Posts by Piercingtheveil81

14

1John 5:20

by PSacramento in

this was brought up in the phillipians thread by johnathan dough (sp?

), he mentions how in 1john 5:20 jesus is caled god.. .

now, in the niv it goes like this:.

Piercingtheveil81

I would just like to share a thought from the Noble Quran regarding this topic out of sincerity.

Quran 5:72-77

72 "Pagans indeed are those who say that GOD is the Messiah, son of Mary. The Messiah himself said, "O Children of Israel, you shall worship GOD; my Lord and your Lord." Anyone who sets up any idol beside GOD, GOD has forbidden Paradise for him, and his destiny is Hell. The wicked have no helpers.

73 Pagans indeed are those who say that GOD is a third of a trinity. There is no god except the one god. Unless they refrain from saying this, those who disbelieve among them will incur a painful retribution.

74 Would they not repent to GOD, and ask His forgiveness? GOD is Forgiver, Most Merciful.

75 The Messiah, son of Mary, is no more than a messenger like the messengers before him, and his mother was a saint. Both of them used to eat the food. Note how we explain the revelations for them, and note how they still deviate!

76 Say, "Would you worship beside GOD powerless idols who can neither harm you, nor benefit you? GOD is Hearer, Omniscient."

77 Say, "O people of the scripture, do not transgress the limits of your religion beyond the truth, and do not follow the opinions of people who have gone astray, and have misled multitudes of people; they are far astray from the right path."

What are your thoughts?

16

Hades and Tartarus in the NT. Pagan influences?

by Piercingtheveil81 in

last night i was watching a program about greek mythology when the subject of hades and tartarus came up, hades referring to the greek god of death and tartarus referring to the place of the dead or what could be called hell.

i began to wonder why would the bible writers use such words if they were trying to avoid paganism and convey different ideas.

if hell were not a real place as witnesses say why would peter use tartarus, a word clearly known to be a place and not a condition of the dead.

Piercingtheveil81

True. After leaving the WTS I began investigating things a little further and eventually converted to Islam.

I read a number of books, both christian and islamic, and listened to hours of lectures and debates and that was the conclusion I reached.

14

1John 5:20

by PSacramento in

this was brought up in the phillipians thread by johnathan dough (sp?

), he mentions how in 1john 5:20 jesus is caled god.. .

now, in the niv it goes like this:.

Piercingtheveil81

I think what cameo-d is saying is that it was others who were promoting this idea, hence the reason for it found in the gospel writings. I personally believe this to be the case. Since there can not be any other god who for example participates in creation, forgives sins and grants salvation, and recieves glory, since this is in direct conflict with the OT regarding there being only one God who does not share such things with His creation.

16

Hades and Tartarus in the NT. Pagan influences?

by Piercingtheveil81 in

last night i was watching a program about greek mythology when the subject of hades and tartarus came up, hades referring to the greek god of death and tartarus referring to the place of the dead or what could be called hell.

i began to wonder why would the bible writers use such words if they were trying to avoid paganism and convey different ideas.

if hell were not a real place as witnesses say why would peter use tartarus, a word clearly known to be a place and not a condition of the dead.

Piercingtheveil81

They had grave errors in that while they professed belief in the faith of Abraham many doctrines contradict it. Belief in the trinity, that God has a son, that there were was a helper in creation thereby associating partners with God, and Original sin etc.

16

Hades and Tartarus in the NT. Pagan influences?

by Piercingtheveil81 in

last night i was watching a program about greek mythology when the subject of hades and tartarus came up, hades referring to the greek god of death and tartarus referring to the place of the dead or what could be called hell.

i began to wonder why would the bible writers use such words if they were trying to avoid paganism and convey different ideas.

if hell were not a real place as witnesses say why would peter use tartarus, a word clearly known to be a place and not a condition of the dead.

Piercingtheveil81

I believe they are a group of writings presenting the beliefs of individuals who essentially started a new religion spearheaded by Paul. However it appears that there were conflicts between early believers regarding Jesus and his role. Especially between Paul and James, hence the reason for division in christian sects today. Christianity as a result does not resemble the simple faith of Abraham (Peace and blessings be upon him).

