Posts by dubla

865

WoMD ... so where are they?

by Simon in

now, the war is over, the weapons were not used and of course have not been found.. how threatening could they be if they did not even use them when being invaded by a massive force (of the countries they hate)?!

perhaps, as many suspect, they didn't use them because they didn't have them?.

now we're being told that we'll have to be patient and give them time to find them.

dubla

pleasure-

could you "specifically" back that up?

i thought it was common knowledge.....unless of course "serious consequences" simply meant no pudding after dinner.?

now didn't the US breach clause 10 by removing 8,000 pages of the Iraqi declaration before it was handed over to the non-permanent members of the UN security council?

i dont see how..? it was agreed by the permanent members (not just the u.s.) that taking out the "how to" manuals on nuclear, biological, and chemical weapons was in everyones best interest. do you disagree with that decision, and if so, why?

clause 10 speaks of providing information on iraqs programs to unmovic and the iaea......are there specifically non-permanent members in unmovic or the iaea that were not provided this information? if so, please provide links to back this up....im unaware of it.

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24

Predictions for the New Football Season....no egg chasers allowed!

by searchfothetruth in

predictions for the new football season: .

1. who will win the premiership?

2. who will be top goal scorer?

dubla

search-

oh, my mistake....i thought you were talking about the sport that actually has scoring......not just kicking a ball to one side, and then back to the other, and then back, and then back again, until the fans are all dizzy.

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24

Predictions for the New Football Season....no egg chasers allowed!

by searchfothetruth in

predictions for the new football season: .

1. who will win the premiership?

2. who will be top goal scorer?

dubla

Predictions for the New football season:

- the dolphins will win the afc east

- tampa bay will not repeat as superbowl champs

- brett favre will finally suffer an injury that sidelines him for at least a portion of the season

- warren sapp will do or say something stupid and/or controversial

- there will be at least one team that finishes with more losses than the bengals

- the coyboys and lions will both lose on turkey day

- bill parcells will have a run-in with the media

- there will be at least one game that ends in controversy over a call

- the afc will get the trophy back

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865

WoMD ... so where are they?

by Simon in

now, the war is over, the weapons were not used and of course have not been found.. how threatening could they be if they did not even use them when being invaded by a massive force (of the countries they hate)?!

perhaps, as many suspect, they didn't use them because they didn't have them?.

now we're being told that we'll have to be patient and give them time to find them.

dubla

patio-

now that i have read the article (thanks search), i can better respond.....

What do you think of the US News & Report's article last week that discusses a leaked document that indicates there was intelligence that there was NO WMDs in Iraq?

the article doesnt say that....in fact, it says:

The report does not suggest Iraq did not have WMD. Indeed, it concludes that Iraq "probably" has such stockpiles.

and yes, i have already seen this over the weekend. its apparently going to be declassified, and the government has said that the report doesnt contradict any of their claims of iraqs wmd. this article seems to back up that claim....as the dia report in fact suggests that iraq still did posses stockpiles of unconventional weapons........the only question it casts is "how definitive was the evidence?". the answer to that question, as ive stated, is irrelevant to my personal beliefs on the matter, as they have never stemmed from this "evidence".

realist-

don't you find it alarming that the US and british gov. falsified information.....

if this is proven to be true, it wouldnt surprise me.........as ive said, i expect blatant lies from every government across the globe. is it alarming? of course.....its alarming that no one on this planet will ever get the whole story from any government.

......in order to convince the public to support an unjustified war?

"unjustified" is a matter of opinion. resolution 1441, which was unanimously voted for in the u.n., specifically called for war if iraq didnt comply....the only thing that wasnt agreed upon was the timeline for action. you can repeat your claims that the war was unjust or illegal ad nausem, but it wont make it fact......itll still be an opinion, and ill still have mine.

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32

Who Is Your Top American?

by expatbrit in

jw
friends

the bbc is conducting a poll to find people's opinion on the most important personage in american history.. a short list of the top ten nominees will be posted on the website tomorrow, and then you can vote on your choice from those ten.. here is the link: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/wtwta/2957480.stm.

happy voting!.

expatbrit

dubla

George W Bush.

i was waiting for that one.......very predictable.

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865

WoMD ... so where are they?

by Simon in

now, the war is over, the weapons were not used and of course have not been found.. how threatening could they be if they did not even use them when being invaded by a massive force (of the countries they hate)?!

perhaps, as many suspect, they didn't use them because they didn't have them?.

now we're being told that we'll have to be patient and give them time to find them.

dubla

patio-

What do you think of the US News & Report's article last week that discusses a leaked document that indicates there was intelligence that there was NO WMDs in Iraq?

i havent read it, and i couldnt get into your link. if that was found to be true, it would be quite the scandal story.

How long do you intend to wait on the jury or accept the PC version (Pentagon-correct)?

its never been about the pentagon for me.....its never been about what bush said, or powell, or rummy........my belief that saddam had wmd has always been about common sense. it only made sense to me that if he couldnt show documentation on their destruction, he still had them. it only made sense to me that he wouldnt put his country through a decade of sanctions for no good reason (why play games with the world for 10+ years if you dont even have wmd?). the bottom line is, saddam was in violation of a number of u.n. resolutions.....and if he didnt have any of these weapons, it really didnt make a whole lot of sense to violate any of the resolutions. the u.s./u.k. enforced the resolutions that some of the u.n. didnt want to enforce. every u.n. security council member believed iraq had wmd. if the u.s. intelligence proves to be inaccurate, this also proves that the intelligence agencies of every country in the world are faulty.

as far as how long im willing to wait, ive seen estimates on the weapons search going into at least september, so thats one time line to look at. personally, i would be shocked if nothing is found, but once again, that has nothing to do with what my government has told me. if ive been lied to about how much evidence we actually had, it wouldnt bother me one bit....i expect to be lied to at every turn, as every citizen of every country should expect. if the bush adminstration goes down in a big ball of flames, it wont hurt my feelings....im far from a bush disciple.

