AA, That's an excellent question and if the particles were, say, "red" or "blue" then you would be correct. What makes it intresting is that unlike colors which don't change, spins can change. Please consider the following; Imagine Each particle has a spin which can take one of two values, let's say +1 or -1 (for electrons it's actually +/- 1/2 but it makes no real difference). Now, here's the twist, the spin is defined with respect to some coordinate system, let's say x, y, z. So you can measure the z-component of spin, or the x-componet or the y-component, whatever you like. Think of it like a ball spinning around a particular direction in space (again, this is a simplification but it's ok for the discussion). Now a funny thing about QM is that you can't know all three spins at once, you can only know one of them. So, let's say you measure the z-component and get +1. What value would you get had you measured the x-component? You have no idea execpt that you would get either + or - 1. It can eb either but you don't know which you will get until you mak eteh measurement. 50% of the time you get +1 and 50% -1. It's the same for all directions. Now imagine you make 2 measurements and get z-component: +1 x-componnet: -1 now you measure the z-component again, what do you get? You might think it would still be +1 - just like if you "measure" a ball's color to be red, then weigh the ball, you don't expect it's color to change to green. But when you measure the z-component again you get + or - 1 but which one you don't know until you've measured it. So you could get; z-component: +1 x-component: -1 z-component: -1 So spin isn't like color that is fixed. The actual spin you measure isn't known until you measure it. Now, if you **always** measure the z-component you always get the same result as the first time you measured it, but if you measure x or y in between then that disrupts the z-measurement. So this demonstrates that particles don't have known spins until they are measured. You only need one particle to prove this. Now consider two particles; Imagine that you and AlanF go to opposite sides of town but have secretly agreed ahead of time that you will measure the spins of particles that pass you by, but that each time you will measure a different spin component. You decide on the order z,y,x,x,z etc. Also you decide that you will go first. Obviously the particles don't know what you agreed. They have no idea whihc component you will measure first and, if you believe the above, they can't have pre-assigned values for all three components. So, two particles arrive, one at you and one at alanf. Now you know that whichever spin component you measure you will get +/-1 but you also know that you can't know all three spin components at the same time. So it's not like the particles have pre-assigned values for x, y, and z components - that is, it's not like they have special colors. Now, being a sneaky bastard you decide to measure the x-component first and not the z-component as you agreed and you get +1. AlanF being equally sneaky also decides to cheat and has also by luck, measured the x-component. He gets -1. Had he measured teh x-component as agreed he'd have got +/-1. Now imagine this, the next two particles coming flying out and unbeknownst to you someone between you and the origin measures the z component of spin and gets -1 for your particle. Then you measure the x-component and get +1. Then AlanF measures the x component - he can now get +/-1 so he might also get +1. The entanglement was broken by the intruder's measurement. When you compare notes you can tell in thi scase that someone broke the entanglement. Of course, if AlanF had got -1 (which he would 50% of the time) you couldn't have told. So you need to look at the statistics not at any single measurement to detect the intruder. With the ball analogy if an intruder had a glimspe of yoru ball then that wouldn't have altered it's color. This is a tricky subject and I hope this helps a bit
Gedanken
JoinedPosts by Gedanken
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41
Physics Challenge! Explain "entangled particles" to me
by AlmostAtheist inhey all,.
i'm totally fascinated by the concept of entangled particles.
as i understand it, you take a proton (or something tiny like that), split it apart, but don't observe the resulting particles.
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Another WTS Misrepresentation from the Creator Book
by AlanF inhere is a good example of the sort of complex misrepresentations that the watchtower society performs.
the 1998 creator book says the following (chap.
" not, "what happened after the origin of the universe?
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Gedanken
:What about the universe flew out of the ass of a giant Panda? And then we could write a book called [i]The Panda's Bum[/i]
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UN Scandal - does anyone know the reason they joined to start with?
by AK - Jeff inlike most on this board, i know the story, have seen the un press release, ect.
but can someone comment on two questions for me?.
who caught them with their hands in the cookie jar?
