SnakesInTheTower

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Posts by SnakesInTheTower

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  47

  Do elders still ask inactive members to write a letter to disassociating yourself from the Congregation?

  by RULES & REGULATIONS in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  do today's elders ever meet with inactive members and pressure them to write a letter disassociating themselves from the congregation stating that, ''you no longer wish to a jehovah witness"?.

  i was baptized at the young age of 16. after turning 18, i stopped attending meetings, field service, and all jehovah's witness activities.

  i wanted to be with my high school friends, go to rock concerts, have a girlfriend, and live like a normal teen.

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  SnakesInTheTower

  Exactly, they can and do apparently.

  Snakes
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  14

  JW's will NOT like the first months of life in the Paradise! (University Research)

  by fulltimestudent in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  have you ever wondered (when you were an active believer) what life would be like immediately after the big a?.

  in my experience of the pre-big a spiritual paradise most witnesses were aware of the problem posed by the dead bodies of those slain by the bloody minded, would-be mass murderer jesus.

  most liked to quote the author of the revelation, that carrion birds would eat the carcasses.

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  SnakesInTheTower

  I remember reading about that experiment and seeing the video. Ghastly.

  Also, since education was discouraged or forbidden, who would know how to rebuild infrastructure or organize logistics or do anything with only 8 million JW scattered over a planet that once held billions?

  Talk about trying to herd cats.

  Snakes
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  47

  Do elders still ask inactive members to write a letter to disassociating yourself from the Congregation?

  by RULES & REGULATIONS in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  do today's elders ever meet with inactive members and pressure them to write a letter disassociating themselves from the congregation stating that, ''you no longer wish to a jehovah witness"?.

  i was baptized at the young age of 16. after turning 18, i stopped attending meetings, field service, and all jehovah's witness activities.

  i wanted to be with my high school friends, go to rock concerts, have a girlfriend, and live like a normal teen.

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  SnakesInTheTower

  A couple of things.

  In 2002, I attended MTS, Ministerial Training School. Both instructors were long time DOs. One served a stint on the Service Desk. Here is what they said regarding this matter:

  WT policy on DA is to accept a letter, but try to get in person verification. A notorized letter is gold, but rarely given. This is especially true when a letter is received out of the blue. If verification cannot be had by in person or by phone witnessed by 2 elders, then any DA announcement would be held in abeyance pending Branch direction. If the person insisted, then after 7 days the announcement would be made.

  As the manual posted earlier stated, if a JC was in process, that would end but would be put in the local file along with the notification to the Branch about the DA. If the person came back, then the original JC matter would be reopened.

  We as a class were told never request a letter. NEVER. I can also tell you each of us elders in the class knew of individual elders or bodies of elders who disregarded official policy and indeed did solicit DA letters because the wanted the individual gone. The instructors also knew of this happening and said it was against policy.

  I sat on a JC of an apostasy case, which I have discussed on this forum (ironically, someone who used to post here). There were elders who wanted this guy gone, he was considered a troublemaker. Too much thinking on his part. Cooler heads prevailed, CO got involved, made the entire body sit on his JC case. Voted to DF, unanimously. It was a loyalty test. Then the appeals committee met with all of us and upheld it. That is what this fellow wanted, he challenged the system, knowing the outcome. He did not DA.

  By action or letter, you can be DA. Officially you cannot be pressured into a DA. Unofficially, that $hit happened all the time.

  Snakes (Rich)
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  28

  "Are you the plumber?"

  by Jourles in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  i've been debating whether or not to post this story simply because the org knows who i am (post history from pre-'05 will tell you all you need to know), and i'm not sure if they would give my parents shit if they knew what transpired earlier this summer.

  but you know what, i don't care what they do, because my mom is dying of stage iv cancer and i feel this needs to be heard by anyone struggling with the loss of contact from their relatives.. for those who are not familiar with my background, i became a small thorn in the side of the wts while i was still in.

  i'm not big on being deceived, and for me, the org crossed my personal 'red line' when it came to blood and the child abuse issue.

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  SnakesInTheTower

  Good for you, please see your mom again. What a beautiful picture.

  Fairfield sounded familiar. My youngest brother, (also named Josh) not a JW, lived Iowa City, not far away. Cult ruined him as a child. I think one of my friends who grew up JW but no longer is a dub lives in Fairfield. Ketra (was a JW) and Greg (never a JW, but I was in HS with him). Maybe you crossed paths.

