JWs use the word "apostate" so they can shut down any thought process. Much like "America hater" is tossed out at anyone who didn't agree with the Iraq war. It's a trigger word for an ad hominem. Dismiss the credibility of the person so you don't have to listen, refute, or think about that person's point or thought.
Indo_Dude
JoinedPosts by Indo_Dude
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11
Are Some Enabling JWs To Treat Us Like Crap/ Showing JWs How 2 be Apostates
by cognac inare some enabling jws to treat us like crap?.
i only present this question because i realized that i was an enabler my whole life and didn't realize it.... this is why i feel this way.... i have heard a lot of "jws treat you like this because they think its right", because "they love you" "there trying to do whats right", etc, etc... these might be very true statements.. however, no matter how much they disagree with us, it is wrong to attack us personally, attack our character even if they do it because they think its the right thing to do.. family members did this to me.
i forgive them.
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230
"Why does America always bomb other countries?", my son asked tonight.
by digderidoo infirst of all i do not want to turn this into an american bashing thread, that is not my intention at all.. i would like to hear americans opinions as to what my thirteen year old son asked me tonight.. on the way back from swimming tonight my two sons (13 and 11) and myself started talking about wars.
my 11 year old was the first to bring it up talking about wwi & ww2.
we had an interesting conversation about it, then the subject got onto nuclear bombs.
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Indo_Dude
BTW Indo are you a registered voter?
Yes. I voted for Kerry in the last election and voted for Hillary in this primary in PA a few weeks ago. Not only do I vote but I volunteered, and donated to 2 candidates so far. It wasn't much since I don't make huge money yet and have grad school to pay for. I would have voted for Gore had I been old enough at the time. The war in the middle east will end up costing us/Americans over $2 trillion. (By some estimates as high as $2.5 or $3.0 trillion) At $2 trillion that equals out to be $ 6,700 for every man woman and child in the USA, or $ 26,800 for a family of 4. All of the money squandered for what?
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"Why does America always bomb other countries?", my son asked tonight.
by digderidoo infirst of all i do not want to turn this into an american bashing thread, that is not my intention at all.. i would like to hear americans opinions as to what my thirteen year old son asked me tonight.. on the way back from swimming tonight my two sons (13 and 11) and myself started talking about wars.
my 11 year old was the first to bring it up talking about wwi & ww2.
we had an interesting conversation about it, then the subject got onto nuclear bombs.
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Indo_Dude
It's always surprising to me to see a group of individuals who escaped a high control / cult that simply replace their point of worship from one thing (JWs) to another (nationalism). They never challenge their underlying issue which is, "how is my thought process and belief system fundamentally flawed as to allow this to happen", and what should I do to fix it?
Many blindly gulped down the watery gruel that the WTBS dished up claiming it was ribeye steak, and never questioned the incongruencies. Now that they are out of the JWs, they repeat the behavior by greedily eating the gruel the United States (or any other country) propaganda machinary can churn out and tell everyone it's not gruel they are eating, but succulent oyster stew.
The "United States" is not evil, nor good. It is an inantimate object so therefore cannot be either good or evil. The actions of which it carries out however can be judged or evaluated as good / evil. Not everything the United States does is evil. Nor conversely is everything that it does good. Because what most people consider to be "good", or battling on the fields of Europe in WWII, does that obscure or give the USA a "free pass" as it were for its actions in Iraq? In Abu-Gharib prison? The Japanese Internment? The prisons of Guantanamo Bay?
Also, whenever someone brings up a point of contention, so many spin into a label/deny/dismiss behavior. Anything that is critical of their beliefs in nationalism are branded as "America haters", when in fact nothing could be further from the truth. I've spent time overseas teaching and it's not a "hate", but rather a frustration with America. That it is on such a blindedly wrongheaded course and refuses to listen to any of her allies.
I don't think most Americans have a clue either as to what the evening news looks like in many countries. Every night, and I mean every night, there are video clips showing Palestinians being maimed and killed by Isreali military personnel, as well as normal every day Iraqi citizens dead, maimed, and burned from American military "fallout". These images are what people around the globe are seeing EVERY NIGHT. These actions will color a generation of children and young adults I assure you. For every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction. America has set up a number of issues to deal with as a result of its action in the future. The United States and the CIA helped put Saddam into power in the first place. The went on to arm him, supply intelligence and military training to him and his forces, and supported him for many years. As long as Saddam kept the balance of power in the middle east and the free flow of oil, the US turned a blind eye to his thuggish behavior. Just like America turns a blind eye to the Saudis (you know the 19 people who flew planes into the towers...those 19 Saudis) and their own funding of radical Islam sects to stay in power.
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What is China up to?
by Gill inhttp://aolsearch.aol.co.uk/aol/redir?src=eu_websearch&requestid=null&clickeditemrank=1&userquery=china+stockpiling+weapons+arming&clickeditemurn=http%3a%2f%2fnearabroad.wordpress.com%2f2006%2f12%2f07%2farming-the-developing-world-and-stockpiling-cash%2f&title=%3cb%3earming%3c%2fb%3e+the+developing+world%2c+and+%3cb%3estockpiling%3c%2fb%3e+cash+%c2%ab+nearabroad&moduleid=matchingsites_uk.jsp.m&clickeditempageranking=1&clickeditempage=1&clickeditemdescription=webresults.
why is china stockpiling weapons and spending billions upon billions on its own arms race?.
(hope this link works, if not just google 'china stock piling weapons military spending'.
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Indo_Dude
So what if China is spending money on updating its army? From www.globalissues.org
- US military spending is 5.8 times more than China, 10.2 times more than Russia, and 98.6 times more than Iran.
