Losch's implied private information that he has been given includes these things:
1. These things that are going to happen to “mankind” are in the IMMEDIATE future.
2. There will be an International STATEMENT or SITUATION (This wording covers anything at all that could possibly happen in any form).
3. The STATEMENT or SITUATION will include “people”(mankind) crying out.
4. Those “people”(mankind) will cry out the words “Peace and Security.”(This is in reference to the wording in a scripture in the Bible)
5. WE (WTBTS) know by private means apart from just reading the scriptures that this definite occurrence has NOT yet occurred.
6. We don’t know if these “people”(mankind) are crying out because they want peace or because THEY believe that peace has been achieved. (Again, the scriptures indicate that the people will cry out peace and safety but peace and safety is not there. So Losch is presenting this same scripture in a way that implies private knowledge but also makes sure he sticks to the wording of the scripture so that it can be sited as a source for future defense)
7. All of the inhabitants of the earth have heard OUR gospel message, thus Matt. 24:14 has been fulfilled. (The WTBTS believes that it is not by reading the Bible that you are able to hear the Gospel message, but instead it is by reading the WTBTS literature[this can be proven with quotes from their own literature]. So Losch is saying that everyone on the earth has had the opportunity to read the WTBTS literature, that is why this scripture has been fulfilled.)
8. The Great Tribulation has 3 stages.
9. The accounts of Jerusalem’s unfaithfulness in the Bible was written in the Bible to actually describe modern day Christianity (Christendom). (WE (WTBTS) know that when the scriptures indicate that it was Jerusalem and the Jews who were unfaithful and deserved God’s judgment, what the writer really meant was modern day Christianity and not Jerusalem at all. [At one time the founders of the WTBTS believed they were part of Christianity. Later they decided they were not and began to call it “Christendom.”] )
10. Political Nations who are members of the United Nations will devastate modern day Christianity. (Losch has not yet indicated whether or not this is part of the Armageddon process).
11. Political Nations who are members of the United Nations will take a stand against false religions. (This, of course, does not include the WTBTS, so regardless of when or how the U.N. decides to attack FALSE religions, doesn’t that mean that Jehovah’s Witnesses have nothing to worry about at all? This actually means that the United Nations will be acting as a friend to the WTBTS and a friend to Jesus if they go ahead and wipe out all false religions and leave the WTBTS undisturbed.)
12. Al-Qaeda is not going to attack the WTBTS because they remain neutral in the political world. (Al-Qaeda is only attacking political nations…..not all of those nations who have managed to become a nation without being political.)
13. Governments will take over religious bank accounts and arrest leaders of false religions. (Again, the Jehovah’s Witnesses are not included in this because they believe they are not a religion but instead the actual organization built by God. They also believe that “Clergy” are leaders of false religions. So again, governments will be acting in favor of the WTBTS, just like a friend.)
14. The arrest and illegal confiscation of federally funded bank accounts will PROBABLY happen.
15. They also will POSSIBLY kill them (Clergy).
16. There will be frightening phenomenon in the sky more IMPRESSIVE than what happened in Jerusalem. This frightening event is LIKELY to happen.
17. The historian Josephus wrote about a comet that appeared and remained visible for 1 year in JERUSALEM. (Again, Jerusalem now means modern day Christianity).
18. The sea could also roar and become agitated. It COULD.
19. All of these things speculated will occur before the anointed dies off. The anointed COULD also be killed in Armageddon. (The WTBTS believes that only the wicked people will be killed in Armageddon. Since the current anointed are thought to consist of only members of the WTBTS this brings into question why the WTBTS now believes that they are wicked.)
20. The anointed MAY be killed along with the wicked in Armageddon. They MAY also survive into the NEW WORLD. (This New World is not heaven, it is Paradise. So now the wicked anointed will no longer be in heaven with the 144,000 but MAY be in Paradise with the non-anointed instead.)
21. EVERYONE, including those who believe in false religions and including those who know nothing about the Bible will KNOW that this is the Armageddon that the Bible spoke about. (The scripture is given in reference to “every eye will see him”, however the WTBTS has indicated all along that “every eye will see him” means every eye of the anointed in heaven, and not every eye on earth since it is impossible for people in Australia to physically see something that is happening at the same time in New York since we now know that the earth is not flat. But Losch is now indicating that the scripture means exactly what it says, and does in fact mean EVERY human eye on earth will see Armageddon even though they could not see Jesus at all when he returned, and will KNOW that it is the Armageddon mentioned in a book they have never read. (This indicates that it will be the holy spirit communicating with the wicked, and that creates another set of questions.)
