wobble

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Posts by wobble

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  7

  jwfacts

  by mankkeli in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible
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  wobble

  Or, are you directing readers to the excellent JW Facts.Org website ?

  I do hope so, it is full of accurate, truthful, well written articles all about jw facts.
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  13

  If You Had 5 minutes to Create Doubt

  by roxanesophia in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i regularly encounter jw's i knew while studying and it kills me that they would likely not listen long enough for me to tell them the truth about the truth.

  my mother says "don't even bother.

  it's like finding out you were adopted.

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  wobble

  As I said on 00Dad's thread about waking up his sons, the trigger for each individual witness is different, shoving various issues under their nose will only convince them you are an opposer.

  The best thing is to make it plain that you are leading a happy and fulfilled life now, because they for sure are not.

  Perhaps a quick question that may lay afoundation would be "You know I have problems with the religion, surely you don't think it is perfect in every way? "

  Their reply will show you where they struggle, and you may be able to direct them to a good source of help, for example saying, "I read an excellent article about that on JW Facts. Org"

  Good luck.
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  28

  A Letter to My Sons ... A Request for Help

  by 00DAD in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  it has now been over two years since i was df'd.

  in that time i have had limited contact with my 17 year old son, the younger, and almost no contact with my 20 year old.

  the older boy was baptized 5 years ago and sadly the younger just recently took the plunge into the "pool-aid".

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  wobble

  The problem with trying to free individuals, and both your sons are different, is that a trigger that may work with one person will have no effect on another.

  When you read the threads on here as to why and how people woke up there are so many varied reasons,when I look back on my own experience there were many things I was aware of, that were enough to awaken others, but not dumb old me,until my "trigger" came along.

  What I am leading up to is: if you wish to free your sons , you may do more harm than good by pushing various issues under their noses, they may come to view you as trying to do exactly what you are trying to do, get them to leave the religion, they will then cease to listen.

  Having said that, I am not sure of the best approach, but something that comes to mind is try first of all to simply ask "what convinces you it is the truth ?"

  They know you have "doubts" so you can say their reason for their faith may help you restore yours.

  The answers will give you a clue as to what their belief really stands upon, will also make them look at their faith.

  Do not attack their reasons in any way, or even comment on them, just thank them , and then ask, "But you know many folks have problems with various things about the JW's, surely to you, not everything is perfect about the religion ?"

  You can then agree 100% with any problem they highlight, and point out how, if it were God's org. surely such a problem should not exist within it ?

  All you may achieve by this is getting tham to think a little, but that is a good start, and you should not alienate them.

  Keep assuring them of your unconditional love.

  Just my thoughts, and the best of luck !
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  22

  Another question for those who attended the "Mentally Diseased" Watchtower

  by cantleave in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  nugget and i are helping amelia prepare for her statement to the police tomorrow.

  one of the possible objections is that the term "mentally diseased" is metaphorical.. when people answered on this paragraph did they say "people who leave are metally diseased" or did they say "they are like mentally diseased" people?.

  if they said the former it would indicate that they did not take it metaphorically..

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  wobble

  As I wrote on another thread, I can see the WT using the metaphor defense as an excuse, but anybody reading the article will see their words are designed to single out a particular group of people and label them in such a way that the R&F Dubs, and any other readers of the Rag, will fear, hate and despise that group, ("Apostates").

  I think that testimony as to how this article was understood by the averge congregation is very powerful ,if we cannot get a recording, perhaps some of you good folks on here will be prepared to give proof of what you heard said during the study, in some form that the Police will be able to use.

  The actual words used, the motive behind them too, are not the most important transgression of the Act, it is the effect these words have.

  Good luck Amelia !
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  23

  1904 and Russell taken to task for 606 BCE...calling you brainiacs!

  by Aussie Oz in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  while cruising through the oct 1 1904 watctower i found this interesting challenge to russells 606 date.

  his response in part is also pasted from the wt, but goes on to a very lengthy argument that seems to avoid all the known facts.

  not being very good at understaning the issue at all, i wonder what those here more scholarly than i might make of his full reply.

