Posts by tenyearsafter

156

Worldly Shunning

by alice.in.wonderland in

i hear quite a bit of criticism about jehovah's witnesses enforcing 1 corinthians 5:9-13. while jehovah's witnesses have a formal system of maintaining the organization's core values; egocentric, self-worshiping secularists have an informal system of rejecting those of whom they have nothing in common with.

http://www.objectivistcenter.org/cth-32-390-religion.aspx.

most major religions have believed in the existence of a supernatural realm, a realm beyond the natural world of physical objects and bodies governed by causal laws, the world we perceive with our senses and can study by rational methods.

tenyearsafter

AIW,

Where does the individual who may have been a sinner under the definition at 1 Corinthians 5:9-13 fall if they no longer practice the sins outlined therein but have not yet been reinstated (forgiven) by the BOE? Are they worthy of association by your interpretation? If your answer is yes, it would be in opposition to what the WTS teaches...and requires followers to adhere to. It sounds like your mother may fall in to that category...would the BOE approve of this association if they were made aware of it?

49

Michael Jackson---What Was Your Opinion Of Him?

by minimus in

jw
friends

a year ago, mj suddenly died.

for years, multitudes of people said michael jackson was a "sicko" a "wacko", a "child molester" and an "addict".. once he died, the man was glorified by people, the media and his family.. what did you think about michael?.....personally, i thought he was an eccentric ultra-gifted artist who was childlike and brilliant.

i was never convinced that he was a child molester but i will say i thought his behavior was "weird" with kids (and adults)..

tenyearsafter

Michael was in my in-law's congregation back in the 80's. He was always a very quiet young man...very shy around adults. We were at several "get togethers" where he attended, and he immediately gravitated to the children. He would just go where the kids were playing and start to join in whatever games they were involved in at the time. It didn't seem "creepy" or anything other than a man-child going where he was comfortable. He always seemed uncomfortable around adults. This all took place around the time Thriller was released...and the subsequent uproar about the occult, etc., etc. His withdrawal from the JW's followed fairly soon after that.

I thought he was incredibly talented and mesmerizing as a performer...was he a child molester?...I don't think so in the typical way we would think of pedophiles. I believe that he was unable to distinguish between "appropriate" and accepted behavior around kids. He thought he was a still kid, so he didn't see it unusual that he surrounded himself with kids.

If anything, he was a tragic figure...tortured and always seeking happiness...not unlike many other "geniuses" we have seen through the years.

24

Reasoning from the Scripture book and new light on generation don't add up

by wasblind in

everyone listen up if you still have your" reasoning from the scriptures" book get them out turn to page 234 and read the last sentence in the definition.

where it says: the generation who was alive in 1914 would be the generation to see the end.

then turn to page 242 on the top of the page where they say it's not gonna be another generation to experience this.

tenyearsafter

Hey Blondie...I still have my "classic" NWT that was leather bound with a Reasoning book...I thought I had all the answers when I carried that door to door!

32

Is Proper Worship Important to you?

by wannabe in

didn't he also tell her that only those worshipping in spirit and in truth were the only kind the father was looking for to worship him?

his apostles by him.

notice something here!

tenyearsafter

Hmmm...did the evildoer crucified next to Jesus practice "proper worship" before Jesus offered him Paradise?

25

I've Got An Idea: Sue An Elder!

by minimus in

jw
friends

i honestly think that if individual elders thought they personally might get sued, they would back off from talking to you or trying to hunt you down.

i know i always was nervous that i'd havv=e to hire a lawyer and pay $$$ out of my own pocket.. what do you think?

might that not discourage elders from violating your rights or harrassing you?

tenyearsafter

A.I.W. - I think the key difference in how various Christian religions enforce their "private clubs" is the issue here. With the exception of Mormons, Scientologists and small cults, I can't think of any "Western" religion other than JW's that proactively investigate "wrongdoing" among their members. If someone in Christendom or Catholicism chooses to leave the church, they do it and at worse their name is removed from the membership roll. Why some things are considered sins and others not by a church show one thing...there is no perfect church, including the WTS. As long as imperfect and flawed men are involved, there will always be "issues" that arise.

