middleman

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Posts by middleman

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  125

  The Case for God

  by UnDisfellowshipped in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  the case for god:.

  the "big bang" argument for god:.

  the argument for god from evil:.

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  middleman

  Spook, with all do respect here, because of the lack of time (notice my short posts) I'll leave be for now. For me to answer your questions, it would take a considerable amount of time to address each and every one adequately, time in which I do not have, sorry. It would also take a considerable amount of time for me to brush up on my past studies etc. Unfortunately, I had an old laptop that burned up the hard drive and I lost all sorts of research. It's taken me over a year just to "reclaim" my WBTS research, a topic not nearly as deep as the evolution vs creation debate/discussion. I'm involved in so many other research/studies that I don't think it would be fair to you, I, or others to give a short "hack job" overview explanation of what you ask. I hope you do understand and if one thinks this is an opt out clause for my answer, I'm afraid there's not much I can convince you of otherwise. Maybe sometime down the road ok?
  
  I'm trying to finish up my research on the WBTS and I'm currently making PDF's of what I've found/read/seen. So far, I have 200 pages with another 200 or so to go. Once this is done (whenever that is lol) I hope to get back to studying evolution, dating methods, and like topics since it's been a little while that I've done so. I'm also in the process of starting a clothing line, this takes some considerable thought/time too.

  BTW, did I mention I'm writing two books and doing online/phone Bible studies (with various JW/EX JW's) also? I still meet with a MS every Wednesday which has been interesting. The notes I take from our study, I'm busy finding scriptures/publications to show him for the following week, ones that expose lies and contradictions. Ok take care now, I'm done yaking yak yak yak hehe.

  Blessings...
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  125

  The Case for God

  by UnDisfellowshipped in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  the case for god:.

  the "big bang" argument for god:.

  the argument for god from evil:.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  middleman

  "Basically, the way I see it, you have three choices as to what to believe about the Origin of the Universe:

  1:) The Universe (Time, Space, and Matter) always existed. (But this is shown to be wrong from all of the modern evidence for the Big Bang Theory)

  2:) The Universe (Time, Space, and Matter) was caused to exist by some Timeless, Spaceless, Non-Physical Being.

  3:) The Universe (Time, Space, and Matter) came into existence on its own, with no cause, from nothing, for no reason.

  Option # 2 seems the most reasonable to me out of those three choices."

  I think that pretty much sums it up....who here on the debate teams says what? Perhaps, you would like to add a 4 and 5 to this?
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  125

  The Case for God

  by UnDisfellowshipped in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  the case for god:.

  the "big bang" argument for god:.

  the argument for god from evil:.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
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  middleman

  "I am not bashing folks who want to believe if that helps them get through the day, I really do wish the promises of everlasting life/heaven/paradise or whatever future eternal bliss is promised were true. Who would not want this kind of future? But wanting it, however stongly, does not make it true."

  I can accept your sincerity here and I appreciate that. It's true that mere "wanting" an afterlife doesn't make it fact and I agree, but explaining it away won't make you a partaker of eternal life, if it does exist.
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  125

  The Case for God

  by UnDisfellowshipped in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  the case for god:.

  the "big bang" argument for god:.

  the argument for god from evil:.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  middleman

  "Yes, they became Christians or whatever religion they chose because of what they were told. It was not due to a long and careful anaysis of facts and data, they did it because they wanted to believe in something."

  I'm sorry I don't follow your bad ill misplaced generalizations. You're telling only what happens sometimes but not always sir. I have friends that were satanists that weren't told to believe in God or Jesus but did so on their own accord. Also, one of my friend's dad (that is a scientist-not sure the field) actually started to believe in God because of trying to disprove God through science and prove evolution for himself. My girlfriend's grandpa is a deist (though not a Christian) and he's a scientist also that has the "facts and data". In fact, he's helping us look for life on Mars since he's on the Mars rover expedition NASA team, though he works for JPL. It's more than just data...it's how you read it...

  Take care now...
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  125

  The Case for God

  by UnDisfellowshipped in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  the case for god:.

  the "big bang" argument for god:.

  the argument for god from evil:.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  middleman

  "And I figured you were probably a young earth creationist when you called the science dating methods "flawed."

  It's ok, I believe the methods are flawed based off of what I've researched and seen. Scientists are constantly at odds dating things based off of what strata they found them in. When they find a living index fossil that wasn't supposed to be in a certain era/strata (as they often have), then it's back to the drawing board again. I can/will explain that one sometime but it will be a Leolia (spelling?) type post, though maybe not as articulate lol. Dating the rocks from the fossils and the fossils from the rocks is circular reasoning at best. I've even seen this inadvertently admitted in some scientific journals.

  We got on this tangent because of a statement about tectonic activity not existing before the deluge. That's a ridiculous position, IMO...just like the idea that the global deluged carved the grand canyon, and pushed mountains up."

  I'm not saying I believe this for sure but I was merely throwing out there one of the theories that Christians believe
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  125

  The Case for God

  by UnDisfellowshipped in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  the case for god:.

  the "big bang" argument for god:.

  the argument for god from evil:.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  middleman

  "My former belief in God and everyones elses is based on what enviroment you were raised in and what you were told."

  Why do y'all write stuff like this? That's often times true yes, but I know plenty of people raised in atheist homes that became Christians and visa versa...as well as other faiths. This way of thought strikes me as a cop out...just my opinion.
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  125

  The Case for God

  by UnDisfellowshipped in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  the case for god:.

  the "big bang" argument for god:.

  the argument for god from evil:.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  middleman

  "FHN, stop it with your not-so-typical theist way of thinking. You're really throwing us off. ;)"

  It's easier to to pick apart the traditional "fundie" way of thinking huh? HAHA joking bro/sis, all in good fun here. I'm actually enjoying your posts. I like a good debate/discussion fun fun fun. Take care now...
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  125

  The Case for God

  by UnDisfellowshipped in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  the case for god:.

  the "big bang" argument for god:.

  the argument for god from evil:.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  middleman

  "Many Christians do believe that, so I don't think it's a straw man. When do you think man was created? When do you think the flood of Noah's day happened? BTW, generally the only people that try and fight science with regards to dating methods are the young earth creationists that believe the universe is 6000 years old."

  Maybe not a straw man per se (depends how you look at it)...I humbly recant. When do I think man was created?...um dunno, the time period still wouldn't prove evolution true regardless, even if it was millions of years ago. Your last sentence is true but you can't always base your arguments against someone's view that you may have improperly labeled within the norm.
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  125

  The Case for God

  by UnDisfellowshipped in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  the case for god:.

  the "big bang" argument for god:.

  the argument for god from evil:.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  middleman

  "I suppose you think the universe is literally 6000 years old?"

  No I do not...
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  125

  The Case for God

  by UnDisfellowshipped in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  the case for god:.

  the "big bang" argument for god:.

  the argument for god from evil:.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  middleman

  BTW, I am not one that believes man was created a mere 6000 years ago...that sir is a straw man. Many Christians do not ascribe to this...