donuthole

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Posts by donuthole

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  126

  BREAKING NEWS on www.jw-media.org

  by Wrong Way in

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  breaking news!.

  wow!.

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  donuthole

  The Watchtower literature was in violation of Russian law. The law seeks to protect the religious rights of all of their citizens. Whether or not the law is good or bad is a matter of debate.

  In the beginning of this matter the Watchtower could have made concessions to maintain freedoms such as ceasing to distribute literature in Russia or simply censoring some of the "extremist" statements the Government had issues with. (In Russia you simply cannot go door to door passing out tracts condemning all religions and showing meteors crashing into churches.) The Witnesses could have continued to meet and worship privately without sanction.

  The hyprocrisy is that they will fight for their right to print what they want in a word court and turn around and persecute their own members who wish to exercise the very same religious freedom.

  I think this case well highlights how integral the literature is in the life of Jehovah's Witnesses. (I would suggest for control and financing.) I know of one student in Australia who is currently working on her master's thesis on this various issue. I'm very eager to read it when she publishes it.
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  98

  SBCheezits Judicial Hearing - My EPIC FAIL (REPOST for IE users)

  by SweetBabyCheezits in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  (note: i apologize to the internet explorer users.

  you probably can't see my first epic fail thread because i used firefox to post.

  there's still some kind of glitch between a plugin i'm running, firefox posts, and ie.).

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  donuthole

  SBC,

  Before you get legally entangled I would double-check what the wire-tapping laws are like in your jurisdiction. In Illinois, where I live, it would be legally questionable for you to secretly record the meeting like you did unless all parties were informed of the recording, across the river in Missouri it is perfectly legal, as I understand. So the laws vary.

  -Anthony
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  98

  SBCheezits Judicial Hearing - My EPIC FAIL (REPOST for IE users)

  by SweetBabyCheezits in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  (note: i apologize to the internet explorer users.

  you probably can't see my first epic fail thread because i used firefox to post.

  there's still some kind of glitch between a plugin i'm running, firefox posts, and ie.).

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  donuthole

  SBC --

  I know JC meetings can be stressful, no matter how good they turn out. I wouldn't beat yourself up to much. I hope it goes well for you.

  BTW It sounds like you got the same list of questions I got. I find it hard to beleive there isn't a Society sanctioned anti-apostasy list floating around.

  -Anthony
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  126

  BREAKING NEWS on www.jw-media.org

  by Wrong Way in

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  breaking news!.

  wow!.

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  donuthole

  @jam

  Probably the worst example of religiously sanctioned evil that I've come across is a cult that now goes by the name. They once taught child sex abuse as an acceptable, even ideal, child rearing practice. Prior to the rise of the AIDS virus, this cult also had a worldwide ministry which persuaded female members to act as prostitutes to spread the love of Jesus and become "fishers of men" (i.e. recruit more into the cult)

  It was shocking to find out that even when the national Governments were made aware of these abhorrent practices it was enough for the group to claim that they did not practice them anymore. This group continues to freely operate all over the world. If you go to their website it really comes across just as innocent as the Watchtower's. It is all bright smiling faces and family values.

  It is crazy that even in the face of such extreme examples of religious abuse the Governments are slow to step in and take action.
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  102

  HELP REQUEST - Judicial Committee Hearing tonight!

  by SweetBabyCheezits in

  1. jw
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  i hate to ask you good folks to jump around but the first post in the thread below explains why i'm going into the jc meeting, hence the basis for my questions below.... http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/jw/friends/198636/1/reply-to-judicial-committee-question-thenoblelodge.

  i have no idea how to present my witnesses.

  they've already agreed to show up.

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  donuthole

  Can you refresh my memory about what you said?

  To my original JC committee, I said something to the affect that I would ask God not to charge this sin against them. I said it and I meant it. I forgave everyone in that meeting that night and I have tried to live up to that. (Meaning not to allow any bitterness or anger toward them to take root in my heart.) I know that God will not hold what they did to me against them. I do believe what has happened recently has occurred by Divine hand but as he reminded me the other day, "this isn't for your sake". Any other sins they have committed against others, well they'll have to answer for those on their own if they do not repent. I really would LOVE it if my path ever crosses with the former PO. Now that we are kind of on the same level as far as the Org goes I would really love a chance to talk person to person again, at least once.