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Gedanken
see post above
Gedanken
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73
UN Scandal - does anyone know the reason they joined to start with?
by AK - Jeff inlike most on this board, i know the story, have seen the un press release, ect.
but can someone comment on two questions for me?.
who caught them with their hands in the cookie jar?
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Gedanken
Heatmiser,
I think AF's analysis is the most credible. Look at it from the Writing Department's point of view. They needed to produce a semimonthly magazine largely devoted to articles of a global nature - about such things as politics, religion, geography etc. The UN library really presents a goldmine of information that can readily be converted into a typical Awake! magazine article. Here's the link:
http://www.un.org/Depts/dhl/
Assuming that the Writing Dept. is likely to take the path of least resistance then it makes perfect sense to want to use a library devoted to the kinds of issues that their magazine wants to talk about. It is much more time consuming to have to use public or university libraries - it involves considerable work to search out articles. Besides, I'm sure that the UN library would provide card holders with unrivalled interlibrary loan facilities etc. which would appeal to the WTS mentality of using "the world" to its own ends. Combining laziness with stupidity certainly makes more sense than assuming malice.
But this is in no way to excuse the WTS. If anything it makes it worse. After all, whatever the reason for their associating as an NGO, it is perfectly clear that they had to agree to advance UN interests. That they were wiling to do this for such a minor advantage speaks much. In fact, those who assume that there must have been a great, overarching reason to become an NGO is fundamentally to misunderstand the essentially trivial mindset of most JWs including the leadership. They really are the old man in the Wizard of Oz.
The WTS regularly uses the example of Esau who sold his birthright for a "swallow of the red." That is he swapped something valuable for something trivial. The WTS has esentially done the same thing - at least based on their own ideology. In fact, becoming an NGO would have been a good opportunity for them to rethink their silly doctrines and actually start to do some good in the world.
Finally, now that Awake! is going monthly it is interesting to speculate if this is due, in part, to the fact they no longer have the ready access to UN material that they once had. Presumably more work is now involved than before.
Gedanken -
25
CITY CITY !!! ... comeback kings !
by Simon in"c'mon city, c'mon city !!!
... it's all gone quiet over there ... " .
*amazing* comeback - 3-0 down and a man sent off (down to 10 men) and we won 4-3 !
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Gedanken
Mike,
Yes that's the place!
Unfortunately there wasn't time when Julie and Alan were in town. Did take take them to a decent pub or two though, in fact they stayed in a pretty good one, but nowhere near Taps quality!. Taps house mild and bitter are brewed by Titanic in Staffordshire - phenomenally good. Also Lytham railway station has a great pub which also had a ton of good cask beers including one called Rosie Nosie (5.2 % I think) and a fine selection of Scotches - so it was a fun trip beer and otherwise!
Here is a 360 panoramic view of it (you have to find the actual link inside here)
http://www.sugarvine.com/search/location_search.asp?town=Lytham
How are things in Somerset? Speaking of which Taps also has cider on draft but I didn't manage to try that - next time!
All the best,
David
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CITY CITY !!! ... comeback kings !
by Simon in"c'mon city, c'mon city !!!
... it's all gone quiet over there ... " .
*amazing* comeback - 3-0 down and a man sent off (down to 10 men) and we won 4-3 !
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Gedanken
E-man,
Speaking of Northen happenings - Here's some good news - my main local when I'm back in the UK made it into the top 4 Camra pubs and still has a chance to be pub of the year.
Click on "Final four pubs battle it out " on the right hand side. It's Taps in Lytham.
Gedanken
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Questions and thoughts on the "1914 generation" doctrine, a brief history
by run dont walk inwell, its been 8 years since the last change in the "generation" term, i have seen lots of questions and great topics on this.. i would like to cover it from top to bottom (briefly, dont want to write an encyclopedia), and get your opinions, and see if i am right or way off track !!!!!.
