Posts by OnTheWayOut

49

Slightly different approach - JW my tradition

by closed in

hello everybody :) i have been visiting this forum for some time.

i noticed that many can't really free from the past in the org despite many years outside of jw.

i was awaken with a bang.

OnTheWayOut

Welcome. Before I comment, please go back and read carefully what LisaRose said on page 2. Here's the highlights I want you to catch:

LisaRose on page 2:

You and your family may be suffering in ways you don't realize, just because you are so used to it. .........
.............Many have been abused and are suffering due to hidden child sex abuse, abusive marriages, depression, missing out on educational opportunities, etc. The person sitting next to you in the Kingdom Hall may want to leave, but they look at you and think "brother Closed keeps going and he is a nice person, so it must be the right thing to do".................
Your being a part of this organization, even if it's to a lesser degree than before, validates it and gives it power and authority. You are helping to maintain the status quo of an organization you know to be corrupt, because it suits you to stay at this time.

You see the elders abusing their privileged status (and denying they even have status). I mean, it's great if you can see that and not let it bother you personally. What about your family, especially the children? Will they surely know the religion is not to be taken so seriously, or will they fall into the trap of becoming zealous adults for Jehovah, or maybe will they just suffer the ostracizing caused by JW's?

There's really no reason to stay with a corrupt organization because you like the moral standards. You can establish moral standards and try to pass them on to your family without Jehovah's Witnesses.

Now that I said that, I am a faded JW- meaning I don't attend meetings anymore and I don't disassociate. I do this simply to keep contact with JW loved ones. If I had children being raised in the lies, I would disassociate and help them see how important it is to find a better path, and how they can decide whether or not to celebrate a friend's birthday or go to college or play high school sports or YADDA YADDA!!!

Some think that even a faded JW should take a stand and "get out of her." So I get that you may make unpopular decisions with others in this group. You are free to do as you please, but you should know why so many disagree with you. Anyway, I hope the best for you.

47

Hello, this is my first post

by noralee in

jw
friends

hello, this is my first post, i would like to introduce myself and say thank you to every one on this forum, you have been a lifeline to me these last few years.. i had been a jw for 30 years when i walked away a few years ago disgusted by the treatment victims of child abuse, domestic abuse and rape receive from the wtbts.. at first i thought it was a local problem, elders personal opinions, the way they handled the situations, imperfect men etc., until i checked out jehovahs witnesses and child abuse/domestic abuse online.

that's when i realized they had the same modus operandi worldwide.

that led me here, tbuo this forum, and then to crisis of conscience, jw facts, watchtower documents, jw survey, old watchtower literature and cd s, reading a couple of steve hassans books, and more recently exiting the jw cult.. the feelings of shock, betrayal, anger at the wtbts, angry with myself for being so gullible, depression, reflection, loneliness, have taken their toll.

OnTheWayOut

That led me here, tbuo this forum, and then to Crisis of Conscience, JW Facts, Watchtower Documents, JW Survey, old watchtower literature and cd¨s, reading a couple of Steve Hassans books, and more recently Exiting the JW Cult.

Just so everyone is clear, I believe that last one you mention is the book, "EXITING THE JW CULT." Even though I am already out, I read that book and it was great. So were your other choices.

It is refreshing to read how many woke up. Welcome to the forum.

91

Is the Watchtower organisation facing the biggest crisis of its history?

by slimboyfat in

recent developments make me think they might be.

the problems they are facing are not just lack of funds but also draining authority, and the two could be a heady and explosive mix.

one of the best analyses ever written of the watchtower was a book called "trumpet of prophecy" by sociologist james beckford in the 1970s.

OnTheWayOut

I tend to agree that the GB members were, in the past, mysterious and thought of as so much better than the members. And now that image is shot to hell.

The "overlapping generation" along with other strange changes allowed many hardcore JW's to start questioning.

But it is money problems that really do it to hurt the organization among the membership. From reduced printing to layoffs to the big money grab and now there just isn't enough money for anything, the membership is seeing a lack of God's blessings.

152

If YOU had to make the decision, would you respect a JW relatives wish to refuse a blood transfusion?

by nicolaou in

a few years after i quit the meetings my mum needed her medical directive signed and witnessed and she asked if i'd do it.

i was surprised to say the least!.

i think she was just angling to include me and maybe find some lever to get me involved again.

OnTheWayOut

You can say "their choice was not to receive blood but my choice is to allow it" and that is your choice to make if they entrusted that situation to you. If they didn't want you to be able to make the choice then they shouldn't have asked you to.
There is no reason for them to be unhappy because receiving a blood transfusion while unconscious was not their choice so they have not violated any commandment anymore than someone being drugged and raped has been immoral.
If they or their religion can't differentiation that then it's their problem - you have done the right thing by saving their life and giving them the options to make future choices including how to handle the difficult choice you were put in a position to make.

