Posts by russell1879

13

Elders & Bankruptcy

by krismalone in

i found an interesting post about an elder who has a warrant for his arrest & filed for bankruptcy & owes over 30 creditors money.. what is the society's stand on that matter?.

http://en.allexperts.com/q/jehovah-s-witness-1617/2011/3/jw-elders-honesty.htm.

One major factor that the society cares about is "how many people know" and if they're "upset". If no one cares or complains to the society or the elders, then this dishonest elder might very well be protected by his fellow elders and allow him to continue serving. That article also mentions that this elder "Phil A. Rohrer" has a warrant for his arrest? Can you elaborate a little more on that? Does he have a pattern of not paying his debts?

By receiving complaints from others, maybe even writing to the Kingdom Hall in the address listed about this matter, would definitely get the ball rolling for this elder to be removed from his responsabilities. He should deleted as he no longer qualifies for not having testimony from outsiders as the 1994 Sept 15 Watchtower says regarding bankruptcy.

27

Anyone With Major Judicial/Service Department Experience?

by A question in

jw
friends

is there anyone on the board with a large amount of experience with judicial matters or (preferably) with the service department of the society or perhaps even worked on the service department?

if so, i would appreciate the answers to at least some of the following questions:.

does the society ever take the initiative to remove elders, and if so, how do they do it?

russell1879

I have experience as an elder and know very well the current policies on deletions.

Yes I have heard of how whole body of elders can be deleted. Back in 1995 in Brooklyn Williamsburg Spanish Cong. The P.O. had committed adultery and confessed to his wife. The body however did not take any action (PO confessed to them too!). The elders told the wife to leave it in Jah's hands and that it's not her position to run ahead of God's theocratic organization. She decided to go directly to Bethel & assigned a special comitte of elders from Bethel and sure enough the body knew and all of them were deleted (5 of them) & PO df'd. The society immediatley sent Bethelites (up to 18 at one time) including heavies from the service dept.

Another case is what a DO said on a circuit assembly (Ted Amendt Spanish DO) about a body of elders in florida not following the instructions of the society about the accounting paperwork, audit etc. After some 3 visits of not following the counsel & instructions the whole body was deleted. I guess this happened when the D.O. was C.O. as the former do not visit congos per se.

The June 9, 2008 Body of elder letter states the procedure to delete an elder. Instructions are repeated in the new elder book chapter 3. Basically Procedure is the following:

* If elder commits adultery, fornication, murder etc the body does not need to wait from the society to annouce his deletion. Actually it will be announced in the very next service meeting and judicial action to be taken ASAP.

* If elder did not commit a gross sin but the body feels he no longer qualifies, the issue is handled during the CO visit unless the visit is not close & matter is urgent. In that case the body meets with the brother and hear him out and analyze if qualifies. They then ask the brother to step outside and they deliberate. If they recommend his deletion and the elder does not agree, then he's allowed to write a letter appealing the decision & that letter is sent along with the elders to the society. Then they all have to wait for an answer from the Society. Meantime the elder body has the right to decide if they want to give the brother any talks, demonstrations, service group etc.

In order for a whole body to be deleted, there must be blatant negligence, rebelion and or gross sin covered up. In that case The Society will send the CO maybe DO if possible and or prominent elders to decide the matter. Regarding troubleshooters the CO may decide to send an experienced elder to serve in the body and keep an eye on matters. However, he alone cannot take any action and if he doesn't watch his back, the local body of elders can easily trump up charges against him and he'll end up getting deleted as I've seen before when some MTS elder arrives alone to a problematic Congregation.

Regarding getting information from the service department, good luck as they are very secretive about how they work even among other elders.

Russell1879