OnTheWayOut

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Posts by OnTheWayOut

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  30

  For Witnesses Who Want To Leave Fade, Disassociate or Get Disfellowshipped?

  by minimus in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  my opinion is if possible fading is the best way to go..

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  OnTheWayOut

  It's pretty well covered here already. Different folks have different reasons for choosing different paths.
  If someone chooses to fade and it doesn't work for various reasons (usually family asking too much), they can still just exit. But if you just walk away and lose contact with family, it is very difficult to get that back.
  
  While I am a huge advocate of fading, if I had young children being indoctrinated, I would look for a path that allows them to be free to pursue education, after-school sports or music, celebrate holidays, enjoy a normal life. That path typically involves a clean break and maybe a disassociation letter.
  
  But each person needs to decide what to do.
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  24

  Anyone get the feeling that the cult is really in trouble.

  by mickbobcat in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  so all the bs and hyperbole aside, to me it really looks like the cult is in trouble.

  shrinking member, selling halls.

  the move to televangelism is really strange to me.

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  OnTheWayOut

  Watchtower found itself alongside of newspapers and print magazines. They are able to make a product that nobody is reading nowadays. Still, they would not care if money kept coming in. I personally believe that this giant printing corporation is not making much money on print. Further reductions in the Watchtower and Awake mags is enough evidence for me. I would bet that they are only printing enough material for the pioneer supporters of Watchtower Corporation to feel justified in continuing to support the corporation.
  
  BUT,
  Scientology finds itself with hundreds of thousands of members instead of the 4.5 million or so that they want people to believe they have. They are property rich. with such a low membership, the leader lives a richer lifestyle than the leaders of Watchtower. For over a hundred years, the GB had one goal in mind- protect and expand the corporation. But it might be possible that since GB 2.0 was filled with idiotic yes-men, they may be abandoning that effort to embrace a cult-leader lifestyle over expansion of the cult. If they shake out members that were not really contributing to their wealth, then they can sell their Kingdom Halls.
  
  I am confident that when the presses get old, they won't be replaced. They will have a similar print system to desktop publishers and will have computers print softbound Bibles on demand.
  
  All this spells a slow death for Watchtower. But I am glad that it is faster than I expected because of lawsuits and because young people have too much internet ability to discover the real truth and they leave. If the leaders would take the money that's left and run away, I would help them pack.
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  19

  Do You Support Cubans Protesting Against Communism?

  by minimus in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  some people have thrown their support for the government while others show support for the rebels.

  what’s your opinion?.

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  OnTheWayOut

  Cuba has been a dictatorship since communism took over. Cuba has many Soviet-era automobiles and many newer Asian-import vehicles, particularly buses and trucks. In 2015, the Cuban government opened the first public wi-fi hotspots in 35 public locations. It also reduced prices and increased speeds for internet access at state-run cybercafes. Less than 18 months later, nearly 40% of the population was on the internet. So that is so recent. As time has eroded the dictatorship and some Cubans have tasted a tiny bit of what the rest of the world is like, they fully realize that they have virtually no freedom to disagree with their government nor change their government. They probably found out that many poor people in backwards countries have more freedom than they do, or a better ability to acquire modern technology.

  Cuba embraces a black market society where commerce takes care of people in ways that the government has failed. So, if the people finally are able to stand up in protest to such a failed government, of course I support them.
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  22

  Did You Think The Capitol Riot Was Worse Than What Happened On 9/11?

  by minimus in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  in my lifetime 9/11 was the worst thing that i can recall.

  the effect it had was incredibly horrible!

  almost everyone seemed to know someone that was either directly or indirectly affected by this diabolical act.

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  OnTheWayOut

  "Did You Think The Capitol Riot Was Worse Than What Happened On 9/11?"

  That is apples and oranges. One was an act of outsiders while the other was an act of citizens.
  I think that what happened with the 2004 Indian Ocean earthquake and tsunami was far worse than both of the above events. World Wars and plagues of history were far worse.
  
  Whoever originated this thought of comparing these was probably attempting to minimize the Capitol Riot.
  
  
  
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  29

  The bus stop analogy

  by slimboyfat in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  suppose we were naïve observers, given the following data, and asked to draw a conclusion.

  we see people gather at a busy bus stop several times a day.

  at first one person, then another, and another, until they form a group.

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  OnTheWayOut

  All I know is that my brain hurts from following this thread.
  Is it the thread that hurt my brain or is it my brain that caused itself to be hurt by not ceasing to follow this thread? Or maybe the hurt is just a chemical signal in my brain that is always there and I just notice it when we get stuck in silly logic circles.
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  8

  My Story 2.0

  by James Jack in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jikmxk5hgdy.

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  OnTheWayOut

  SOShowdidigethere, the School is all voluntary. I can't tell you how to not rock the boat, but as a former school overseer, I knew that many members would not participate in the parts, or would only do it if they used their teen daughter or best friend as their "householder."
  
  I suggest you just blow off your talk assignments. Just don't be there. Eventually, some elder will talk to you about it. Tell him you try but you just cannot do the parts anymore- "Please take me off the school." Don't take NO for an answer. As far as rocking the boat, just tell your spouse or parent (or whoever is concerned) that you just cannot do the public speaking thing anymore since ZOOM started. Tell them there are others who are not on the school. Even if you know, don't offer names. Stay off that school.
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  41

  KH's Still All Closed- How Bad is WT doing Financially?

  by OnTheWayOut in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  most churches are back to in-person worship.

  not jehovah's witnesses.

  is watchtower still managing to fleece the flocks as the sheeple no longer get literature, no longer go to the kh, no longer walk past the donation box?