Nowadays they are discovering many things that show that first century believers varied in their beliefs; Christianity was not one monolithic faith as many believe. In fact different regions had different writings they considered to be inspired. The NT as it exists today was organized by bishops in the 4th century who had grave errors in their theology and selected the writings that best suited them. As a result many were beaten or killed for possessing any other writing.

Of that is just a brief statement of how I feel about the NT. All of this cast a great deal of doubt as to the validity of christianity as a belief system.

16

Hades and Tartarus in the NT. Pagan influences?

by Piercingtheveil81 in

last night i was watching a program about greek mythology when the subject of hades and tartarus came up, hades referring to the greek god of death and tartarus referring to the place of the dead or what could be called hell.

i began to wonder why would the bible writers use such words if they were trying to avoid paganism and convey different ideas.

if hell were not a real place as witnesses say why would peter use tartarus, a word clearly known to be a place and not a condition of the dead.

Piercingtheveil81

PSacramento don't get upset.

I'm not saying that I agree or disagree since I don't believe the NT to be in anyway inspired of God. I just thought it was an interesting point.

16

Hades and Tartarus in the NT. Pagan influences?

by Piercingtheveil81 in

last night i was watching a program about greek mythology when the subject of hades and tartarus came up, hades referring to the greek god of death and tartarus referring to the place of the dead or what could be called hell.

i began to wonder why would the bible writers use such words if they were trying to avoid paganism and convey different ideas.

if hell were not a real place as witnesses say why would peter use tartarus, a word clearly known to be a place and not a condition of the dead.

Piercingtheveil81

Exactly my point. If they understood tartarus to be a place of darkness and torment in the afterlife this was the idea that peter was conveying which contradicts the witness idea. Hades is not the greek word for death, rather it is thanatos.

My point is that if they were not trying to convey the idea the greeks had about death and the afterlife different words should have been used.

16

Hades and Tartarus in the NT. Pagan influences?

by Piercingtheveil81 in

last night i was watching a program about greek mythology when the subject of hades and tartarus came up, hades referring to the greek god of death and tartarus referring to the place of the dead or what could be called hell.

i began to wonder why would the bible writers use such words if they were trying to avoid paganism and convey different ideas.

if hell were not a real place as witnesses say why would peter use tartarus, a word clearly known to be a place and not a condition of the dead.

Piercingtheveil81

Last night I was watching a program about greek mythology when the subject of Hades and Tartarus came up, Hades referring to the Greek god of death and Tartarus referring to the place of the dead or what could be called hell.

I began to wonder why would the bible writers use such words if they were trying to avoid paganism and convey different ideas. If hell were not a real place as witnesses say why would peter use tartarus, a word clearly known to be a place and not a condition of the dead. It seems that it would have been misleading.

Anyway what are your thoughts? I wonder what witnesses would say about it.

Piercingtheveil81

54

Romans 10:13 - got owned in a jw study. need help with greek.

by bohm in

for reasons i have posted on another topic i have become involved with a study with a rather knowledgeable jw.

i try to stay clear of the scripture (im an atheist who have never read the bible so i have desided to agree with his interpretation of the scripture for the sake of argument, however to say that when it come to interpretations of the bible, there are also many other ways to think about it, and it require significant research for me to commit to one particular view).

we talked about how you know jehovahs witness have the truth and ofcourse the conversation went into the usual topics like using the name jehovah (however, it did end where i felt it should, on jesus selection in 1918, more on that on another thread).

Piercingtheveil81

While I do not believe the bible to be 100% the word of God I really do feel that Rom 10:13 is a reference to Jesus. Although it is originally found in Joel in reference to Jehovah, under the context paul is clearly speaking about Jesus before and after. Their are many instances were Paul uses old testament texts that originally have an application to Jehovah but are used in reference to Christ.

While it is difficult to convince christians otherwise, I believe to bible to present conflicting and contradictory ideas and theology, thus the reason for so many sects and denominations among christians. Thats why God sent His last messenger (peace be upon him) to correct the misconceptions and errors.

Piercingtheveil81

51

Is this Kingdom Hall Creepy?

by kurtbethel in

this is a hall in oceanside, california.

it is hidden away from the street on a nondescript lane.. .

no windows!.

Piercingtheveil81

I gave a talk at a hall that looked similar to this one in carlsbad not far from oceanside.

Hey kurtbethel are you from san diego county?