Extremely difficult situation the .Org is in

by Lemonp in

as far as i can imagine, the .org is in a lose, lose, lose situation right now.

if jackson shows to the rc, and policy chages, then bible interpretation was changed sans-holy spirit.

policy change is an admission of guilt, not helpful in future civil court cases.

OnTheWayOut

The .Org is in a Lose, Lose, Lose situation right now.

That is true. But Australia is a small part of Watchtower. A GB member speaking to the RC can be spun and crafted so that it's not so terrible for Watchtower. It can even be spun so that the rest of the members that might hear of it feel that the GB was correct in what they did or at least has done no harm that wouldn't have happened anyway. Granted, it isn't true. But all that matters is survival in Australia and appearing good in the eyes of the worldwide membership.

But yes, it is a Lose, Lose, Lose situation. Spin and survival and trying to look good to the members are all things they would rather have avoided.

11

Crisis of Conscience

by FreeGirl2006 in

do you think that any of the clueless, amnesiacs that appeared before the rc will have a crisis of conscience over the abuse situation?

seriously, with the grilling they received from our new heroes, they would have to be sociopaths not to do some long hard thinking about the lack of empathy and compassion the borg displays as a top down policy towards abuse victims.

i can understand these idiots not having an awakening within the confines of their daily lives since they stay cloistered in their belief system, but the rc forced them into the real world with their questions and one would hope, made them think.

OnTheWayOut

Cult members are not mindless drones, despite what we joke about here. I think we tend to be over the top with jokes because most of us were once there, and we still have loved ones who are there. Changes and forced hard looks have made many of us wake up.

Of course the odds are high that some elders will look at how they were grilled and how the lawyers and the public see what was done, and decide that something is wrong with Watchtower business as usual.

I relate as one who woke up, not by rigorously defending Watchtower policy, but by tiring of that policy chipping away at my core. I can imagine someone slapped in the face by policy. While I know most will not wake up, it's hard for me to imagine an elder not taking a serious look at WTF he is defending.

39

Why I have renounced Atheism and become a believer again

by cantleave in

i have always said that if a god showed itself i would follow the evidence and renounce my atheism.

i have now seen enough to start believing again, i am so happy, i feel a inner contentment, when he connected with me i really knew it was him.

if you are not a believer you will not understand this, but trust me, look at the evidence, open your heart to him, let him in and your life will change for the better.

OnTheWayOut

“Humans are pattern-seeking story-telling animals, and we are quite adept at telling stories about patterns, whether they exist or not.”
― Michael Shermer

Patterns in snow or a cloud or even an interstellar cloud are not actually noodles.

"To understand is to perceive patterns."
- The Imaginary Foundation

Now this explains quite a bit. It reminds us that "understanding" means figuring out (or seeing) how things fit together. We extract meaning from chaos by spotting patterns. We then assign it as the signal in the noise. Believers in religion do the same thing. They find a pattern in the chaos and see meaning.

What if there is no Flying Spaghetti Monster? What if it's just your desire to see a signal in the noise? What if pointing out the average global temperature vs. the total number of pirates is just the use of faulty logic?

And Punk, I found it in toast:

82

Quality Thinking - Warning: Long Post Ahead

by Viviane in

recently, several threads have had some debate about logic, evidence, critical thinking and skepticism.

i wanted to write a post discussing those things, hopefully to clarify what those things are, why they are important and how to use those tools.

first, logic, at its core, is simply a method for how to reason validly, how to draw conclusions based on a premise.

OnTheWayOut

I didn't know just how much faulty logic I used in talks at the Kingdom Hall until I properly freed my mind. And even where I disagree with people on things now, I try to understand why they think the way they do.

One huge thing I have gained is learning what anecdotes are. Another is to have a healthy dose of scepticism.

But I don't reject things automatically just because they are difficult for my imagination - a multiverse or the big bang. Heck, even though I am atheist, I am willing to see actual non-anecdotes in the form of evidence of a creator. Until it presents, I am just not willing to embrace the gods of men.

Conspiracy theories are tough, though. Some seem to make sense, but evidence is typically just anecdotes. I mean, most religious beliefs seem born from conspiracy but evidence is hard to come by.