  Seems like one of my fellow MTS classmates was from that area. **shrugs**....side notes....squirrel....

  Hugs to you, good son you are.

  Snakes (Rich)
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  4

  This is the kind of thing that keeps JWs from looking into important matters

  by neat blue dog in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  https://www.jw.org/en/jehovahs-witnesses/faq/respond-to-accusations/.

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  SnakesInTheTower

  I could only listen to 20 seconds of that before my anxiety levels kicked in.

  And to think I practiced reading like that in hopes of one day going to Bethel to do that!

  ***shudder***

  Snakes
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  70

  The Reasons for Cart Witnessing

  by Simon in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  whatever we think of it, you have to admit that it's quite "genius".. the door to door ministry as done in western developed countries where the jw quirky religion has probably reached their saturation level was a complete and utter waste of time in terms of the effort expended to recruit people.. at the same time, it was rarely something that anyone enjoyed which led to people being labelled as inactive, being pressured to doing more and maybe ultimately deciding jwism wasn't for them and leaving.. there was also the issue that many jws are actually pretty bad at knowing and articulating their beliefs so were pretty incapable of getting any meaningful message across.. they solved all this with the cart witnessing.

  the real point isn't to recruit, it's to make life easier for jws.

  now they can stand and chat with their friend, have a coffee, not talk to anyone or make eye contact and still act as a walking billboard for jw.org.

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  SnakesInTheTower

  I am a medical courier. Any time I see literatrash in a lobby, waiting room, etc., I feign interest if anyone is looking, just grab it if no one is paying attention, ..... then practice recycling.....right into the shredder.

  Snakes
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  58

  Do You Ever Wonder Where Certain Posters Are?

  by minimus in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  do people simply leave because the site has given them what they wanted?

  are they now infrequent lurkers?.

  did they go back to the watchtower?.

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  SnakesInTheTower

  I remember meeting a bunch of folks at an Apostafest in 2008 in Toronto. Some I still see here and on FB. Others I lost touch with. One poster was Eclipse. Met them in person at the fest. Nice person. Met Dagney there too. Few others.

  I still talk to some through FB. Funny, on FB, I know real names but cannot figure out who their screen names are here, but our "mutual friends" are all from JWD. Shrugs.

  Just glad I can pop in here from time to time. Mom still a dub.

  Snakes (Rich)
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  16

  Can we ever get our loved ones out?

  by SnakesInTheTower in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  a post on another thread got me to thinking and writing.. should we even be trying to get our loved ones out of jehovah's witnesses?.

  when a person truly believes in their belief system, or even if they don't but have held to that system for a long time, there is nothing we can say that will move them from that system.. why?

  perhaps pride.

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  SnakesInTheTower

  A post on another thread got me to thinking and writing.

  Should we even be trying to get our loved ones out of Jehovah's Witnesses?

  When a person truly believes in their belief system, or even if they don't but have held to that system for a long time, there is NOTHING we can say that will move them from that system.

  Why? Perhaps pride. Perhaps fear. Fear of the unknown. Fear of social isolation.

  For an older JW such as my mom, I suspect this is the case. She was baptized in 1970, at the height of the 1975 fearmongering. Two JW special pioneers came to her door in Juneau, Alaska. She lived in a small apartment, with two little boys, me age 3, and my younger brother who was a newborn. My dad was in the Coast Guard, so mom was by herself a LOT. Age 26, no cable, no internet back then. Phone service to talk to family long distance would have been prohibitively expensive. Maybe a neighbor to talk to, but that was it.

  So to be offered to have adult company for an hour or more a week, talking about deep topics, was probably, in my mom's eyes, a relief. My mom studied with that couple multiple times a week for hours each time. Not just the old Truth book. But the Babylon the Great book. She rapidly progressed and went to the Kingdom Hall which, conveniently for her since she did not drive, was right down the street. Her social circle widened, and she was baptized. Now she had purpose.

  My dad soon joined her. An unwise decision for his career and their finances, but he left the military (technically Department of Transportation back then). They moved back to his hometown in the lower 48 in the midwest and was baptized in 1971.

  I will shorten this for now, but it provides the motivating factor of why my 75 year old mom remains a JW. My dad died in 1994, short of his 60th birthday. She was just shy of 51, a year younger than I am now.

