Thankyou Newlight99, that is a great suggestion. Not sure if the JW will reply back or not, but perhaps if I include a couple of questions, it might lead him to think about how he could defend the organisation.
Posts by HB
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19Letter from local Kingdom Hall
by jhine intoday l received a hand written letter from my local kingdom hall .
l say my local as the one nearest me , for those who don't know me l am not nor have ever been a jw .
as this letter was addressed " to the householder " l assume that everyone in the area ( tamworth , staffordshire ) has been sent one .
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19
Letter from local Kingdom Hall
by jhine intoday l received a hand written letter from my local kingdom hall .
l say my local as the one nearest me , for those who don't know me l am not nor have ever been a jw .
as this letter was addressed " to the householder " l assume that everyone in the area ( tamworth , staffordshire ) has been sent one .
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HB
I have also received a hand-written letter from a JW.
Like Jhine, I am in the UK, have never been a JW or studied, never been in a Kingdom Hall and have no family involved.
The letter came by 2nd class post and the handwriting was very slap-dash, the way it would be if someone was mind-numbingly copying out the same boring sentences over and over again. Its on lined paper with a butterfly design and a QR scan code to link to JW.org,
The writer gives his name, personal email and mobile phone number, but gives the postal address of the nearest KH a few miles away in the next town. He says he would love to hear from me, so I will reply, taking advice from what has been said in this thread and from an ex JW friend. I will be polite and respectful but I think the writer might regret asking for my thoughts!
See below for a verbatim copy of the letter (with personal details redacted) and a copy of the words from the tract that was enclosed, in case anyone has any additional suggestions based on that.
About a week before lockdown, two JWs called at my door and although I was out at the time, my son (who knows I enjoy a good debate) told them his mum would like to chat to them and they happily agreed to come back soon.
They left an Awake magazine, (no 1. 2019) with a cover picture of people wearing face masks and the slogan “Will we ever feel safe and secure?” Unfortunately due to the lockdown, that visit never happened. But fortunately I still have the magazine and so I can also bring up topics from it. It is, as usual, full of logical fallacies, assumptions, unevidenced claims and pure baloney.
Here is the letter I received:
Dear Friends,
We are sorry that we have not been able to call of late but obviously, because of the pandemic, it was not safe to do so.
We sincerely hope that you are keeping safe and well and are not suffering too much due to the lockdown?
We did call some time ago and left you a tract to read and were hoping to get your thoughts on it? If you would like to contact us, please feel free to write to the above address. Alternatively, you could email me on ([email protected]) or if you prefer, call or text (xxx). We would love to hear from you!
One thing that we have found that this Global Pandemic has given us, is the time to reflect on the deeper meaning of life. And to re-evaluate just what is important to us. We have realized just how important our relationships with friends and family are.
We have also realized that Covid 19 is affecting us in ways that we perhaps hadn’t expected.!! Our sleeping and eating patterns have changed, we tend to stress a little more and can quickly get irritated.! If you are feeling the same way, it may be that you are experiencing what has been described as “Pandemic Fatigue”.
There is a lovely article on www.jw.org that deals with it and we invite you to take a look. It is free of charge!
I will enclose another tract for you and please stay safe!
Yours sincerely
(Signature) xxx
This is the text of the bi-fold tract that was enclosed:
WHAT IS THE KEY TO HAPPY FAMILY LIFE?
Do you think it is…
· Love?
· Money?
· Something else?
WHAT THE BIBLE SAYS
“Happy are those hearing the word of God and keeping it!” – Luke 11.28
New World Translation
WHAT THAT CAN MEAN FOR YOU
· Finding real love. Ephesians 5:28, 29
· Enjoying genuine respect. Ephesians 5:33
· Having true security. – Mark 10:6-9
CAN WE REALLY BELIEVE WHAT THE BIBLE SAYS?
Yes, for at least two reasons:
· God is the originator of family life. The bible says that “every family…owes it's name” to Jehovah God. (Ephesians 3:14, 15) In other words, the family unit exists because Jehovah created it. Why is that significant?
Consider: If you were enjoying a tasty meal and wanted to learn it's ingredients, whom would you ask? Logically the person who prepared it.