1879 russell beging zions watchtower, and predicts end of the world by 1914, and all following him will go to heaven.. now, lets remember something here, russell never taught about a paradise earth, 144,000, generation ideas, or called god jehovah.. so in reality the jehovahs witness organization started with rutherford (and what a piece of work he was) in 1916-1917 or so.
rutherford assumes control of the organization, proceeds to disfellowship or fire all people in charge and replaces them with his own choices, thus causing new religions to start (russellites etc.
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Gedanken
The following quote is quite interesting to compare to what was said in 1995:
*** w51 7/1 403-4 Vision of the "Time of the End" ***
Though the statement pertaining to the time of trouble is brief, we should not understand that to indicate it is a very short time. For we are bound to take into account the many other prophecies in the book of Daniel, and elsewhere, in order to grasp how much is involved. Christ Jesus groups many such prophecies and enlarges on them when explaining to his disciples some of the things which must come to pass in the last days. (See Matthew 24.) He shows the beginning of this time and how the troubles increase, and mentions some of the sorrows to fall on the world, during the time of trouble. The length of time is indicated by him when he said, "Truly I say to you that this generation will by no means pass away until all these things occur." (Matt. 24:34, NW) The actual meaning of these words is, beyond question, that which takes a "generation" in the ordinary sense, as at Mark 8:12 and Acts 13:36, or for those who are living at the given period. So it was on "this generation" that the accumulated judgments were to fall. (Matt. 23:36) This therefore means that from 1914 a generation shall not pass till all is fulfilled, and amidst a great time of trouble.Gedanken
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Questions and thoughts on the "1914 generation" doctrine, a brief history
by run dont walk inwell, its been 8 years since the last change in the "generation" term, i have seen lots of questions and great topics on this.. i would like to cover it from top to bottom (briefly, dont want to write an encyclopedia), and get your opinions, and see if i am right or way off track !!!!!.
1879 russell beging zions watchtower, and predicts end of the world by 1914, and all following him will go to heaven.. now, lets remember something here, russell never taught about a paradise earth, 144,000, generation ideas, or called god jehovah.. so in reality the jehovahs witness organization started with rutherford (and what a piece of work he was) in 1916-1917 or so.
rutherford assumes control of the organization, proceeds to disfellowship or fire all people in charge and replaces them with his own choices, thus causing new religions to start (russellites etc.
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Gedanken
rdw,
Here is an interesting site where you can do a simple text-search in your browser for the term "generation" over the various "epochs" of WT history. It would be worth checking the quotations against original sources, of course, but this might be a useful start. The dates listed refer to dates mentioned by the WT in one way or another rather than to the dates that the various remarks were actually made - the latter are contained in the source references.
http://www1.tip.nl/%7Et661020/wtcitaten/part1.htm
Gedanken
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133
Who has despised the day of small things?
by Know_You inas the apostates increasingly gather courage, poking their vile heads out of their filthy spider-holes, slavering like the mad creatures that they are, as they shake their puny fists at the lord of all creation, jehovah's people may may become downhearted, even despondent.
many, we hear, are slowing down or even becoming inactive.
others have been so bold as to have risen up to question the slave as it faithfully dispenses food in due season.
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Gedanken
DO - it was fun while it lasted!
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133
Who has despised the day of small things?
by Know_You inas the apostates increasingly gather courage, poking their vile heads out of their filthy spider-holes, slavering like the mad creatures that they are, as they shake their puny fists at the lord of all creation, jehovah's people may may become downhearted, even despondent.
many, we hear, are slowing down or even becoming inactive.
others have been so bold as to have risen up to question the slave as it faithfully dispenses food in due season.
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Gedanken
Dear District Overseer,
If you will tell us by what authority you employ the name "District Overseer", and in which district you operate, and reveal you name, then I too will reveal mine.
Know_You
ps: who or what is meant by "YK"?