before i pose my question, please correct me if my understanding on any of these points on wt beliefs are incorrect.. 1. jehovah god alone has existed from eternity.
he used no pre-existent material to form anything.. 2. jehovah has a literal dwelling place, albeit not made from anything from,and not contained within, creation itself.
3. jehovah god, alone, created jesus at some point before the creation of everything else.
I don't know the Society's official stance on this, but in the 1990's and early 2000's, I heard some JW elders give these answers before:
1: Jehovah created the spiritual Heavens out of the same "holy spirit energy" material (or out of nothing) that He used to create everything else. Before this, there was just God, nothing else.
2: Somehow Heaven (the spirit realm) is eternal just like God is eternal.
3: God lives in outer space but deep, deep, deeply beyond anywhere that we can ever discover.
there is a huge logical problem for the newer jw doctrines and beliefs:.
watchtower, august 1, 2010, page 22:.
so although jehovah does not promise that every individual will receive exactly the same opportunity, he does make sure that an opportunity is held out to all honesthearted ones.
There is a huge logical problem for the newer JW doctrines and beliefs:
Watchtower, August 1, 2010, Page 22:
So although Jehovah does not promise that every individual will receive exactly the same opportunity, he does make sure that an opportunity is held out to all honesthearted ones. He will even make sure that those who have never had the occasion to learn about him will be given an opportunityby means of a resurrection to life in a righteous new world.—Acts 24:15.
------------------
But, they still refer to the preaching work as "urgent" and "lifesaving." But why is the preaching work urgent or lifesaving if Jehovah would never eternally destroy any honest-hearted person?
David Splane even brought this point up in his new "1900 years" video on tv.jw.org. He said people at Bethel must not get the idea that the preaching work is not urgent, even though we know Jehovah won't allow honest-hearted ones to be destroyed.
governing body member david splane has a new video on tv.jw.org where he talks about all the horrible things committed by martin luther and the protestant reformers.. his conclusion is that there has been no faithful and discreet slave on the earth during the past 1900 years (before 1919 i guess.).
he also says that maybe there were a few anointed on earth, maybe not.. he did add an interesting statement that he doesn't condemn the other churches just for misunderstanding the bible because the society has done that.. another odd point, was that he actually mentioned catholic missionary work in a somewhat positive light, while totally condemning the reformation views on predestination..
Also, another comment by David Splane was that people at Bethel must not start getting the idea that since we know Jehovah wouldn't allow a good-hearted person to be destroyed, that there is no urgency to our preaching work.
He likened that to the Predestination beliefs of the Reformers.
But, if you think really deeply and logically about this:....
If it is JW theology that Jehovah will not abandon any truly good-hearted person, then what is the urgency to the preaching work?
I suppose it would just mean that Jehovah would have many FEWER evangelizers to use to reach the good-hearted people, and thus it would make the preaching work much more difficult and exhausting for those FEW.
governing body member david splane has a new video on tv.jw.org where he talks about all the horrible things committed by martin luther and the protestant reformers.. his conclusion is that there has been no faithful and discreet slave on the earth during the past 1900 years (before 1919 i guess.).
he also says that maybe there were a few anointed on earth, maybe not.. he did add an interesting statement that he doesn't condemn the other churches just for misunderstanding the bible because the society has done that.. another odd point, was that he actually mentioned catholic missionary work in a somewhat positive light, while totally condemning the reformation views on predestination..
Thank you Blondie and WiFi for showing all of their old incorrect views on this.
I'm wondering which direction they will decide to go after releasing this video?
It COULD be the first step toward a much more moderate view of the other churches, saying that they may simply be "misunderstanding the Bible," and thus could possibly be forgiven by Jehovah.
Also, it seems very much like David Splane is the man in charge of looking at all of their old doctrine and "fixing it," since he also gave the big New Light talk about the Types and Antitypes.
governing body member david splane has a new video on tv.jw.org where he talks about all the horrible things committed by martin luther and the protestant reformers.. his conclusion is that there has been no faithful and discreet slave on the earth during the past 1900 years (before 1919 i guess.).
he also says that maybe there were a few anointed on earth, maybe not.. he did add an interesting statement that he doesn't condemn the other churches just for misunderstanding the bible because the society has done that.. another odd point, was that he actually mentioned catholic missionary work in a somewhat positive light, while totally condemning the reformation views on predestination..
