sonny. later.
-
9
on a co-equal trinity and pagan holidays
by sweetscholar init's easy to see straws or beams or splinters in other people's eyes, and yet fail to notice the trunks and logs and things in our own eyes.
but anyway, about those emails.
there are points that are never really truly honestly addressed.
-
-
sweetscholar
what exactly are you two talking about? where DON'T you see "paragraphs"?? unless for some oddball reason, on your end it's not showing as paragraphed. cuz in my screen, what I wrote is clearly divided off in sections of paragraphs. no joke. so I don't know.
-
144
Is repititive imprinting of ideas a primary cult tactic?
by hubert inin a post by syn that lady lee has brought up again, there is this statement by syn.
i could underline my watchtower in 10 minutes, tops, and be sure that all the answers were right.
many esteemed researchers have shown that repetitive imprinting of ideas is a primary cult tactic, and i tend to agree with them.
-
-
sweetscholar
was Christ always "mild" when yelling and calling religious hypocrites "sons of Satan" and "vipers" and "full of corruption"??? what about Stephen when he was dissing big time the Jews in front of him "hypocrites, which one of the prophets did your forefathers NOT persecute?"" and Paul called them "ministers of satan". one thing that I notice, which is so transparant, is that you'll pick at me and my supposed "tones" and leave alone the rude arrogant dopey tones of the people that YOU AGREE WITH !!! it's laughable. and biased like crazy. so convenient. you think your compadres have so sweet and perfect and loving and gentle in words and tones?? is that a joke? but you won't say one word against them, cuz why? cuz, you agree with them and want to present yourself united with them. I know human nature and human hypocrisy only too well. did I say that I was necessarily perfect? but it's a losing man's argument when all you can do is harp on and exaggerate "tones" (real or imagined) and not really honestly address the ACTUAL POINTS being made. and then to give a pass at the rude obnoxious crap that's put out by your fellow anti-JWs makes your own credibility even lower. even if you do have a little bit of a point about my manner. (though of course, as I said, I could be worse. you don't know how I am with others that are not demonized apostate types, but are more neutral. I'm way more gentle and patient than I would be with guys like you. yes, it's true, not all who go on this site are necessarily apostate types necessarily. and I could come off a bit more seasoned with salt and tactful. granted. but let's not forget that Christ and His Apostles did not always pussy-foot around. so there's a balance. and again, try to focus more on the actual specific points. rather than dogmatically whining and harping on my language or tones evey second. cuz the whining and complaints get old and tired and transparant after a while. but your point is taken. bye.
-
144
Is repititive imprinting of ideas a primary cult tactic?
by hubert inin a post by syn that lady lee has brought up again, there is this statement by syn.
i could underline my watchtower in 10 minutes, tops, and be sure that all the answers were right.
many esteemed researchers have shown that repetitive imprinting of ideas is a primary cult tactic, and i tend to agree with them.
-
-
sweetscholar
there's something in the Bible that DOES indicate the reporting of preaching and time and whatever. Read carefully the Gospels. sending them out by twos. there's some stuff there. you only see what you want to see anyway. here it is, in a general sense: Mark 6:7-30: "Now He summoned the twelve, and He initiated sending them out two by two,...Further He said to them 'Wherever you enter into a home, stay there until you go out of that place. And wherever a place will not hear you, on going out from there skake the dust of your feet of a witness to them.' So they set out and PREACHED in order that people might repent....And the apostles gathered together before Jesus and REPORTED to Him ALL ("all" means "all", like what happened, where it happened, when it happened, and how much "time" involved) things they had done and TAUGHT." reporting their preaching activity. read the Bible MORE CAREFULLY AND THOUGHTFULLY AND HONESTLY AND CONSCIENTIOUSLY than you have. Luke 9:10: "And when the apostles RETURNED they RECOUNTED ("reCOUNT"? "count time" too? hmmm) to Him what things they had DONE" (in the preaching work). the point, Huby, is that there is at least SOME Scriptural basis for 'REPORTING' time and activity that was done in preaching Christ's Kingdom to neighbors and public and house to house. you just never saw it. are you sincere about this? in other words, are you willing to concede that maybe JUST MAYBE what I just showed you and expounded might have SOME validity to this "time" thing that you keep griping about? the point is, and this is undeniable, the example that's there is that they were sent by "twos" and preached and taught, and "REPORTED" and "RECOUNTED" in an organized way what was done and "all things" that took place in that preaching activity. how boot dat? anymore questions? (I've read the Bible over 20 times in 4 different languages. the only reason I say that, cuz I know it sounds boasting, is to show you that I did not just fall of a banana boat yesterday, and that I do NOT just buy and eat everything the Watchtower writes like a robot. my thinking and analyses just happens to agree like 99.999999% with the publishing arm of JWs. and I know the Bible pretty well. and I keep on learning new things all the time. I know who God the Father is and His Beloved Son and Messiah is. and what the Kingdom is. it's this simple. Only Christ's Blood and Kingdom are mankind's only hope. only hope out of death and the grave. not the UN, not Bush, not elections, votes, banks, protests, politics, Hollywood, or whatever else. can we get an Amen to that? again, there was "reporting" and "counting" with the preaching apostles, so why not follow that example overall??