22. Jehovah MAY use radiation to destroy the wicked. (By applying logic to his previous statements, Losch is in fact indicating that God MAY kill some of the wicked anointed by using radiation).
23. Members of the Jehovah’s Witnesses will likely be standing on their roof when Armageddon starts.
24. Jehovah’s Witnesses are to use a ladder or use the stairs that lead to their roof when they begin to see people starting to die from the effects of God’s Radiation, and they are to RUN to the nearest Kingdom Hall. (Don’t drive. Cars are not as radiation proof as you are so don’t use your car when you see the flesh falling off of your neighbor as they fall off of THEIR roof.)
25. (Because many of the people who are being radiated and having their flesh fall off will be mortgage lenders and customers) you WILL lose your home and your business.
26. Armageddon will not be the only thing occurring as you are running to the Kingdom Hall. There will also be a test given indicating who had personal possessions in hand while they were running and who did not. The test will be called “How we View Material Things.”
27. If the Kingdom Hall is not there when you get there, then it was not the Kingdom Hall that you were supposed to run to after all. You were instead supposed to run right into Paradise. (Just run until you find fellow Jehovah’s Witnesses carrying number 2 pencils and no personal belongings)
28. Jesus said that we would not really be required to show EVERYONE our literature before Armageddon starts. But Jehovah MAY decide to open up new territories just in case we want to anyway.
29. The United Nations is the eighth and final king.
30. The 1000 years in Paradise will consist of a very large and dedicated cleaning crew.
31. The Jehovah’s Witnesses will be the Janitorial Staff in Paradise in charge of discarding all the dead bodies of the wicked anointed who were left behind as well as the dead bodies of the billions of people who were not JW or members of the remaining anointed.
32. This massive cleaning up is to clear the earth of dead body debris so that the dead who did not die in Armageddon have room to resurrect.
33. For those of you who were previously encouraged to believe that Paradise was all about petting lions and lambs, you took that too literally. Life in Paradise will be just like it is now in structure and workload, only harder. (However all the evil people will no longer be around to question anything we are telling you.)
34. WE know through private means exactly how God plans to organize the resurrection. He will do it in stages and MAY or MAY NOT choose to have the resurrected appear in the nude.
35. Those who died as a result of being eaten by a shark will not turn from shark poop back into complete living bodies at the bottom of the ocean and then have to hold their breath all the way to the surface and then swim all the way to a coast line, NAKED or CLOTHED.
36. WE SUSPECT that there MAY be SPECIAL HOUSES wherein they can resurrect more practically without all of that effort to survive once they have come back to life.
37. WE KNOW that resurrecting makes a person hungry. That is why all of YOU who were able to run right into Paradise without any belongings will be in charge of feeding them.
38. Giant Squid today are able to grow back new arms. Amazonian fish today are able to grow new teeth. That is why the future resurrected humans will not be missing any limbs. (God will use this same miraculous method he uses to grow back a lizards tail to replace the arms and legs of newly resurrected humans. The resurrection alone will not restore these things. It will take an additional process much the same as the process currently used on Giant Squid. So those who accidentally fell into a wood chipper before the resurrection can still be resurrected. However, they will have no arms, head, legs, feet, etc until God uses that secondary process on them that he currently uses to create Amazonian fish teeth).
39. DO NOT invest in your own personal life.
40. ONLY invest in things that benefit the WTBTS.
41. View this as a PIVILEGE.
42. ALL OF THIS IS ABOUT TO HAPPEN.
43. WE (WTBTS) KNOW that it is going to happen IMMEDIATELY.
44. YOU will only be spared if you listen to US.
45. Jesus PERSONALLY told US (WTBTS) all these things.
46. (If you have no idea how to apply any of this message to your actual life, just convey to all around you the fact that you are worried and feel you need to work harder distributing OUR literature)
Pickled
JoinedPosts by Pickled
-
50
Notes From Hawaii-Gerrit Losch Talk
by Save My Soul ina (conditional) friend sent me some notes from the talk in hawaii.
gerrit was the keynote speaker.
this occurred 'immediately after the tribulation of those days' (matthew 24:29), referring to the destruction of babylon the great.
-
-
Pickled
-
8
Deconstruction Video Parts I & II
by Pickled inpart i .
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gezsqscgwzm&feature=related .
part ii .
