Posts by humbled

2596

The Pastor of my Old Church Tried to Re-Convert Me Yesterday

by cofty in

yesterday evening my wife and i were invited to friends house for new year's eve.

we met them when i was a christian and we have kept in touch.

they had a few other friends there as well, including the new church pastor and his wife.

The Pastor of my Old Church Tried to Re-Convert Me Yesterday

by cofty in

yesterday evening my wife and i were invited to friends house for new year's eve.

we met them when i was a christian and we have kept in touch.

they had a few other friends there as well, including the new church pastor and his wife.

humbled

Flame,

You sense there is more than meets the eye about god questions--I sympathize.

For me and theology-- it has to be simpler than much of what I have heard in church. The knowledge about "getting saved" from misery and from being a bad person has to have a simpler, better way of getting out to us.

Death isn't the worst. But confusion, misery and pain suck.

See we don't get to pick out how death goes. And myself and most the people I live around--hey, they don't have time to fret about who god is or if he is: they have to get ON WITH IT.

Years back I saw a documentary about forest pygmies of Africa. They knew they were going to hell(yes HELL)because they killed and ate the forest elephants. But that is all they could do to live. they were caught in LIFE.

I feel like that too.Caught in life. I have to grab what I can from what I think, what i can read, from places like this and run with it.

At the end of this day, I figure god is love and love is god. If there IS a loving god he would understand how it is to be puzzled at so much suffering on the earth--and why I can't believe in Him if Christian Theism is right.

As Apog has suggested, certainty is pressed upon us. But standing in btween is a place some find themselves (Hello,Kate, Jgnat et al) --and I think it isn't the result of being DIS-honest. It is because we honestly don't KNOW any better.

2596

The Pastor of my Old Church Tried to Re-Convert Me Yesterday

by cofty in

yesterday evening my wife and i were invited to friends house for new year's eve.

we met them when i was a christian and we have kept in touch.

they had a few other friends there as well, including the new church pastor and his wife.

humbled

Flamegrilled--

We used to have milk goats--and we ate them, too.(SORRY!)

We had ultimate power over them. We had more affection for them than the bible/christian God does for his children on earth.

It conflicted US that we named them and butchered them. But to cause them suffering--Hell no.

Is this a flawed relationship with other creatures--no doubt!--But to cause terror and suffering to them--NO.

I nursed with my own breast a newborn goat when there were no nannies "fresh" to keep her from starving. again--why? if only to hold a knife over her later....But I couldn't see her starve, suffer.

god can do better than this, can't he?

46

ACTUALLY any form of pants are wrong wrong wrong!!

by hamsterbait in

tight pants - tempting the gays to chase you: you cannot resist their advances bad bad bad!!!!!!!!!!!!.

baggy pants - in a 1993 witchtower baggy pants were a sign you are a rapper : bad bad bad!!!!!!!!!!.

pants just right?

humbled

Hey Julia!! LOL, the reason JWs are so contrarian is because........They have to shop at thrift stores (what can you BUY with a window washer's pay????) hahahaha Maeve

46

ACTUALLY any form of pants are wrong wrong wrong!!

by hamsterbait in

tight pants - tempting the gays to chase you: you cannot resist their advances bad bad bad!!!!!!!!!!!!.

baggy pants - in a 1993 witchtower baggy pants were a sign you are a rapper : bad bad bad!!!!!!!!!!.

pants just right?

humbled

Anyone remembering the study about the priests going up the steps to serve in the temple? Had to wear pants under their robes...NOOOO PEEEEKING!

2596

The Pastor of my Old Church Tried to Re-Convert Me Yesterday

by cofty in

yesterday evening my wife and i were invited to friends house for new year's eve.

we met them when i was a christian and we have kept in touch.

they had a few other friends there as well, including the new church pastor and his wife.

humbled

LisaRose--"I would like to believe in God, but the facts don't fit for me."

2596

The Pastor of my Old Church Tried to Re-Convert Me Yesterday

by cofty in

yesterday evening my wife and i were invited to friends house for new year's eve.

we met them when i was a christian and we have kept in touch.

they had a few other friends there as well, including the new church pastor and his wife.

humbled

flamegrilled,

Sorry I am late to reply. I had to leave for the day just after my post and just read your reply.

You do see evidence of God's power AND love in the universe?

I have a deep love for nature and the workings of the universe. What I've experienced in my own body gives me a tremendous awe for existence and consciousness. It may have been created by intelligence and power--( both you AND cofty fall short of 100% in your certainty of your position). I am not certain either.

But if I might see power in a creator, his love isn't certain. But I am certain that I cannot gather figs from thistles. If the story is that we reflect the character of god then I cannot see a loving God giving birth to a child and then killing it.

So that is why I assumed you don't see evidence of Power-AND-Love in god either.

I know the missing piece is (probably)that the Christ story because it involves resurrection. But how negotiable are the features of salvation in the bible? If working people don't land in the right theology-aren't we damned again? The salvation is limited.

You understand "salvation" differently?

But all in all--it is in the gulf that exists between love and power that our doubts do not find rest.

2596

The Pastor of my Old Church Tried to Re-Convert Me Yesterday

by cofty in

yesterday evening my wife and i were invited to friends house for new year's eve.

we met them when i was a christian and we have kept in touch.

they had a few other friends there as well, including the new church pastor and his wife.

humbled

flamegrilled,

My hat is off to you. No irony.*

Without evidence you have the hope, the faith to believe in a god who has not acted with love and power.

You value love? You are trusting that God will indeed restore with tenderness the poor sufferers who had no relief in this life--and no knowledge of Jesus as Christ?

That is a faith in a theodicy that the NT has never supported,as far as I know.

*It is hard not to feel ironic.

2596

The Pastor of my Old Church Tried to Re-Convert Me Yesterday

by cofty in

yesterday evening my wife and i were invited to friends house for new year's eve.

we met them when i was a christian and we have kept in touch.

they had a few other friends there as well, including the new church pastor and his wife.

humbled

Twitch,This outta be good----

It will be good it we all dig in to search--if that's what we're doing here. and do it with good will.

In terms of logic the record for God being powerful and loving remains undetermined unless anyone reading this will concede that my husbands terrier who sleeps by the fire and has never to this date caught a single rat (although he has killed our favorite chicken)is the finest hunter and the most energetic, obedient dog in the history of the universe.

I have heard nothing to make me listen to Paul's sacred secret of salvation any more.

2596

The Pastor of my Old Church Tried to Re-Convert Me Yesterday

by cofty in

yesterday evening my wife and i were invited to friends house for new year's eve.

we met them when i was a christian and we have kept in touch.

they had a few other friends there as well, including the new church pastor and his wife.

humbled

Kate,I feel for you. I wish I had something funny for you,too.

Wait! here's something funny--about my messed up perceptionof God: God helped me tremendously many years ago. Now I can see that others don't get any help from him so I am telling god that he can't play favorites--I don't believe in him anymore!

!!!????

Maeve