- US military spending is almost 55 times the spending on the six “rogue” states (Cuba, Iran, Libya, North Korea, Sudan and Syria) whose spending amounts to around $13 billion, maximum. (Tabulated data does not include four of the six, as the data only lists nations that have spent over 1 billion in the year, so their budget is assumed to be $1 billion each)
- US spending is more than the combined spending of the next 45 countries.
- The United States and its strongest allies (the NATO countries, Japan, South Korea and Australia) spend $1.1 trillion on their militaries combined, representing 72 percent of the world’s total.
- The six potential “enemies,” Russia, and China together account for about $205 billion or 29% of the US military budget.
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230
"Why does America always bomb other countries?", my son asked tonight.
by digderidoo infirst of all i do not want to turn this into an american bashing thread, that is not my intention at all.. i would like to hear americans opinions as to what my thirteen year old son asked me tonight.. on the way back from swimming tonight my two sons (13 and 11) and myself started talking about wars.
my 11 year old was the first to bring it up talking about wwi & ww2.
we had an interesting conversation about it, then the subject got onto nuclear bombs.
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Indo_Dude
Alpaca wrote:
The points you raise are valid and on the minds of many (not enough) thinking Americans. America's day in the sun has long passed.
The United States had a great opportunity, in the years after WWII, to be the great moral leader for the world. Instead, our government supported despotic, totalitarian leaders as long as they supported American interests.
I love this country, and I believe the founding fathers were some of the most visionary people in history, but that doesn't change the fact that America lost its moral compass long ago, and this country is in decline morally, technologically, industrially, and in any other way you can suggest.
I've been in school for the last 9 years and there is a list of books as long as my arm that I want to read. One of them is "Sorrows of Empire," by Chalmers Johnson, that addresses these very issues. I have listened to him talk and read excerpts from the book -- check it out -- I think you'll find it riveting.
Cheers,
Alex
Wow! I couldn't have said it better myself. A very thoughtful, and accurate response.
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"Why does America always bomb other countries?", my son asked tonight.
by digderidoo infirst of all i do not want to turn this into an american bashing thread, that is not my intention at all.. i would like to hear americans opinions as to what my thirteen year old son asked me tonight.. on the way back from swimming tonight my two sons (13 and 11) and myself started talking about wars.
my 11 year old was the first to bring it up talking about wwi & ww2.
we had an interesting conversation about it, then the subject got onto nuclear bombs.
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Indo_Dude
Digder wrote: "I am an asshole because?"
Apparently you've pointed out a sensitve spot with a few contemporary Americans. It bugs many to do some self-reflection.
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"Why does America always bomb other countries?", my son asked tonight.
by digderidoo infirst of all i do not want to turn this into an american bashing thread, that is not my intention at all.. i would like to hear americans opinions as to what my thirteen year old son asked me tonight.. on the way back from swimming tonight my two sons (13 and 11) and myself started talking about wars.
my 11 year old was the first to bring it up talking about wwi & ww2.
we had an interesting conversation about it, then the subject got onto nuclear bombs.
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Indo_Dude
Americans don't like facing the fact that regardless of what it is called, their government is imperilistic. It protects its own interests. As any country does. What creates the problem is that when America stands tall and proud and lectures the world on freedom and democracy, while actively supporting, funding, and engaging other governments to step on their own populace's throats to thrwart freedom. America (the corporation) is only interested in "freedom and democracy" so long as it doesn't interfere with the free flow of moneys, profits, and commodities (oil).
To convince Joe American that he is a "god fearin Christian" they wave the flag, and convince them that by putting an American flag bumper-sticker on their Ford F150 that gets 14 mpg that says "Support Our Troops", they are actually doing something. America Inc, Exxon Corp, Blackwater Inc, and the Saudi Royal family make billions on Joe (Ignorant) American feeling "proud" over his country.
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230
"Why does America always bomb other countries?", my son asked tonight.
by digderidoo infirst of all i do not want to turn this into an american bashing thread, that is not my intention at all.. i would like to hear americans opinions as to what my thirteen year old son asked me tonight.. on the way back from swimming tonight my two sons (13 and 11) and myself started talking about wars.
my 11 year old was the first to bring it up talking about wwi & ww2.
we had an interesting conversation about it, then the subject got onto nuclear bombs.
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Indo_Dude
Typical "Free". And what exactly did YOU do to facilitate that in 1942? Which unit did you fight in back in WWII?
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"Why does America always bomb other countries?", my son asked tonight.
by digderidoo infirst of all i do not want to turn this into an american bashing thread, that is not my intention at all.. i would like to hear americans opinions as to what my thirteen year old son asked me tonight.. on the way back from swimming tonight my two sons (13 and 11) and myself started talking about wars.
my 11 year old was the first to bring it up talking about wwi & ww2.
we had an interesting conversation about it, then the subject got onto nuclear bombs.
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Indo_Dude
I have lived abroad for a few years. To be sure, I've been ashamed of my country since the Idiot Chimp Bush has been running the monkey show.
I used to be proud to be an American. Now I'm ashamed. After I moved back to America from my teaching assignment in Indonesia this country felt old, rundown, and decrepit. The bridge collapse in St. Paul, MN last year, plus the hundreds of other stories about bad roads, bad schools, bad bridges, lack of high speed rail, and the joke that Americans call their airport facilities these days? Unforgivable. It's like watching the Roman empire unraveling. It's plain sad, and pathetic.
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WHAT MADE YOU LEAVE? Doctrine or people?
by chuckyy inhi.. just wondering what made you take the final leap out of the org?
was it doctrinal in that certain things just didnt add up or was it because of the actions of people in the org.
that made you leave?
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Indo_Dude
I left because of my sexuality. I knew I could either live a miserable, celebate life being a JW or say "screw it" and go live a life of sin. I chose the latter. Only then did I realize what a bunch of b.s. the Witlesses were.
