in this age of violence with the san bernardino and france massacres sometimes it's good to reflect on the wise words of the peace advocates among us who proposed a better solution in bringing a more civil society to our universe.
john lennon, martin luther king jr. - people who stood up for equal rights and world peace and denounced violence and war - no matter how that violence occurs.
please feel free to comment on stories of john lennon on this thread and feel free to post any you tubes of his music that you may have enjoyed through the years.
Great thread...not much to add.
Yes, the man made personal mistakes, and that is the point. We all do/did. What he believed in was greater than what most humans are capable of doing by themselves as individuals, but in aggregate is the very thing that allows humanity to advance.
R.I.P. John
Jason
paul knew that torah with all its rituals and sacrifices did not originate with god (jeremiah 7:22; 8:8), hence he warned christians to guard against deceptive philosophy that would take them back to torah.
(colossians 2:8 compare 2:11, 16, 17) in view of the over-all view of the bible, there is no excuse to use the word philosophy with any negative connotation.
jws built their stand on philosophy based on this wrong (negative) use of the word philosophy found in colossians 2:8.. the greek word philosophi a means love of wisdom.
As an anecdote, this is a direct quote I received from a, (very intelligent), JW friend in an email two years ago:
"A 19th-century German poet said “Philosophy and religion are irreconcilable.” Philosophy is based on human experience and puts human interests foremost. True religion is based upon divine revelation. First and foremost, it revolves around the interests of our Creator, not around the 'topics that are of greatest concern to man'".
This quote exists nowhere other than WT literature to my knowledge, and true to WT form, does not cite the source. The context behind her quoting this to me was an exchange we had that raised her cognitive dissonance to levels she obviously could not handle.
JWs don't even understand what philosophy is, even the intelligent ones.
d4g
all religion is flawed because its led by man.
jw is not bad religon if it changed some of its doctrines and thoughts.
if it didnt "shun" members and "worldly people.
What JWdaughter said.
d4g
i've found it interesting that- imho- most of the politically vocal ex-jw's at this website seem to lean left.
i'm personally pretty centered- right on some issues, left on others, but overall have a pretty cynical view of all political/religious leaders.
i find it somewhat ironic that people who leave such a dogmatic group like the witnesses become so politically dogmatic.
kaik - So, my experience on JWN is that people have not only right-wing view, but they are extremely defensive when they get challenged or even when you slightly disagreed with them. To them, everyone else is wrong and only their political stance was right.
Emotional responses are typically the product of ignorance.
d4g
born to be conned - new york times.
when people want to believe what they want to believe, david sullivan, a professional cult infiltrator, told the commonwealth club of california, a public affairs forum, in july 2010, they are very hard to dissuade.
and the reason it happens (and often happens to the most intelligent people) is that human nature is wired toward creating meaning out of meaninglessness..
People have a strong innate desire to make sense of the world. Which is why they choose to believe something that on the surface provides them the answer to this immensely complex field of subject matter. People are often committed to the KISS principle and believe a simple answer is best, even when it does not answer everything upon closer examination, or simply fails. This the first point as to why people choose to believe nonsense.
The second point the article brings out is that of self-preservation. No one likes to admit they have been duped, especially when it means giving up point #1.This is when cognitive dissonance hits, and they run away from its painful effects.
I have experienced this firsthand when dealing with intelligent JWs. Lack of intelligence is not the problem. These points sum up the issue well.
This article should be moved to the "best of" section, if it still exists.
d4g
born to be conned - new york times.
when people want to believe what they want to believe, david sullivan, a professional cult infiltrator, told the commonwealth club of california, a public affairs forum, in july 2010, they are very hard to dissuade.
and the reason it happens (and often happens to the most intelligent people) is that human nature is wired toward creating meaning out of meaninglessness..
Good article, typical of NYT. Pegs human nature precisely.
d4g
did any of you guys disregard the wt recommendations and pursue a career.
if you answer "yes": was your journey easy?
are you happy with the end result?
"High" education? Well that is a different subject entirely, I think...;-)
As for higher education? Yes, I went to uni despite the org.'s message not to, (pre-1992, before they "softened" their view).
No, it was not always easy. Not so much because of JW lack of support, however. I had two dear JW friends that gave me support to go. I am forever grateful for that. Most of the difficulty was actually my own apprehension about going to begin with, ironically.
Yes it has been beneficial, beyond my dreams, almost 25 years later. I also recently completed an advanced degree in my field.
d4g
i've found it interesting that- imho- most of the politically vocal ex-jw's at this website seem to lean left.
i'm personally pretty centered- right on some issues, left on others, but overall have a pretty cynical view of all political/religious leaders.
i find it somewhat ironic that people who leave such a dogmatic group like the witnesses become so politically dogmatic.
Most of us are just cynical, and naturally distrust anything that traces an authoritarian path, and backs it with a propaganda machine.The WT and the (current), Republican party in the USA are both. Perhaps in other countries, (given a very different context), the left might be equally as authoritarian and propagandist, (Russia might be a good example). In a different time, (pre-Nixon), the Republicans in the USA were actually more socially liberal than the Democrats of the era.
The very term "liberal media" is a straw man invented by the conservative controlled media to set the center farther to the right. Apart from the NYT, MSNBC and scant few other sources, little media in the main is "liberal".
d4g
even after leaving the organization, it still lurks in the background like a shadow.. as some of you know, i met a wonderful girl a while ago (which i'm going to need your help with).
she is a catholic and i am open and very respectful of her beliefs.
however, i know there will be a time where i will have to tell her that i once was a witness... and to be honest, i'm quite scared of that.. i don't want things to be ruined between us because of a disgusting cult that i was in.
If she is even a little normal, she will not care at all about your past affiliation. If she does, you are better off without her.
d4g
as a good jw i never smoked a joint or nibbled on some brownies.
Well said, Tal.
d4g