Likewise, to discover the ingredients for a happy family life, we do well to look to Jehovah, the Originator of the family arrangement. – Genesis 2:18-24
· God cares about you. Families are wise to seek Jehovah’s advice, which he provides through his Word. Why? “Because he cares for you” (1Peter 5:6,7) Jehovah has your best interests at heart - and his counsel always works! – Proverbs 3 5, 6) Isiah 48: 17,18)
TO THINK ABOUT
HOW CAN YOU BE A GOOD HUSBAND, WIFE OR PARENT?
The bible answers that question at EPHESIANS 5:1, 2 and COLOSSIANS 3: 18 – 21
TO LEARN MORE WITHOUT COST
Read lesson 9 of this brochure (Picture of booklet “Good News from God!”)
......................................................................................................
I love the way they imply it's a virtue that they are not charging for their brainwashing!
Fortunately, I am coping fine with the lockdown and have a very happy family life so would not have been persuaded by the emotional manipulation of the letter or tract even if I knew nothing about the JWs.
If anyone has any suggestions of what to write based on the above, I'd be interested to hear your thoughts.
Heather
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9
Could this be a subtle start???
by ZindagiNaMilegiDobaara injehovah's witnesses close their places of worship in the henares corridor for fear of the coronavirus.
https://okdiario.com/salud/testigos-jehova-cierran-sus-locales-culto-corredor-del-henares-temor-coronavirus-5257280.
in a nutshell: "coronavirus outbreak.
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HB
Are they still encouraged to go D2d in those areas also ? or are they postponing field service as well ?
It does no good to close a building if they are going to be spreading coronavirus door to door (along with a worthless message).
I live in the UK a couple of miles from Haslemere, Surrey, where the first person who had not travelled to an infected country was diagnosed with the virus. The Haslemere JW congregation is continuing to go out in service.
Yesterday morning two JWs knocked at my door and spoke to my son, who told them his mum would be interested to talk to them but wasn't currently available, so they said they would come back another time.
They left a 2019 Awake magazine (16 pages) which has a picture on the front with a couple wearing face masks.
I am looking forward to the return visit to have a chat about some of the issues in the magazine, and providing that they are not demonstrably coughing or looking ill, I will not be worried about inviting the JWs in. Most local people are taking sensible precautions like washing hands etc, but we are getting on with our lives.
Two of the four "Have you wondered?" questions on the back page of the Awake are as follows:
"If God cares about us, why has he allowed evil and suffering to go on for so long?"
"How can we be sure that we are living in the last days of the present world?"
These might be a good starting point for a discussion.
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26
Wausau Wisconsin Bans Throwing Of Any SNOWBALL!
by minimus inyou can’t throw a snowball at a person as kids often do.
you can’t throw it in a park, at a building, anywhere.
comments please.
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HB
I understand the points made by those advocating the banning of snowball fights on the grounds of potential risk to health and safety, but if society takes that route, by the same token, we should ban many other activities.....
Swimming in the sea is highly dangerous, you might get stung by a jelly fish or caught in a rip tide, playing rugby or cricket is dangerous, you might get tackled and injured or hit by a ball, climbing mountains is risky, you might fall and break a leg and need to be airlifted to safety, going for a walk in the countryside you risk tripping on a tree root or being stung by a wasp. We’d have to ban all sports, and even ban embroidery in case people pricked their finger on a needle.
Before that, we would need to ban driving cars and motorbikes which are far more dangerous than most sports and pastimes, Whatever you do, don’t get into a relationship with anyone, far too risky for your emotional well being,
If we took this attitude to its logical conclusion, and banned every fun activity that poses a risk, we would all end up staying indoors wrapped in cotton wool and just watching animated adventure films for entertainment, (thereby risking our health because of lack of exercise).
Of course, there are certain activities that pose too high a risk which should be banned, and others which need to be regulated or for which formal training and qualifications and safety equipment should be required, but if we eliminate all risks, life would not be worth living.