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  OnTheWayOut

  Most churches are back to in-person worship. Not Jehovah's Witnesses. What's going on?
  Is Watchtower still managing to fleece the flocks as the sheeple no longer get literature, no longer go to the KH, no longer walk past the donation box? Regardless of how they have tried to adjust the members to different styles of donations, I am sure the number one method was still dropping cash or checks in a box at Kingdom Halls and at Assembly Halls. And that is out.
  
  Are they closing congregations now? Will they be closing congregations soon? Will so many never go back to the Kingdom Hall either because Watchtower won't open the Hall or because sheeples woke up enough during ZOOM meetings that they just cannot put on meeting clothes and sit through actual meetings anymore?
  
  Any thoughts?
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  13

  Serious bible students questions about the bible

  by TTWSYF in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  many jws (and others) are serious about their biblical studies, but don't ask the right questions.

  in basic journalism one learns to ask the right questions which in my years here, i've never hear asked.. who, what, where, by what help, by whose help, why, how and when.

  these are all basic questions when researching anything that you want to write an article or paper on what ever related subject.. who wrote/created the bible?.

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  OnTheWayOut

  pistolpete, that Mormon Trilogy story is the exact way that any writings came to be decided upon for the Bible canon. Some warped people sold the idea that this book had the tiniest bit of logic to it or that another book would harm the teachings or way the priests manipulate the people.
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  9

  Is the Watchtower Organization Playing a Practical Joke on JWs?

  by Disillusioned JW in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  by a number of its teachings, rules, and practices is the wt organization playing a practical joke on jws?.

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  OnTheWayOut

  Adding to Overrated's comment- It's no joke.
  
  Watchtower was established as a giant printing corporation and the locals were allowed to fall as independent congregations and as long as they bought the books and magazines and resold them to the public. From the beginning, control was established over the independents so that they would see a need for the books and magazines. But really, they controlled their own land.

  Two major things happened to change that. First and foremost was a concern that the United States faced a possibility that profits from products that religions sell was going to be taxed. So Watchtower started charging no set amount for literature and sought "donations" for it. That sounded good, as they were a clearly established cult and cult members would contribute all their money to the cause- IN THEORY. It didn't work out quite that way.
  
  Secondly, Watchtower saw a gold mine in the quick build arrangement and remodeling of KH's. Borrow from Watchtower to build, pay loyal brothers for their equipment and building supplies at high rates, offsetting the cost with absolutely free labor and all should be fine. If a congregation ever had surplus amounts of money, tell them they needed to remodel the hall and use the quick build arrangement. That way, the construction suppliers stayed in the money.
  
  But even this wasn't enough. Congregations could eventually pay off the mortgage and despite the control of Mother, deny the need for remodeling. Remodeling wasn't much of a boon for Mother, but more for their loyal construction companies. Mother needed more and still kept losing more money on that dammed literature deal they thought would work out.

  McDonalds established themselves as the king of the real estate model for hamburger restaurants. The sales are important, but the expansion of the corporation via real estate transactions is more important to the corporation. Whether Watchtower directly copied that or just figured it out thru the quick build arrangement, soon Mother was stealing all the properties away from those that actually paid for them.
  
  The literature had to be a bit profitable to stay afloat, but it kept having to be scaled back to stay alive. Today, I have little doubt that it is a burden that only still exists because old-timers prefer printed materials and old-timers are their only real contributors of money. The magazines will soon die and most printed materials will cease as the presses get older and no modernization goes forward anymore.
  
  Back to the original subject. Doctrinal changes are designed to sell more printed materials. It doesn't work anymore, so now they just don't care. If crazy changes driven by desperation come out, they don't care if it shakes off many members. Those members were not contributing enough money anyway, and Watchtower can sell more Halls if there are less members.
  
  Edited to add- The paperback Bible could stay in existence similar to Amazon's print-on-demand. You order it and a computer prints it and binds it softbound. That's the future I see for Watchtower's printed materials. Although, they could just tell people to get a tablet Bible.
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  13

  Serious bible students questions about the bible

  by TTWSYF in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  many jws (and others) are serious about their biblical studies, but don't ask the right questions.

  in basic journalism one learns to ask the right questions which in my years here, i've never hear asked.. who, what, where, by what help, by whose help, why, how and when.

  these are all basic questions when researching anything that you want to write an article or paper on what ever related subject.. who wrote/created the bible?.

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  OnTheWayOut

  A serious look at how the Bible came to be causes atheism.

  Decisions of groups of men made hundreds of years ago were enforced and there's the Bible. Decisions were based on politics, influence, popularity, what particular writings could do to help or harm the Church. As humans, we cannot even agree on recent history, so we will never agree on how the Bible came to be what it is.
  
  If JW's really thought about it, they use the Protestant Bible without the Apocrypha, modified to their own doctrine, and instead of denying that, they pretend God had such a huge hand in making it so, despite the same people who brought them the NWT making a claim that they are not "inspired' or "infallible" but, somehow their warped translation of the Bible was guided by God.