-
144
Is repititive imprinting of ideas a primary cult tactic?
by hubert inin a post by syn that lady lee has brought up again, there is this statement by syn.
i could underline my watchtower in 10 minutes, tops, and be sure that all the answers were right.
many esteemed researchers have shown that repetitive imprinting of ideas is a primary cult tactic, and i tend to agree with them.
-
-
sweetscholar
obviously it was "exclusivist" since those who arrogantly rejected Noah and his message were EXCLUDED from the Ark, as you mentioned "the doors were shut", and so, duhh, the unbelieving people were thereby "excluded". what's "not in the Bible" about that??? God NEVER used conflicting sects and cults and groups in Bible history. He always used an organized centralized arrangement. In the case of Noah and his family it was small church, true, but that doesn't matter. whether it was 8 people or 800. the principle is there. Israel was centralized with the Levites and Judah and so forth. Levitical RULES binding on all the tribes, etc. First Century Christianity, read Acts 15, 16, decisions BINDING on all the local congregations. "The Holy Spirit AND WE OURSELVES (ELDERS AND APOSTLES)...." but the thing with Noah, I don't know, it's like you can't see what's so obvious and simple.
IF the story is true, then that means, logically and obviously, that those who did not follow Noah, and join in with him and his faith and obedience and activity, were DESTROYED BY GOD, excluded from the Ark of Salvation or "Church of Noah" at that time in history, and were condemned. Logically you know that people at that time, who did not listen to Noah, had their own belief in God, and even in the God of Enoch. Remember Enoch? who preached and "walked with God." And those people had ideas about Adam and Eve and Jehovah and their own personal beliefs. but they didn't line up with the only true religion at that time in history. listen, let's stop this. cuz you KNOW that people looked at Noah and his family as weird and cultic and presumptuous and "exclusivist" too. you really need Verses of Scripture to spell that out to you too?
when (IF THE STORY IS TRUE) it says that people didn't listen to Noah and were destroyed by God, because the world back then was so filthy and violent? so as it says in Ecclesiastes, there's nothing new under the sun. one thing that man learns from history that man never learns from history. and you're living proof. cuz you do the same foolish lame-brain thing that that pre-Flood Noachian world did. reject logic and truth and purity and structure and authority, despite the miserable mess of a world around you. thinking that God is ok with all religions or personal choices, "as long as you don't hurt anyone." by the way, you don't even believe the Bible. so what credibility do you have with anyting regarding this anyway?? you already admitted that you doubt the Noah's Ark and Flood accounts. so what do you hold to? nothing. because if you stand for nothing, you'll fall for anything. ultimately. again, if the doors were shut, as the Bible DOES say clearly, then how is that NOT "exclusivism" and how is that not "only true religion and arrangement at the time in history"?? don't say "the Bible does not say that", when it's obviously there. God destroyed the world that did not listen to Noah and his family-church. but saved only Noah and his family in that humungous Ark. what further proof do you need?? -
144
Is repititive imprinting of ideas a primary cult tactic?
by hubert inin a post by syn that lady lee has brought up again, there is this statement by syn.
i could underline my watchtower in 10 minutes, tops, and be sure that all the answers were right.
many esteemed researchers have shown that repetitive imprinting of ideas is a primary cult tactic, and i tend to agree with them.