We teach children the rules to follow when playing in the sea or riding a bike or playing football; the same should apply to snowball fights. Teach children how to check the consistency of the snow, not to play where the ground is stony, or near buildings and vehicles, and not to throw at someone unless they are a willing participant in a game. Wear sensible clothes and a hat, don't aim for the head and have a reasonable distance between teams.
In other words, have fun but minimise the risks.
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IICSA.... Haven't we heard all this before?
by UnshackleTheChains inhaven't we heard all this before?.
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HB
JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES are mentioned first in the list of non-conformist religions to be investigated.
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Inquiry announces new investigation into child protection in religious organisations and settings
2 May 2019The Independent Inquiry into Child Sexual Abuse has announced a new investigation into child protection in religious organisations and settings.
The investigation will be thematic and will review the current child protection policies, practices and procedures in religious institutions in England and Wales.
Organisations falling under the remit of this investigation will include non conformist Christian denominations, the Jehovah’s Witnesses, Baptists, Methodists, Islam, Judaism, Sikhism, Hinduism and Buddhism. This investigation is separate from our investigations into the Anglican and Roman Catholic churches.
Religious settings such as mosques, synagogues, churches and temples are in scope. Places of faith tuition such as Muslim madrassahs and Christian Sunday schools and places where children and young people gather in connection with their religious beliefs, including youth groups and camps will also be investigated by the Inquiry.
More than one in 10 survivors of child sexual abuse (11 per cent) who shared their accounts with the Inquiry’s Truth Project reported sexual abuse in a religious institution. Of this group, almost a quarter (24 percent) told the Inquiry they were abused in institutions in scope of this new investigation, including Jehovah's Witnesses, Baptists, Methodists, Judaism and Islam. Not all participants provided details about the religious denomination of the institution or perpetrator.
Organisations and individuals are being invited to apply for core participant status. Core participants must have a significant interest in this investigation and have special rights defined by legislation.
A preliminary hearing will take place at 2pm on 23 July 2019 and public hearings will take place in 2020.
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10
JW trolleys - London
by HB inthought you might like to know that during a visit to london yesterday, the jw's were conspicuous by their complete absence.
admittedly it was a tuesday in february, but myself and my ex jw friend thought we would see at least one or two trolleys in their usual haunts, but nothing.
we checked out the area around westminster station where we have talked to jws before, but there was no sign.
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HB
The 12 apostates - I would love to know where these 'wrong places' are!
Half Banana, it's the only advantage I have, that I can honestly say when I talk to JWs that I have never had any connections to the religion, so they can't close the conversation down on the basis of me being 'a bitter and twisted apostate'.
Initially I present as someone who is fascinated to learn about all religions and they immediately pigeon hole me into the role of a standard 'interested person' that they are trained to try to entice in with platitudes and fear.
But further into the conversation, having established my lack of connection to their Organisation, they become deeply uncomfortable when they realise that an apparently 'normal' member of the public knows about some of the Watchtower's dirty laundry, eg if I mention I have heard about the UN scandal or the 'two witness rule' or paedophile court cases etc.
I try to stay off biblical discussion as it's my weak point, but I can show incredulity for example that in the 21st century, they still believe there was a global flood, and I can leave them with nowhere to go on the issue of whether the world conditions are getting worse. An elder once pathetically told me that all the information that he'd been presented with about evolution 'just went over his head.'
My favourite moment was the last time JWs called at my door. It was a mother and her 14 year old daughter. We talked for about 20 minutes, during which the daughter's eyes were big as saucers as I listed all the reasons I would not want to be a member of their religion.
When I said to the mother "You have a beautiful daughter, but one day as she develops her own mind, she might decide she disagrees with you and want to leave the JWs. I would never want to be a member of a religion which demanded that if that happened, I must shun my own daughter".
There was a very uneasy silence while the mother looked at the ground. The daughter had her mouth open and stared at me with a 'deer in the headlights' look. The mother then said it had been an interesting conversation but they must go, and they would call again, but that was two years ago and no JWs have called on me since then.
I genuinely want to talk to JWs with the aim of hoping a little seed of information might eventually take root to help them learn the real truth, as I have learned what a damaging and pernicious cult JWs are.