27

Im curious. What kind of lifestyle the GB live?

by SecretSlaveClass in

anyone ever seen pictures or the actual houses and cars the gb own?

im wondering if the live a middle class lifestyle or more like high society?

OnTheWayOut

They all worked their way up the ladder as pioneers of some sort. The alternative to their life is what everyone else at Bethel gets or go home. Regardless of how high or low their quarters seem to be, they travel anywhere and everywhere high style on the corporate clock. They are treated like movie stars / rock stars and get green handshakes. Pretty good compared to Sister Regular Pioneer at the Kingdom Hall.

25

I wonder with all this sex abuse drama if Wt would ever apologize to Bill Bowen and Barbara Anderson.

by joe134cd in

wt obviously must realize now the value of those that tried to enforce change on them.

i think if it wasn't for these people doing what they did wt would be in even more drama now.

so my question is do you ever think wt would voluntarily reinstate and publicly apologize to bill bowen and barbara anderson for all their hard work in bringing reform.

OnTheWayOut

Barb would have to stand in line behind blood policy victims and those who were promised the end by 1914, 1925, 1975, etc. Everybody who ever deserved an apology from Watchtower is still waiting.

55

The Australian Royal Commission will NOT do a damn thing to the WT!

by Calebs Airplane in

the rothschild family will not allow the aussies to take any significant action against their religious wing (mormons, jws, adventists, etc.).

the worst outcome for the borg will be a relatively small fine and a deadline to change their rules.

that is all..

OnTheWayOut

If children a a bit safer, all the better.

If the Watchtower is exposed in only Australia, great.

We wish for the moon, but may only get moon pie.

The RC will do at least "a damn thing to the WT."

25

My book......

by punkofnice in

...is now on kindle with the paperback to follow soon.. thanks to you all for your contributions.

any questions, please pm me.. .

OnTheWayOut

I will be checking it out soon. I like your sense of humor.

579

Won't get fooled again ...Moon Landing.

by The Rebel in

jw
friends

so i was fooled by the witnesses.

what can i learn from that?

not to accept things at face value but to seek out opinion and different view points.. hence my question " do you believe man landed on the moon?.

OnTheWayOut

Six manned landings and numerous unmanned landings, along with telescopes that can see things left on the moon. Twelve astronauts supposedly walked the moon and brought back rocks.

It's too much to fake the six landings, too many people involved to keep a secret, too huge a risk to fake the rock, too difficult to put up six American flags by later unmanned craft so that they can be seen. (True, Apollo 11's flag fell down, allegedly from takeoff rocket exhaust, but it is still there.)

As much as 28% of the Russian public believes the landings were faked, but that's a pride thing. The Soviet government would actively have proved such a faking if they believed in it, they had the expertise in how difficult it was because they failed to get there.

If you want to believe the very first moon landing was faked to win a Space Race, that is one thing. You could believe the technology was there, but not quite ready in 1969. You could claim the second landing (or another) put the evidence for the first landing there. But that just buys you a little time past 1969 and still leaves quite a handful of people to keep quiet and a Soviet government to trick. Remember that the Soviets may not have gotten a human being to the moon, but they had already sent hardware to the moon and into orbit and tracked the American missions.

27

Theocratic Warfare

by stuckinarut2 in

no doubt we noticed the royal commission ask vin toole (and i think terry o'brien) about the expression "theocratic warfare"?.

they were asked to explain it and what is meant to witnesses.. vin outrightly lied when he said he "had never heard of that expression!".

i remember him using that term in conversations and talks many times!!

OnTheWayOut

It is very simple. He was actively engaged in theocratic warfare when he answered a question about the same.

"I have never heard of such an expression (coming out of the mouth of a non-member)."

OnTheWayOut

Posts by OnTheWayOut

Patterns in snow or a cloud or even an interstellar cloud are not actually noodles.

What if there is no Flying Spaghetti Monster? What if it's just your desire to see a signal in the noise? What if pointing out the average global temperature vs. the total number of pirates is just the use of faulty logic?

And Punk, I found it in toast: