continuing a topic that is dear to my heart because of my experience as both a shunner and a shunnee .... some people seem to get very agitated when i talk about the responsibility people have to make the right choices and that despite all the wrongs within the wts, people themselves have a role to play and some personal responsibility for the experience.. notice i said "some" responsibility, not "complete" - this doesn't absolve the wts for the things they do wrong in any way shape or form.
so please don't get argumentative about possible meanings and absolutes - of course the wts has a significant role to play but we need to decide what we're trying to achieve here and why the personal choice is so important.. i'm also not talking about actual crimes that the wts should answer for.
if they cover up child abuse for instance, they absolutely should be reported immediately.
"Look at that mother who fronted at one of the conventions in the US earlier this year (now on youtube) who declared to the audience she had told her children, "I love you and would give my life for you. But if you leave Jehovah, I won't be there.""
Steve2 - Do you have the link to that?
so my wife and i were curious so i researched some financial links and found records indicating that the wt society has been operating at a loss since the year 2012. as you read the links it shows a loss of 10 million $$$ in 2012, about 16 million $$$ in 2013, and a whopping loss of 56 million $$$ in 2014 - where the expenditures exceeded the revenues for each of those years in the amount i've mentioned.
also there is a link on this same website with the sec records indicating that the wt society and it's representatives funneled 40 million $$$$ into hedge funds in the cayman islands as early as 2007. if you look online on other sites you can see evidence that indicates the wt society attended hedge fund conferences to look into more shadiness in 2011 and isn't it curious that by 2012 the wt society started showing losses.
anyway here is the link : https://www.watchtowerlies.com/the_watchtower_revenue.html .. feel free to check this link out and other links on that link indicating the cayman island connection.
"Gilead was re-purposed about 5 years ago. It no longer trains missionaries. Its "graduates" are usually sent back to their country of origin to shore up "weak" congregations."
Do they still get an allowance from the society?
so my wife and i were curious so i researched some financial links and found records indicating that the wt society has been operating at a loss since the year 2012. as you read the links it shows a loss of 10 million $$$ in 2012, about 16 million $$$ in 2013, and a whopping loss of 56 million $$$ in 2014 - where the expenditures exceeded the revenues for each of those years in the amount i've mentioned.
also there is a link on this same website with the sec records indicating that the wt society and it's representatives funneled 40 million $$$$ into hedge funds in the cayman islands as early as 2007. if you look online on other sites you can see evidence that indicates the wt society attended hedge fund conferences to look into more shadiness in 2011 and isn't it curious that by 2012 the wt society started showing losses.
anyway here is the link : https://www.watchtowerlies.com/the_watchtower_revenue.html .. feel free to check this link out and other links on that link indicating the cayman island connection.
Don't they still have the missionary school? What is it, Gilead?
Which means even though they are cutting back on Special Pioneers/Missionaries, they are still continuously adding more back in...
Dumb...
continuing a topic that is dear to my heart because of my experience as both a shunner and a shunnee .... some people seem to get very agitated when i talk about the responsibility people have to make the right choices and that despite all the wrongs within the wts, people themselves have a role to play and some personal responsibility for the experience.. notice i said "some" responsibility, not "complete" - this doesn't absolve the wts for the things they do wrong in any way shape or form.
so please don't get argumentative about possible meanings and absolutes - of course the wts has a significant role to play but we need to decide what we're trying to achieve here and why the personal choice is so important.. i'm also not talking about actual crimes that the wts should answer for.
if they cover up child abuse for instance, they absolutely should be reported immediately.
continuing a topic that is dear to my heart because of my experience as both a shunner and a shunnee .... some people seem to get very agitated when i talk about the responsibility people have to make the right choices and that despite all the wrongs within the wts, people themselves have a role to play and some personal responsibility for the experience.. notice i said "some" responsibility, not "complete" - this doesn't absolve the wts for the things they do wrong in any way shape or form.
so please don't get argumentative about possible meanings and absolutes - of course the wts has a significant role to play but we need to decide what we're trying to achieve here and why the personal choice is so important.. i'm also not talking about actual crimes that the wts should answer for.
if they cover up child abuse for instance, they absolutely should be reported immediately.
"remind her that it really is and that she is making it without knowing or being able to explain what it's based on"
That's true.
continuing a topic that is dear to my heart because of my experience as both a shunner and a shunnee .... some people seem to get very agitated when i talk about the responsibility people have to make the right choices and that despite all the wrongs within the wts, people themselves have a role to play and some personal responsibility for the experience.. notice i said "some" responsibility, not "complete" - this doesn't absolve the wts for the things they do wrong in any way shape or form.
so please don't get argumentative about possible meanings and absolutes - of course the wts has a significant role to play but we need to decide what we're trying to achieve here and why the personal choice is so important.. i'm also not talking about actual crimes that the wts should answer for.
if they cover up child abuse for instance, they absolutely should be reported immediately.
I see what your saying, Simon, but am not sure I totally agree with it.
My sister, for example. It would kill her to shun me but she'd do it because she really feels that she's doing the hardest thing for her and me, to do what's in my best interests. To her, it would be a sacrifice she's making, and an extremely painful one at that, to do what she believes is in MY best interests.
Can I really find any fault with her???
so my wife and i were curious so i researched some financial links and found records indicating that the wt society has been operating at a loss since the year 2012. as you read the links it shows a loss of 10 million $$$ in 2012, about 16 million $$$ in 2013, and a whopping loss of 56 million $$$ in 2014 - where the expenditures exceeded the revenues for each of those years in the amount i've mentioned.
also there is a link on this same website with the sec records indicating that the wt society and it's representatives funneled 40 million $$$$ into hedge funds in the cayman islands as early as 2007. if you look online on other sites you can see evidence that indicates the wt society attended hedge fund conferences to look into more shadiness in 2011 and isn't it curious that by 2012 the wt society started showing losses.
anyway here is the link : https://www.watchtowerlies.com/the_watchtower_revenue.html .. feel free to check this link out and other links on that link indicating the cayman island connection.
"The 2015 yearbook states that $224 million was spent on special pioneers, missionaries and travelling overseas and that there are 24,711 working at branch offices worldwide. It was $200 million in 2013 and $184 million in 2012."
I'd think getting rid of Special Pioneers and Missionaries would be an easy way to cut back without it affecting most of the r&f...
continuing a topic that is dear to my heart because of my experience as both a shunner and a shunnee .... some people seem to get very agitated when i talk about the responsibility people have to make the right choices and that despite all the wrongs within the wts, people themselves have a role to play and some personal responsibility for the experience.. notice i said "some" responsibility, not "complete" - this doesn't absolve the wts for the things they do wrong in any way shape or form.
so please don't get argumentative about possible meanings and absolutes - of course the wts has a significant role to play but we need to decide what we're trying to achieve here and why the personal choice is so important.. i'm also not talking about actual crimes that the wts should answer for.
if they cover up child abuse for instance, they absolutely should be reported immediately.
I think part of it might be the attitude of the shunner. There's always partial responsibility, but, degrees vary depending on their approach.
For example, if my younger sister ever had to shun me, it would absolutely break her heart. She would be tormented by it and for me, there would be nothing to forgive if she ever figured out ttatt.
My younger brother, on the other hand, actively shuns me even though I've just faded. So much so that I can't even meet his newborn. Not as easy to forgive...
continuing a topic that is dear to my heart because of my experience as both a shunner and a shunnee .... some people seem to get very agitated when i talk about the responsibility people have to make the right choices and that despite all the wrongs within the wts, people themselves have a role to play and some personal responsibility for the experience.. notice i said "some" responsibility, not "complete" - this doesn't absolve the wts for the things they do wrong in any way shape or form.
so please don't get argumentative about possible meanings and absolutes - of course the wts has a significant role to play but we need to decide what we're trying to achieve here and why the personal choice is so important.. i'm also not talking about actual crimes that the wts should answer for.
if they cover up child abuse for instance, they absolutely should be reported immediately.
"people themselves have a role to play and some personal responsibility for the experience.
Notice I said "some" responsibility, not "complete""
I completely agree. There are people I've mourned as if they had died, because of the shunning. If they ever came around, I'm not so sure I'd want a relationship with them. Not only do they have some responsibility, but, there are consequences to choices made that might never be able to be undone...
who won, and why?.
the rebel..
Actually, scratch that. The whole thing with Ceders was the biggest debate, or maybe, argument on here. I think somebody got outted on FaceBook because of it. It was a WARZONE on here...
The Trevor thing was apparently a huge thing on here also. Apparently, he faked an illness and had people sending money to him or something. But, that was right before my time here but the board was still really pissed off/sensitive because of it...