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10
JW trolleys - London
by HB inthought you might like to know that during a visit to london yesterday, the jw's were conspicuous by their complete absence.
admittedly it was a tuesday in february, but myself and my ex jw friend thought we would see at least one or two trolleys in their usual haunts, but nothing.
we checked out the area around westminster station where we have talked to jws before, but there was no sign.
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HB
I was quite disappointed not to see any JWs in London, as I had been looking forward to a discussion with them.
I've never been a JW, never been in a KH or had any family connections to the JW Organisation, but I have learnt a lot from my exJW friend and from this forum and I am now feeling ready to test my debating skills on the topic of whether JWs are the one true religion.
I've had three satisfying discussions with JWs at my door in the past on other issues, but I have been building my confidence level to be able to approach a trolley with this fundamental question. My friend would have been there as a back up if I got lost (I don't know the bible like JWs do), but I was feeling quite confident, so it was a shame we didn't find anyone for me to debate.
I have several friends who are Christians (C of E, Methodist, Baptist, Catholic), but I don't debate religion with them as they keep their beliefs quietly to themselves, and I respect that, but JWs are fair game to challenge as they feel entitled to try to spread their beliefs to everyone.
Hopefully there will be another time for me, although if the carts disappeared completely from the streets tomorrow, I don't think anyone would miss them.
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JW trolleys - London
by HB inthought you might like to know that during a visit to london yesterday, the jw's were conspicuous by their complete absence.
admittedly it was a tuesday in february, but myself and my ex jw friend thought we would see at least one or two trolleys in their usual haunts, but nothing.
we checked out the area around westminster station where we have talked to jws before, but there was no sign.
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HB
Thought you might like to know that during a visit to London yesterday, the JW's were conspicuous by their complete absence. Admittedly it was a Tuesday in February, but myself and my ex JW friend thought we would see at least one or two trolleys in their usual haunts, but nothing.
We checked out the area around Westminster Station where we have talked to JWs before, but there was no sign. Looked again at Oxford Circus and Regent Street which is the busiest part of London, but no one was there. No-one at Marylebone or Baker Street, no-one at Piccadilly, Leicester Square, Soho or anywhere else.
We did come across a couple of enthusiastic ladies from another religion handing out tracts and a man with a sign saying ‘Jesus Saves’ ranting about the sin of masturbation, but that was it.
In the evening, we attended an interesting lecture to celebrate Darwin Day, an annual event organised by HumanistsUK. The main speaker was Richard Dawkins, supported by Dr Alice Roberts, both evolutionary biologists.
I would love to know what the reaction would have been if the JWs had been brave enough to set up their cart outside the lecture hall as the 3,000 attendees came out after listening to the inspiring talk and Q & A session.
(Incidentally, we were interested to learn that Dawkins’ book ‘The God Delusion’ has been unofficially translated into Arabic - (it is illegally on the internet as a pdf) – and it has apparently been downloaded over 13 million times, at least 3 million of which have been from Saudi Arabia. Dawkins doesn’t get any royalties on illegal downloads but his books are currently being translated into Arabic, Urdu, Farsi and Indonesian, and these will be made available free of charge on the internet to respond to what he describes is a ‘stirring towards atheism’ in some Islamic countries.)
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22
Blonde Jokes
by Bangalore inblonde jokes.. two blondes went to the pound where each adopted a puppy.
the joy of their new best friend was quickly overshadowed when they got home and the first blonde said, "i think we're in trouble, how are we going to tell them apart?
" this lead to several hours of concentration until finally, the second blonde said, "i've got an idea.
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HB
LUHE,
As well as being blonde, I was born & grew up in Essex, so I have a double whammy of jokes aimed at me, but I love it. The jokes are not in any way malicious and it irritates me when people take it seriously & needlessly take offence. Keep the humour coming!
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Blonde Jokes
by Bangalore inblonde jokes.. two blondes went to the pound where each adopted a puppy.
the joy of their new best friend was quickly overshadowed when they got home and the first blonde said, "i think we're in trouble, how are we going to tell them apart?
" this lead to several hours of concentration until finally, the second blonde said, "i've got an idea.
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HB
I have blonde hair but I take no offence whatsoever and laughed heartily at all the jokes.