Nonetheless, elders should not take on the role of judge, jury and executioner lest they be judged on their own works. Remember...he who is without sin should cast the first stone! If a person decides to leave, let them do it and not hound them to get a "confession".

25

I've Got An Idea: Sue An Elder!

by minimus in

jw
friends

i honestly think that if individual elders thought they personally might get sued, they would back off from talking to you or trying to hunt you down.

i know i always was nervous that i'd havv=e to hire a lawyer and pay $$$ out of my own pocket.. what do you think?

might that not discourage elders from violating your rights or harrassing you?

tenyearsafter

AIW...I believe the thread is referring to people who are being harassed while still in the congregation. When trying to root out "uncleaness" in the congregation, elders have been known to be quite strident in their efforts to "keep the congregation clean". Once someone is DF'ed, the elders generally stop making contact...in many cases, not even making the annual call to see if that unrepentant individual was ready to turn away from their "errant" course and return to the congregation.

As to your contention that JW's are well versed in the disfellowshipping policies, I disagree. JW's know you can be DF'ed when they join, but I guarantee that they don't know the extent of the "sins" you can be disciplined for. My guess is that unless you have read the Elder's Manual, you don't know those details either. For example, are you aware that there are several types of sexual misconduct, depending on the "level" of intimate contact, that can lead to varying degrees of discipline? What is considered "causing divisions" in the congregation? I can't imagine any elder wanting to have to testify about the details of these "sins" in a courtroom or deposition setting...

25

I've Got An Idea: Sue An Elder!

by minimus in

jw
friends

i honestly think that if individual elders thought they personally might get sued, they would back off from talking to you or trying to hunt you down.

i know i always was nervous that i'd havv=e to hire a lawyer and pay $$$ out of my own pocket.. what do you think?

might that not discourage elders from violating your rights or harrassing you?

tenyearsafter

If a person is sued, rightly or wrongly, they must answer the allegations in that lawsuit within a prescribed time period...in most cases, this requires getting an attorney and paying a retainer to that lawyer. Retainers usually run in the thousands of dollars. Unless the elder you sue is flush with cash, it will cause him heartburn. The key is finding claims that can be made in a lawsuit...and that could be the most challenging problem. I am not advocating filing baseless legal actions, but the shear cost and hassle of defending a legitimate lawsuit will usually drive things into a settlement quickly. That should get you an agreement for them to leave you alone.

36

Finally got CoC!!.....Not really what I had expected.

by JediMaster in

ok, so i finally picked up coc from my local library last night.

and started reading it like crazy.

i think i read about 70 pages which brought me close to the end of the second chapter: "governing body".

tenyearsafter

Keep reading...I think your opinion will change about Ray and the way the WT operates. So much of what we learned as JW's is not how things actually operate at Bethel...

22

There's something I don't quite get

by dgp in

let's say you're an active witness (well, you guys were, or are active witnesses) and you look around you.

practically every appliance, invention, whatever, most of the food, all the new discoveries, virtually everything was made by worldlies.

it's been that way for thousands of years.

tenyearsafter

"We properly use postal, police, and other lawful services, such as transportation systems."

...but you can't be a police officer and be considered irreprehensible.

15

Behemoth - what type of animal was it??

by Truthexplorer in

i am fascinated by job 40:15-24. which one of the following pictures do you think best describes behemoth?

i have kindly cut and pasted the portion of scripture at the bottom and highlighted some of the outstanding identifying marks of the animal.

i look forward to your views on this very intruiging portion of scripture!.

tenyearsafter

20 The hills bring him their produce,
and all the wild animals play nearby.

"Hippos leave the water at dusk and travel inland, sometimes up to 8 kilometers (5 miles), to graze on short grass, their main source of food. They spend four to five hours grazing and can consume 68 kilograms (150 lb) of grass each night. Like almost any herbivore, they will consume many other plants if presented with them, but their diet in nature consists almost entirely of grass, with only minimal consumption of aquatic plants."