-
-
Pickled
Thank you Missinglink for the Links. :-)
-
36
Ex-JWs... feelings of isolation, agoraphobia...?
by Moxie inhi all... :) sorry for the novel.... i'm just wondering if there are any others out there who share similar experiences as me or have any comments and insight.... when i was a jw i was very, very social and active with friends and family in a wide range of activities.
i would even have considered myself the party-starter ;).
i used to plan events and social get togethers for all kinds of situations.
-
-
Pickled
Quandry, what a difficult and heart-wrenching experience you all went through. What were those things that began to change in your perception that made the difference? How did you see some things then that you see differently now that has made the inner conflict less than it was before?
-
50
Notes From Hawaii-Gerrit Losch Talk
by Save My Soul ina (conditional) friend sent me some notes from the talk in hawaii.
gerrit was the keynote speaker.
this occurred 'immediately after the tribulation of those days' (matthew 24:29), referring to the destruction of babylon the great.
-
-
Pickled
“…but Wong said the building will remain purely for bible educational meetings.”
"Our materials are not that religiously oriented," Wong said.
Is there "New Light" that redefines the word "Purely"? -
15
URGENT RESPONSE NEEDED
by shell69 infrom my jwd friends.
i have a situation and need some jw literature quotationes regairding the following issues.
i disposed of all my dub literature upon my exit, and need help with this;.
-
-
Pickled
The WTBTS hates bad publicity and will even change their divine doctrines to avoid it. So write a letter to the editor of your local newspaper about the WTBTS allowing the members to sneak your children into services that the parents have said are not allowed. If your letter doesn't show in the editorial section then purchase an announcement stating that you are warning parents in the area of this practice.
The chain reaction will be a letter sent to that Cong's PO from the Society ordering the BOE to announce to it's members that they need to ask parents permission before bringing a child.
Publicity is the only thing this organization understands and responds to. -
36
Ex-JWs... feelings of isolation, agoraphobia...?
by Moxie inhi all... :) sorry for the novel.... i'm just wondering if there are any others out there who share similar experiences as me or have any comments and insight.... when i was a jw i was very, very social and active with friends and family in a wide range of activities.
i would even have considered myself the party-starter ;).
i used to plan events and social get togethers for all kinds of situations.
-
-
Pickled
Having your name removed from the membership list, for a Jehovah’s Witness, is the equivalent of a social and spiritual death. It is to experience a death of identity. All of your friends have died, you have died, your family members have died, your social activities have died, and you are as good as dead to your creator. Your spiritual boundaries have all been erased, and you are now at the mercy of the wicked ruler of this world and every step you take is resulting in only aiding and abetting the same wicked system you used to recognize as evil.
That’s quite a load to carry.
In that moment when you find yourself saturated in all of these messages, there is also that same voice inside of you wondering “Are they right?”
Then these thoughts may follow…
“They must not be right or I would have never left” or “They must not be right or they would have been able to show a little more compassion before removing my membership” or “They must not be right because there is so much evidence that their teachings are wrong.”
Now you are in a defensive mode without one single ally on your side. You are in a defensive mode and your mind is filled with all of the indoctrination you filled it with about the Bible and the supreme authority of the “slave.” So many witnesses at this point, because of those teachings they learned that told them it is the Watchtower or death, think that they now have to hurry up and figure out what or whom they are supposed to follow instead. This is actually the worst possible time to do that.
You are suspended in a state of temporary limbo and your mind is packed with everything that you learned that has now just betrayed you. So you begin looking around in an effort to find things that will replace those ideas. Nothing looks reasonable and in everything you are considering you are simply introducing those new ideas to the teachings you currently have. Well, of course the teachings you currently have in your mind were 100% accurate before, and after all you were able to even argue against these new ideas at one time with total conviction. This exercise is difficult and unnecessary at this point in your life because there are other things that need to be addressed before you can begin to find a balance within yourself.
The first step is to begin the process of finding out how you really feel and why. How you feel about what you have just experienced. How you feel as a human being who has just experienced a great loss. Maybe you are wrong and they are right. Maybe you are right and they are wrong. Regardless of either side, what is certain is that your status as a former member required from you a willingness to never look in the eye how you felt about anything at all. You were not there to feel, you were there to believe and to contribute to that belief structure. So spend a little bit of time saying out loud how all of this has made you feel. That will be new enough to begin with.
Some of the messages swirling around in the mind of a former JW should be looked at for what they actually are, and acknowledged in an open and honest way so the impact that they are having is diminished once they are spoken out loud as very real thoughts.