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  wobble

  Russell's arrogant attitude, I am right regardless of evidence to the contrary, has always been a primary part of WT charcteristics.

  They are the same today, with the slight difference that Russell may have sincerely believed his own B.S
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  23

  Have you noticed that the Watchtower is not emphasizing how close the end is as much?

  by stuckinamovement in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  maybe i am off base, but it seems that the last year or so hasn't had the standard retoric about how "imminent, close, or soon" the end will be.

  it seems as if the focus is now on obeying the governing body.

  have you noticed this?.

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  wobble

  Doing a Chicken little "the sky is falling !" has served them well for 130 years as a motivator and fear technique.

  It seems to come in waves, so just wait a while, 2034 is when they will have the ultimate problem, unless they have demoted 1914 long before then, but the difficulty is going to be attracting new recruits without a fear factor, why should any sane person choose them if the End is not close ?

  They will have to roll it back out again soon, pathetic prats.
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  4

  Why Sectarian Religion Is Entirely Wrong

  by metatron in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  muslims.

  catholics.

  jw's.

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  wobble

  Dear Met, a little bit of dyslexia slipped in on me then as I read your post above, I thought you said you pissed by the television !

  I agree with what you say, wouldn't the world be, not perfect, but a much better place without any organized religion ?
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  32

  Jehovah's Witnesses Are A Silly Religion!

  by minimus in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  the more "spiritual food" i see from the magazines and the more i read on this site that circuit overeers say, the more ridiculous this religion gets.. when i review all the early history of this group, how could it be any other way??

  ?.

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  wobble

  It is a silly religion, and I like to use the word "silly" about it as much as possible, the word has much power, people don't like to be thought of as silly.
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  50

  "All religious belief distills down to faith in utterly unprovable stories."

  by Franklin Massey in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i read this today on the board and want to ask, is the statement true?.

  all religious belief distills down to faith in utterly unprovable stories.

  i feel this way sometimes.

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  wobble

  The title of the thread I agree with. But many an unprovable story has "Truths" in it.

  Of course if you are going to be a Bible literalist you are on ahiding to nothing. It is interesting that interpreting the Bible that way, as all literal truth, did not really take a firmhold until the end of the nineteenth and the early twentieth centuries.

  The motive for moving away from the traditional exegesis was that religionists saw a loss of their power and influence if the new theory of evolution and other Enlightenment thinking took general hold.

  I see nothing wrong with using Parable and metaphor to teach,and I see nothing wrong with a person's holding a faith position, as long as they do no harm to themselves or others.

  What is wrong is trying to force others to believe as you do, or act as you would like because of your beliefs.

  The old saying is apropos:

  "Having a religion is like having a penis, its fine to have one, just don't wave it around in public, or try to force it down my children's throats"
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  109

  The Value of a Godless World

  by cantleave in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  thought provoking.

  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a42rhvmnuaa&feature=uploademail.

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  wobble

  If thinking right and living right means I have got P. Sacs god in my life, even though I see no evidence for him/her, then O.K

  I drop the ball when I go against my own moral compass.

  I see more value in a world without "Religion", I know P. Sac and others will say "Communism tried that and failed" but that is a rather simplistic view of why Communism failed, and anyway religion was still there, and still is in other regimes that don't particularly like it , China and North Korea for example.

  Religions are a way to control and enslave peoples minds and hearts, I heard a Muslim lady say on the BBC World Service the other day that she had so many children, more than twenty I think, because God would have cursed her if she did not.

  Suicide bombers, hate-filled Westborough Baptists, Northern Irish murderers are all fuelled by religion.

  Up until the end of the ninteenth century people firmly believed in fairys, hence Arthur Conan Doyle being taken in by the fake photo's, if someone mislaid a shoelace, the fairys had taken it, people believed in these mythical creatures with a strength that probably exceeded their belief in God.

  Education has moved us on, we no longer believe in fairys, we need to educate the whole world so that no one believes in the anthropomorphic Gods of religion.

  Then we will have a World that is a much much better place.

  Not all problems will be solved, but educate and liberate the minds of the majority of people, and a lot of the suffering we see will be gone.