  To my appeal committee I think I just thanked them for their time and travel. Eh, didn't really know them and saw that they were just there going through the Theocratic motions. One of my vivid memories from that meetings is when the young MTS grad was digging through his Bible trying to hard find the term "governing body". The whole scene was so depressingly sad that I figured we were at an impasse and so let's just cut this off so we can all go home.

  All and all -- wasn't a bad experience. That was when I first started hearing from my Heavenly Father. All I really wanted at the time was to be able to partake with the congregation one time without being disfellowshipped. In his grace he assured me that he would allow for that. What can I say? Good memory.

  ---

  Sorry to sidetrack your topic Cheezit.
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  126

  BREAKING NEWS on www.jw-media.org

  by Wrong Way in

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  breaking news!.

  wow!.

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  donuthole

  I don't want to be a brokend record but I think the WT has done a pretty good spin job on what the issue is really about. The question is, does the Watchtower, or any religion, have the right to publicly publish and peddle literature that denigrates or infringes on the free exercise of religion by the citizens of Russia. This has absolutely nothing to do with the personal religious practice and beliefs which are protected.

  Now here in the USA we have a strong tradition of freedom of press which allows for even the most hateful propoganda to be produced and distributed. Some of the European countries are moving toward laws which ban "hate speech" as a way to better safeguard civil liberties. The Watchtower literature has been characterized as "extremist" and in violation of Russian law because it routinely attacks other faiths; hence the ban.
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  126

  BREAKING NEWS on www.jw-media.org

  by Wrong Way in

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  2. friends

  breaking news!.

  wow!.

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  donuthole

  Ah, I see, so the real issue is that the JW are NOT following a simple rule that allows ALL religions to co-exist in Russia? correct?

  And it is a rule that has NOTHING to do with their religious freedom at all, but would simply keep them from misleading people in regards to other religions?

  Yes?

  My understanding is that it has to do with certain claims in the literature that the Watchtower makes as being the "one true religion" and atagonistic statements they make toward other faiths.

  I think the Russian constitution protects ones ability to practice their own religion but you cannot use that as a launching pad against other faiths in the manner that the Watchtower sometimes does. Basically, you can practice your own religion but you can't go around telling others their religion is wrong.

  Beyond that, I believe there are concerns that certain things in the literature promote friction between families and such when there is a difference in religious practice. (For instance shunning family members that leave the Truth™ or limiting association with non-Witness relatives.) I think that recent Awake! that hyprocritically affirmed a person's right to choose their own religion even if it isn't held by their family was in direct response to the Russia situation.

  The easy answer is quit producing/distributing literature in Russia but that is like telling Coca-Cola they can't sell carbonated sugar water.
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  126

  BREAKING NEWS on www.jw-media.org

  by Wrong Way in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  breaking news!.

  wow!.

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  donuthole

  I don't advocate tolerance of hate groups. And I don't advocate tolerance of destructive mind control groups either.

  And that is exactly the premise of the Russian government. The issue isn't one's right to freely practice their religion. The Russian constitution guarantees that but it is with the caveat that in your practice of religion you cannot interfere with the rights others to freely practice their own religion.
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  13

  Now more than ever, you need this.....Try it out!

  by koolaid-man in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tjriyxvbxsi.

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  donuthole

  scary
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  126

  BREAKING NEWS on www.jw-media.org

  by Wrong Way in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  breaking news!.

  wow!.

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  donuthole

  The WT could easily bring their religion into compliance with Russian law by ceasing to produce and distribute their religious literature that is viewed as "extremist" and hostile to the free practice of religion for their countrymen.

  As in the case of Bulgaria there is potential that political muscle could lead to a change in practice. It is wishful thinking but I would like to see this pave the way for the WT to allow DA'ing without impunity.