Some of the internal dialogue of feelings may include….
“I feel so much grief right now because I have lost virtually everything I have ever known.”
“I feel abandoned by a group that I once felt so close to and safe with, and am so deeply hurt because it seemed so easy for them to sever their relationship with me.”
“The scripture that I used to quote so often keeps playing over and over in my mind, ‘Lord, whom shall we go away to?’ and here I am with nowhere to go and alone.”
“How can the WTBTS be a cult when there are over 6 million members?”
“I feel like I am suspended in a state of unbelief and have nowhere to turn spiritually.”
“I feel betrayed and guilty at the same time.”
“I feel so much sadness for all those years that I now feel I gave away in exchange for something that turned out to be a lie.”
“I feel hopeless like I am walking around in a pit of despair because nothing makes sense anymore.”
“I feel like I can never try hard enough to pull myself up to another way of thinking.”
“I feel like a failure.”
“I feel like all the people that once accepted me now hate me and I feel shame over that.”
“I feel so angry about all of this. I feel stupid for believing it to begin with and I feel angry for so many other reasons as well.”
“I feel like everything seems like too much to handle right now. I feel like this death of my identity has stripped from me the ability to find my own way right now.”
“Every time the phone rings, my doorbell rings, or every time I experience something that used to be easy so ordinary, I now feel immobilized and anxious as though something is going to be expected of me that I just can’t cope with.”
Truth has not been patented by the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society. I don’t mean the truth about what the scriptures really mean, I mean truthful things, truthful statements, true feelings, true emotions, your true thoughts. When you were a member of the WTBTS you were not allowed to be truthful. You were claiming to live for “The Truth” while at the same time never allowed to actually tell the truth about how you felt about something if it did not agree with “The Truth.” So you smiled and lied. At the time you felt you were not lying, you were instead adjusting your thoughts so that they would submit to more correct thinking. Less independent thoughts equaled more accurate thoughts. Now that you are separated from the group and entirely independent, do you feel as though your thinking is wrong all the time? Are you having a hard time believing that your own thoughts about almost anything might be accurate? Are you afraid to make a wrong decision in every little thing?
If I say that I feel sad today, and you say “No you don’t” then I am going to think that you are claiming indirectly that you are either psychic or that I am a liar. I will think this because everyone knows that feelings are the personal property of the one feeling them. Learning to express your true feelings out loud seems easy enough, but it’s not really. The easy part is finding the lies and inconsistencies in the WTBTS doctrines and teachings because they are right there for all to see in black and white print. It is just a matter of connecting the dots. However, what you learned to do with your feelings is entirely different. They were supposed to be personal and part of your human experience and expression. If someone is expressing their feelings in a destructive, distracting, or uncontrollable way then that is a valve that needs adjusting for the benefit of the one who has lost control of their emotions, maybe for those around them as well. That is not the same thing as not being allowed to express normal doubts or fears without repercussions. That is not the same thing as having to train yourself to mask thoughts, ideas, or feelings in an effort to gain favor or avoid reproof.
These are all my own personal opinions only, and it is my opinion that starting with expressing your feelings in the most accurate and honest way out loud every time the phone rings, every time someone knocks on your door, every time you have to leave your house for something other than work, is a good place to start. It can be surprising to hear yourself say how you really feel about something, and it can even sound ridiculous, dramatic, irrational, or not based on the reality of the moment at all. But it is how you really feel, and if you give it a voice it just might shrink down to something a little more manageable. That is what a Therapist gets paid a lot per hour to do; to listen to you say out loud how you feel. I would recommend therapy by a professional that has experience with cults, but you have implied that professional therapy is not something you want to do right now. Another suggestion would be to talk to a general physician about anti-depressants and let him or her know why you are asking about that. The most important thing, in my opinion, is to do whatever you can with what you have available so that you can begin to feel a little hopeful. Hope is an ingredient that can go a long way. -
36
Ex-JWs... feelings of isolation, agoraphobia...?
by Moxie inhi all... :) sorry for the novel.... i'm just wondering if there are any others out there who share similar experiences as me or have any comments and insight.... when i was a jw i was very, very social and active with friends and family in a wide range of activities.
i would even have considered myself the party-starter ;).
i used to plan events and social get togethers for all kinds of situations.
-
-
-
36
Ex-JWs... feelings of isolation, agoraphobia...?
by Moxie inhi all... :) sorry for the novel.... i'm just wondering if there are any others out there who share similar experiences as me or have any comments and insight.... when i was a jw i was very, very social and active with friends and family in a wide range of activities.
i would even have considered myself the party-starter ;).
i used to plan events and social get togethers for all kinds of situations.