Simon: That's pretty much what I will go through if my wife needs blood. But I have to disagree with "There is no reason for them to be unhappy because receiving a blood transfusion while unconscious was not their choice so they have not violated any commandment..." That frigging cult makes such a big deal of this that it doesn't play out that way. With a child, I believe it does. Deep down, every JW parent hopes the court forces the issue. But for hardcore adult dubs coming back from unconsciousness to discover they were given blood, the cult makes them feel that they have to be angry, feel like they failed.

8

Regional Conventions

by life is to short in

wondering if anyone knows when they will announce the regional conventions.

every year they always announced it the first service meeting of january.

i tied in last night by phone as my husband insists on going i do not and never will again but i like to book a room now and i refuse to use their list.

OnTheWayOut

....or book a room that can be cancelled up to a day or two before, at virtually the same rate without the Watchtower list. AS YOU MENTIONED.

7

Presentations

by punkofnice in

i remember when we used to demonstrate the suggested presentation of the propaganda from the 'kingdom ministry(r)'.. a pompus old sod of a brother(tm) once said that the presentations had been tested to ensure they worked.. i thought this was rubbish, myself........ .........any thoughts or insights, my friends?.

OnTheWayOut

"They were tested." Total rubbish.

Hey, do they have a demonstration now on cart witnessing? Do they drag the cart up on the platform and show two JW's just sitting/standing there ignoring the world passing them by? That would be grand.

8

Regional Conventions

by life is to short in

wondering if anyone knows when they will announce the regional conventions.

every year they always announced it the first service meeting of january.

i tied in last night by phone as my husband insists on going i do not and never will again but i like to book a room now and i refuse to use their list.

OnTheWayOut

They are probably not posting 2016 until they are sure that everyone has heard their congregation announcement. I couldn't imagine why your husband's congregation didn't announce their time unless they were still unsure about arrangements for that area- that does happen sometimes.

Your people in that neck of the JW world seem so over-the-top on so much. Who gives a rat's ass if it's an assembly, convention, regional, district, or a Snoozefest?

152

If YOU had to make the decision, would you respect a JW relatives wish to refuse a blood transfusion?

by nicolaou in

a few years after i quit the meetings my mum needed her medical directive signed and witnessed and she asked if i'd do it.

i was surprised to say the least!.

i think she was just angling to include me and maybe find some lever to get me involved again.

OnTheWayOut

Nic, while you and I might see it differently, people are allowed to refuse lifesaving treatments with a rational mind. I know (and sort of agree) that JW minds are not working rationally when their refusal is based on blind obedience. But many healthy humans have DNR orders (DO NOT RESUSITATE) for their own beliefs/philosophies about such. And I could honor that, kind of actually have to.

And while your mushroom/blood question is not really appropriate because it's a case of introducing the bullet compared to introducing the kevlar, there are many different answers even to that. If a sickly person wants mushrooms to die peacefully, it's a decision I could abide by. If an over-90 JW wants to just die faithfully, what kind of psychological trauma would giving blood cause to them?

It's a terrible situation. I have actually been on the scene where the sick person needs "heroic measures" and those measures will probably revive them, but there is the DNR plain as day, and there is the family member saying "Ignore it" on one side and the primary care giving family member on the other side saying "Let him go."

Heck, even my sister (who just died a few weeks ago) had a DNR and her ex-husband would have ignored it had paramedics been called a little sooner. And she would have hated him for doing that.

I get that there are many points of view on this one, and it's a tough call. But tough calls can be made different ways by different people.

152

If YOU had to make the decision, would you respect a JW relatives wish to refuse a blood transfusion?

by nicolaou in

a few years after i quit the meetings my mum needed her medical directive signed and witnessed and she asked if i'd do it.

i was surprised to say the least!.

i think she was just angling to include me and maybe find some lever to get me involved again.

OnTheWayOut

Some of you guys are really something else. One thing I learned exiting the cult was not to judge other people. I am still unsure what I will do when my wife needs life-saving blood and her JW mother is standing there. I will probably allow the blood and let them be mad at me, but secretly grateful.

But if someone else decides something else, I am not going to judge them for their decision.

21

We are not a cult!

by Londo111 in

i thought the writer here did a good job comparing the faqs of several high control groups.

hopefully this will be useful to someone out there.. http://thoughtsonthingsandstuff.com/we-are-not-a-cult/.

OnTheWayOut

Some think of a cult as being a new or unorthodox religion. Jehovah’s Witnesses have not invented a new religion. On the contrary, we pattern our worship after that of the first-century Christians, whose example and teachings were recorded in the Bible. YADDA YADDA!!

I love how any cult group tries to find the common misconceptions about cults and say "That doesn't apply to us." Sorry, I already learned that a cult doesn't need to hit all the markers of a cult, and being "new" really isn't one of them anyway.

Some think of a cult as being a dangerous religious sect with a human leader. Jehovah’s Witnesses do not look to any human as their leader. Rather, we adhere to the standard that Jesus set for his followers when he stated: “Your Leader is one, the Christ.”—Matthew 23:10.

Bullshit. They obey these guys, but claim they are not the leaders, just those taking the lead. They claim they are not inspired, but just spirit-directed. They cannot walk the line like that. Total bullshit.