I have trouble waiting on authorities that seem to be blatantly breaking international laws in my name since it's a democracy.

if youre talking about the war, the idea that international laws were broken is certainly an opinion and not a fact.

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865

WoMD ... so where are they?

by Simon in

now, the war is over, the weapons were not used and of course have not been found.. how threatening could they be if they did not even use them when being invaded by a massive force (of the countries they hate)?!

perhaps, as many suspect, they didn't use them because they didn't have them?.

now we're being told that we'll have to be patient and give them time to find them.

dubla

realist-

interesting story (the first one you posted).....i hadnt seen that yet. i thought it was curious that the skeptics hadnt even examined the trucks first hand..?? but, in any event, there will always be skeptics, even if 3000 tons of chemical agent are found (the skeptics will claim it was planted). i would be interested to see how many experts have examined the trucks, and how many of them came to each conclusion (either they were for bio weapons, or not). sounds like the jurys still out, which is what ive been saying all along.

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865

WoMD ... so where are they?

by Simon in

now, the war is over, the weapons were not used and of course have not been found.. how threatening could they be if they did not even use them when being invaded by a massive force (of the countries they hate)?!

perhaps, as many suspect, they didn't use them because they didn't have them?.

now we're being told that we'll have to be patient and give them time to find them.

dubla

So George Bush is going find the WMD to help Blair...what about himself?

to the dismay of many on this forum, bush is going to be the heavy favorite to win the 2004 election.....and thats whether or not any wmd are found. blair needs a lot more comforting than bush does at this point.

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865

WoMD ... so where are they?

by Simon in

now, the war is over, the weapons were not used and of course have not been found.. how threatening could they be if they did not even use them when being invaded by a massive force (of the countries they hate)?!

perhaps, as many suspect, they didn't use them because they didn't have them?.

now we're being told that we'll have to be patient and give them time to find them.

dubla

realist-

hope you had a great vacation!

thanks, i did actually.....went deep sea fishing a couple of times (atlantic side), scuba diving, and of course hit the local beaches and local bars.........back in indiana now, back to reality.

hmmmmmmmmm the only plausible explanation for your statement i can come up with is that you MISREAD my post!
i did NOT question the use of WMD but the use of bioweapons!

ah, i didnt realize you were making the specific distinction between bioweapons and chemical weapons, my mistake..........although, with your line of logic, i cant figure out why that distinction would even matter? your argument has always been that saddam wouldnt have used wmd against us or against his own people....yet he already has shown the willingness to do so.....what difference does it make if it was bio or chem? in fact, the chem weapons were the bigger issue as far as unaccounted for stockpiles, so id argue that the fact that hed used them before makes a pretty strong case for a "threat".

can you list them?

yeah, if youd like me to......notice though, that i followed that statement up with the statement about you specifically being the only person who has bothered to thoroughly discuss the issue with me........so i really shouldve said "the vast majority" hasnt tried to refute them, rather than "no one". ill look back over it when i get a chance, to see if there are any important ones youve missed. youve been pretty good about at least giving an opinion on my points though, if not exactly refuting them with facts.

thats not a matter of celebration but about who was/is closer to reality!

i agree....and i would feel the same way if 3,000 tons of chemical weapons were found tomorrow.....id be happy that closed eyes would open........a bit different than trying to taunt the other side with "lol"s every time theres not an immediate response.

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865

WoMD ... so where are they?

by Simon in

now, the war is over, the weapons were not used and of course have not been found.. how threatening could they be if they did not even use them when being invaded by a massive force (of the countries they hate)?!

perhaps, as many suspect, they didn't use them because they didn't have them?.

now we're being told that we'll have to be patient and give them time to find them.

dubla

i just got back from vacation today (gone to florida for a week of 90 degree weather! ), and i thought id revisit this thread to see whats been going on. i was somewhat dissapointed with all the "laughing out loud" about a lack of replies from the "prowar crowd". number one, is any of this a laughing matter? i mean, lets say no wmd are found, and the antiwar crowd "wins" this particular argument......is celebration in order? would it then be time to laugh at the other side?

second of all, ive been "quiet" because ive been gone, but upon returning, i really havent read anything worth replying to. no one has brought up any new points, there are only reguritated criticisms of the fact that wmd havent been found up to this point. ive made so many points that no one has even tried to refute, its not even funny..........now all of a sudden im required to respond to every little rehashed point? um, okay. the one poster thats actually carried on a decent discussion with me on the matter has been realist, and its been appreciated. if anyone has any new points to discuss, id be happy to respond.....until then im sticking to my repeated (ad nauseum) stance that the weapons search is far from over, and if and when it is over with no wmd found, i will be taking a hard look at my position on the wmd issue. as one poster pointed out, it really didnt make a whole lot of sense for saddam to play games and keep sanctions on his nation for as long as he did if he didnt have any wmds. to me, the jury is still out......for some, the door has already been closed in their mind......to each his own.

speaking of you realist......after reading your latest posts i now realize why you havent thought saddam was a threat to anyone, even if he had wmd......you didnt even know he gassed the kurds! also, until i showed you facts, you didnt know saddam had unaccounted for mustard agents......it is becoming more and more clear to me that you need to do some serious research into the past facts of this issue before you continue to argue it. put "kurds, saddam, gassed" into a search engine and see what you find.......to most of us it has always been common knowledge that he did indeed use wmd on his own people....obviously this was a fact that somehow escaped you. let me know what you come up with.

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