-
-
Pickled
Disfellowshipping or Leaving, Evidence of a "social death."
http://members.tripod.com/lee_hardiman/soc-death.html
Complex Post-Traumatic Stress Disorder experienced by cult members:
http://members.tripod.com/lee_hardiman/c-ptsd.html -
36
Ex-JWs... feelings of isolation, agoraphobia...?
by Moxie inhi all... :) sorry for the novel.... i'm just wondering if there are any others out there who share similar experiences as me or have any comments and insight.... when i was a jw i was very, very social and active with friends and family in a wide range of activities.
i would even have considered myself the party-starter ;).
i used to plan events and social get togethers for all kinds of situations.
-
-
Pickled
Moxie,
Many times the WTBTS is referred to as a cult by ex-JW. However, when they decided to actually leave or were told to leave, they did not approach the process as though they had just walked away from a cult. Instead, what many seem to do is to treat their experience in the same way someone would who just decided to walk out of a Baptist church and become a Methodist.
It is not the same thing at all, and that is why so many of the ex-JW do not get the help that they need. It sounds like you didn't either. It's true that many therapists are not going to be very effective in helping you work through the effects a religion had on you, and part of that reason is because they might not understand, and maybe you didn't either, that it is not just another "religion", but is instead a cult.
What you are describing sounds very much like a combination of 2 things.
1. Post-Traumatic Stress Disorder
2. Depression
It isn't only combat that causes PTSD, or violent crime. Leaving a cult can do that too. As a matter of fact, it is quite COMMON in former cult members.
Here is a website that will explain how the two are related and you will see yourself in this description... http://www.freedomofmind.com/resourcecenter/articles/ptsd-cuddy.htm
So many people on these forums are suffering from this and don't even know it. This isn't something you can just "rise above" by a sheer act of will or having a more positive outlook. What you are experiencing will continue this way unless you begin to properly identify it. I know this has been so painful for you, it is evident in your words. I think that it has been so painful for so long because you have not been given the proper tools to work through it, and did not know where to go to find them. Start here, and then post and post and post some more of your feelings and thoughts and what you are discovering. Acquaint yourself with what a cult actually is and how it affects people. Start calling it a cult and not just some old screwy religion you walked away from.
You have heard the expression of "being in the grip of". Well, that is what you were; "in the grip of" a very devastating cult. Please write more and ask more and I will be happy to keep checking on this thread to answer or research or help in any way I possibly can. -
50
Notes From Hawaii-Gerrit Losch Talk
by Save My Soul ina (conditional) friend sent me some notes from the talk in hawaii.
gerrit was the keynote speaker.
this occurred 'immediately after the tribulation of those days' (matthew 24:29), referring to the destruction of babylon the great.
-
-
Pickled
Among protestant denominations there is a standard method for delivering a sermon. The Pastor, Preacher, Minister, etc begins his sermon by reading on average 3 different scriptures. Most of the time all 3 are in different locations in the bible. Those scriptures may or may not apply to the sermon that follows. The challenge many times, if you intend to use that sermon as a tool for learning more about the Bible, is to try and figure out how exactly those scriptures tie into the sermon's message, or had anything to do with the sermon at all. If you pay careful attention to the progression of the message, and if you keep those original 3 scriptures right in front of you, you will find that most of the time the actual message had little to do with the scriptures that were read at the start of the message. It seems as though the scriptures are read at the beginning as a way to cause the audience to assign more "biblical authority" to the message than what it actually contains.
This preacher named Losch seems to use the same method. The difference though is that he sprinkles the scripture verses throughout his message instead of clumping them all together at the beginning. The result appears to be the same as well. The body of the message that he preaches actually has very little to do with the scriptures that he includes. If you list the scriptures in one column and the entire message in another, what he actually says does not tie into those scriptures very often at all.
As a matter of fact, even the few times that his spoken words tie into the scriptures, it is an obvious misuse of most of those references and taken completely out of context. The Protestant preachers already know that most of the members of the audience are not going to go home and read the 3 scriptures within their actual context and attempt to align it with the message. It is also glaringly obvious that this JW minister believes exactly the same thing about his audience as well. If a free home "Bible" study included studying the Bible and not just WTBTS literature, the JW listening to this sermon given by Losch would have recognized how far removed from the Bible it actually was.