-
-
sweetscholar
you seem a bit over-sensitive and not understanding that Christ "hurled pejoratives" too. you just want your ears tickled and your own whining silly feelings confirmed by the snakes. you're NOT just some neutral dude from the street. you're either an apostate fool or a fool with apostate influences. if you side with a cockeyed freak like doofis DUDdy, then where's your credibility with anything?? you're obviously biased like crazy from the word go. you'll pick and exaggerate supposed negatives, and ignore any substantive points and you never addressed that. duh, dont' you see that that Christ called them snakes, not I? Christ used strong "pejoratives" too first. so did Paul, and Elijah. when dealing with apostate pagan creeps such as yourself. oops sorry too strong for a sissified panty waiste "nice" guy like you. grow some thicker skin, and some real objectivity while you're at it. this message is to YOU in particular, cuz you've raised such a whining fuss about my tones and language and kissed the butts of silly nuts like doofis goofis and that guy with his quotations of things. independent and Korah-like. spare me. I know that my "tones" could have been gentler, and for that part of it I do really apologize. but I also know that my tones and language could be even worse. I notice that you'll hold back criticizing and nit-picking at the rude jerky tones of the people that YOU AGREE WITH !!!! duhh. you think I don't see that?? very convenient. but I take that with a grain of salt. why don't you. and focus a bit more on the actual POINTS being raised, instead of harping like a pansy on "tones" so much. tones which were not even all that bad. in this message I admit it's worse from me, because I've had enough of your silly dopey lame-brain biased remarks. and you're NOT a neutral party, as I said. you're more in the camp of the snakes and demonized apostates that you give yourself credit for. so it's not so black and white. Christ called religious hypocrites and fools names too. and so did Paul and Isaiah. what do we do with that? come on, nicey nicey, answer that one. yeah, thought so. good day. and doofis, why don't you put a different picture on your profile?? one where you look at least half human? I mean, really. you look and act more insane that I could ever hope to be. living in mud? and playing in the sun baked sand and beach? you have some winners in Australia. yikes. just kidding. I'm sure you're down to earth in many ways. and probably funny too. (maybe a little too down to earth, but whatever.) as I said, all "Adamites" are screwed up. it's a matter of taking the good with the bad. and being fair-minded. something I see so little of in this site. but we'll see. bye.
-
144
Is repititive imprinting of ideas a primary cult tactic?
by hubert inin a post by syn that lady lee has brought up again, there is this statement by syn.
i could underline my watchtower in 10 minutes, tops, and be sure that all the answers were right.
many esteemed researchers have shown that repetitive imprinting of ideas is a primary cult tactic, and i tend to agree with them.
-
-
sweetscholar
I won't go heavily into it right now, as I am pressed for time. you actually raised a couple of good points and questions (in a very rude arrogant insincere non-humble way though of course) about 1 John and so forth. but context and intent needs to be understood. and OTHER VERSES (in both "Testaments") need to be carefully considered. Read Acts 15-19 and read and grasp that the TRUE Christian Church of the First Century was ORGANIZED and CENTRALIZED, with decisions and TEACHINGS by the "Elders and Apostles" (the Governing Body at that time) that were BINDING on the rest of the local congregations. not just an "interpretation" either, but what's actually showing there. John's words have to do with not being needed to be taught "Know the Lord" (compare Hebrews 8:11. there's more to that Verse that I will delve in a bit later. but what do we do with all the countless Verses in the Greek New Testament where we see and read "teachers" and "learned from me" and "the Holy Spirit AND WE OURSELVES, have directed you....." and so forth? ignore them? use Jehudi's pen-knife on them?
why is that whole thing in Acts 14,15,16 called the First "Christian Council"? sounds organized and centralized to me. now don't misunderstand. I'm not saying that it's quite like the Roman Catholic Church with their popes and cardinals and silly councils. they think they trace their "church" to Christ and the Apostles. But in a way, they have the right idea that true Biblical Christianity is not this chaotic cockeyed mess that we see in Protestantism. God does not work that way, and never really did. But the Mormons go too far and say that true Christianity died with the death of the last Apostle (John). that's not true either. True Christianity, even underground and disorganized, always existed with small groups and individuals, scattered. it's just that in the last days, it was restored as more organized. "knowledge being increased" as it were and so forth. yes, I know that you don't think (or have serious doubts) that it's with the witnesses of Jehovah and whatever, but my point is that it's NOT the Roman Catholic system.
Romanism traces its true origin to pagan Emperor Constantine, the arch-heretic Athanasius of Alexandria, and that godless mess called the Council of Nicea. Between 312 A.D. and 325 A.D. so we know it's not them. again the point is that there are many verses that indicate teaching authority NOT instead of the Holy Spirit but with it. because how many of you Protestant blockheads and independent types claim to have God's Spirit and claim to be going only by the Bible, yet teach conflicting things? that goes on galore in apostate "Protestantism". Lutherans teach one way, Baptists another, and Presbyterians still another. Pentecostals teach this that and the other, while denying the other of the other that Methodists insist on. Yeah, real Christian soundness and unity. God being the author of that crap? that confused and confusing mish mosh? everyone has become his own interpreter, claiming to be guided by God's Spirit of Truth, and has in effect become his own pope. not that the office of pope is valid. (because that's a distortion on the Catholic Church's part, as we know) but the point of an anointed teaching authority and arrangement.
oh, and as for doofis daddy. again, sweetie, look in the mirror and look at your mud hut life and see who really need "pity". lol.
anyway, I like to be challenged. believe it or not. sharpens skills, and makes me see things in interesting lights. and believe it or not, I am willing to adjust. cuz you never know. but as it stands now, I'm convinced of the purity and structure (overall) despite their imperfections and kookiness at times, of the JWs. lata.