  She remarries out of the Truth, moves to Florida, new instant circle of JW friends, just add Watchtower. Her husband eventually retires, they move to a rural town in southern Alabama. New Kingdom Hall, new instant circle of JW friends, just add Watchtower again.

  Here is the rub. Even if she knows in her heart it is all BS, if she left now, she would be back where she started: 1970, all alone, this time no little kids to care for, just a husband who is disabled, but for now somewhat active. But no other human interaction. Cable, internet, and cheap phone calls to family go only so far. Learning to build genuine friendships, when for nearly 50 years all you had to do for friends was have the commonality of Watchtower to have instant circles of friends, would be nearly impossible.

  All of that to say, it would be extremely cruel on my part to in any way discourage my 75 year old mom from staying the couse, faithful to the end, even if that faith in my eyes is misplaced. It gives her purpose.

  When my mom regular pioneered last year for the first time, and got to go to pioneer school, she was excited and exhausted. I encouraged her to only keep doing it if she still enjoyed it and it did not ruin her health. She did it for one year, then stopped this past September. Now, she and my stepdad vacation, at timeshares unfortunately, but at least they can while their health holds.

  I consider myself fortunate. I still have somewhat of a relationship with my mom. I see her once a year. We talk on the phone periodically. I am rebuilding and reconnecting with her non JW family, whom we were basically isolated from for decades. I spent 2 hours on the phone with her sister, my aunt, yesterday. I look forward to calling my cousin and getting to know him.

  I left the clutches of Watchtower in 2007. I haven't set foot in a Kingdom Hall since August of that year. I served that organization, and I thought God, from my baptism in 1983 at age 16, until I was removed as an elder in December 2006. I had been deeply involved, as a regular pioneer, MS, elder, MTS graduate, Assembly Hall volunteer, Regional Building volunteer, temp at Bethel, Patient Visitation Group, and other activities. All of that cost me education, careers, financial stability, genuine love, happiness.

  Yet, do you think anyone could have convinced me then that it was all BS? I had doubts in 1991 over chronology doctrines, and again in 1995 over the Generation teaching, along with abuse from within by those who were jealous of my success in the Organization, and prevented or delayed many of the goals I had set for myself

  I now have a loving non JW wife. We have been together 9 years, married 7. I adopted her son, now 17, a couple of years ago. Graduating high school this month, a semester early. His whole life ahead of him, I envy where he is in life.

  I did go back to college, while still an elder, got two Associates degrees. Finished after I left Watchtower. My career path is different than my education, but it was my first college course, in Ethics, that finally broke me free of that organization.

  NOT someone from the ex JW community, though this forum has been a lifeline. It took a college professor, who had no idea of my religious background, to influence my thinking. We never know what will break through to our loved ones still trapped inside.

  NEVER GIVE UP. BE THERE FOR THEM WHEN THEY ARE READY. Because unlike Watchtower, out here, there are no instant friends.

  Snakesinthetower (Rich, of the "Patiently waiting for mom to wake up" Sheep Class)
• 
  36

  Faders Needing a Great One Liner

  by Solzhenitsyn in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  so our family fade is well under way.

  we changed congregations as regular attenders and left in good standing with those giving hugs and kisses simply knowing we "needed a change".

  we moved to a neighboring congregation that is out of our original region knowing we would see no one and the two boe's wouldn't really have immediate dealings.

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  SnakesInTheTower

  I am not capable of ONE line. Except for an occasional bump into someone, I rarely run into any dubs. They know not to stop at my house. I also changed congos in 2007.

  I faded just as you did. I was only 10 miles from my old Congo, but another state, circuit, etc. I am sure at some point they exchanged speakers, seen each other at the assembly hall, etc. Maybe the "Have you seen Brother Snakes" question came up. The answer is to "leave sleeping Snakes alone, as to not get BIT."

  I only care because my 75 yr old JW mom is still alive, out of state. After she dies, hopefully no time soon, I won't care about JW anything.

  Oh, I haven't moved in 20 years, so it's not like ai am hiding.

  Snakesinthetower

  
  
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  7

  A Cat's Last Emily (Emily's Last Cat)

  by TerryWalstrom in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  a cat's last emily (emily's last cat) __________.

  lifting her elbow up off of her cat.

  emily whispered, .

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  SnakesInTheTower

  Terry, that really is beautiful writing.

  Snakes (Rich...only dreams of being a writer)