I suppose David Splane's new video would tie in good with the 2008 Generation belief and the new view that the selection of the anointed did not end in 1935.
By saying now that there may not have been anointed on earth during the past 1900 years before 1919, that gives a basis they can use for explaining why the number of anointed is increasing now: They'll just say God is filling up the spots that remained empty over those 1900 years.
In addition, if they are going back to the 2008 view on "This Generation," that means they'll say Jesus promised their would be anointed on earth until 70 C.E. but not afterward.
And the secondary fulfillment is that Jesus promised there would be anointed on earth from 1914 until the End.
governing body member david splane has a new video on tv.jw.org where he talks about all the horrible things committed by martin luther and the protestant reformers.. his conclusion is that there has been no faithful and discreet slave on the earth during the past 1900 years (before 1919 i guess.).
he also says that maybe there were a few anointed on earth, maybe not.. he did add an interesting statement that he doesn't condemn the other churches just for misunderstanding the bible because the society has done that.. another odd point, was that he actually mentioned catholic missionary work in a somewhat positive light, while totally condemning the reformation views on predestination..
Governing Body member David Splane has a new video on tv.jw.org where he talks about all the horrible things committed by Martin Luther and the Protestant Reformers.
His conclusion is that there has been NO Faithful and Discreet Slave on the earth during the past 1900 years (before 1919 I guess.)
He also says that maybe there were a few anointed on earth, maybe not.
He did add an interesting statement that he doesn't condemn the other churches just for misunderstanding the Bible because the Society has done that.
Another odd point, was that he actually mentioned Catholic missionary work in a somewhat positive light, while totally condemning the Reformation views on Predestination.
i want you to see how fake people are who pretend their open-minded, dr. erhman try's to reason with someone whose mind is totally made up.
the topic is whether there was a man named jesus and paul, the infidel atheist get's owned because he shows his true colors!.
1. when would you tell this fool he stupid or willfully ignoring the facts?.
A person could make a very good blog post out of all the regurgitated outdated claims made by atheists in this thread.
I think I'm gonna do that.
i'm not naming names, but i just want to encourage people on here or on reddit or twitter, and tell you that you do not have to tolerate people who act like schoolyard bullies in the way they speak to you online.
i think anonymity is a big part of it.
they feel like there is zero accountability so they can be a bully all they want.. i recommend just ignoring or blocking anyone who is verbally abusive or treats you like schoolyard bullies treated you.. life is way too short to spend any time dealing with those kinds of people..
nicolaou,
You said:
FT, the forum doesn't need this. Grow a thicker skin and understand the heat that a forum full of cult survivors can generate. If you don't like it do as the aforementioned poster did - successfully I might add - leave and start your own site.
You are telling me, a fellow cult survivor, to get thicker skin and to expect, and put up with, and just accept bad treatment from a "cult support group,"? Otherwise I must be shunned, ridiculed, or banished to another website?
In what universe does that make sense?
Sounds waaaaaay too much like Disfellowshipping.
i'm not naming names, but i just want to encourage people on here or on reddit or twitter, and tell you that you do not have to tolerate people who act like schoolyard bullies in the way they speak to you online.
i think anonymity is a big part of it.
they feel like there is zero accountability so they can be a bully all they want.. i recommend just ignoring or blocking anyone who is verbally abusive or treats you like schoolyard bullies treated you.. life is way too short to spend any time dealing with those kinds of people..
DJS,
Let me see if I understand you right:
You're saying that I, as a moderate Christian, should have EXPECTED to be bullied on a website that proclaims itself to be "friendly and tolerant?"
Isn't that the exact same attitude as people who say that women who "dress like sluts" can EXPECT or DESERVE to be raped?
i'm not naming names, but i just want to encourage people on here or on reddit or twitter, and tell you that you do not have to tolerate people who act like schoolyard bullies in the way they speak to you online.
i think anonymity is a big part of it.
they feel like there is zero accountability so they can be a bully all they want.. i recommend just ignoring or blocking anyone who is verbally abusive or treats you like schoolyard bullies treated you.. life is way too short to spend any time dealing with those kinds of people..
Again, not naming names, but it seems some of the militant atheists and anti-theists have adopted the EXACT same practices of exclusivity, being one of "the elite," and ridicule & name-calling propaganda tactics that have been used by JW elders and leaders.
"Only atheists have the truth!"
"All theists are ignorant or liars!"
"Only atheists are intelligent!"
