Dear Mouthy, you made a mistake in typing the link. There is a period after "org", and that gives you a "Not found" page. I deleted the point and still got "not found", so I saw their homepage instead. Many articles.
Posts by dgp
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7Have you seen this one?
by mouthy incant make it pressable sorry, but your all so smart.. http://www.evidenceministries.org./aboutus.html .
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Regulate Marijuana Like Wine (interesting article)
by sabastious inhttp://regulatemarijuanalikewine.com/legal-and-political-analysis-of-regulate-marijuana-like-wine/.
i am ecstatic to hear that people are attempting something like this.
i have always thought that using marijuana could be likened to using wine as a medicine.
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dgp
I feel we are never going to agree on this subject because, indeed, there is a border between us, and I'm not only talking about the imaginary (and sometimes not so imaginary) line between "North of the Border" and "South of the Border".
I think it's also a matter of point of view. In my books, if I sell you something that will cause you harm, I'm guilty. It doesn't matter if the buyer claims to have a right to use that substance. I know, I will hear people say that marijuana is not damaging, et cetera. I think that would make for a fine argument in favor of the tobacco industry.
Have no problem with medical uses of marijuana. I used to be a fan of footballer Edgard Davids, well known for his superb skills, his special lenses, his glaucoma, and the fact that the world of football knew marijuana would appear on his bloodstream because he needed it for glaucoma.
I do have a problem with crime.
I think it was The True One who made this comment (I apologize in advance if it wasn't him):
If an individual had no prior criminal record, he could become a candidate for licensing .
At my age, this one I can't take seriously. Question: If I used to sell marijuana when it was illegal, and it is made legal, do I still have a criminal record? I honestly do not know, but I would like people to discuss the implications.
If I used to sell pills and cocaine and marijuana, and I happen to know that, no, I won't have a criminal record if I confess to selling marijuana, would I tell the Police about my other activities? Can you picture someone saying something like "Yep, I was involved, but only in the provision of marijuana. My hands never touched anything else. What's more, I had my small hydroponic farm at home"?
If I personally was involved in killing and maiming, and my little brother did, too, only no allegation has been proved against him, can he open a shop?
What about my wife who never got involved? Cousin Fernando from Sinaloa?
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Regulate Marijuana Like Wine (interesting article)
by sabastious inhttp://regulatemarijuanalikewine.com/legal-and-political-analysis-of-regulate-marijuana-like-wine/.
i am ecstatic to hear that people are attempting something like this.
i have always thought that using marijuana could be likened to using wine as a medicine.
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dgp
I meant to ask what would prevent today's illegal seller from becoming tomorrow's legal seller.
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87
Regulate Marijuana Like Wine (interesting article)
by sabastious inhttp://regulatemarijuanalikewine.com/legal-and-political-analysis-of-regulate-marijuana-like-wine/.
i am ecstatic to hear that people are attempting something like this.
i have always thought that using marijuana could be likened to using wine as a medicine.
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dgp
The true one:
What would prevent the gangs in Vancouver from taking control of the sale of marijuana, once it became legal? Do you think they wouldn't want it legalized?
The profit wouldn't necessarily go down. Much of the drug money is spent in bribes. For obvious reasons, much of the drug has to travel in a way you cannot call "bulk." The economies of scale of shipping one big container full or marijuana would compensate for a lot of trouble.
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In Brazil, people charged with faking disability claimed they were miraculously healed by God
by dgp inthis is my translation of something i found on a brazilian website.
the original portuguese and the link to the text are at the end of my translation.. http://gospel.azumare.com/acusados-de-fingir-invalidez-afirmam-terem- sido-curados-por-milagre-de-deus.
people charged with faking disability claim they were miraculously healed by god.
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dgp
This is my translation of something I found on a Brazilian website. The original Portuguese and the link to the text are at the end of my translation.
People charged with faking disability claim they were miraculously healed by God
Elpídio Ardigó, who in 1982 was granted early retirement on disability, with a diagnosis of renal disease, states: "[My disease] has no cure. But nothing is impossible for my God".
An investigation by the Legislative Assembly of the State of Santa Catarina [Brazil] resulted in alleged social security fraud by former public officials, who were granted early retirement on disability but were never able to prove they had such. Experts examined almost 200 technical reports related to former public officers who were deemed unable to continue working but do not exhibit any symptoms [of their alleged diseases].
Among those under investigation is Elpídio Ardigó, who was granted early retirement in 1982 with a diagnosis of renal disease. "[My disease] has no cure. But nothing is impossible for my God. I can't explain the miracle to you; I have no way to do that; it's a mistery from God", Elpídio said. Doctor Nicolau Heuko Jr answered: "It is impossible for this person to have healed without a transplant. That just does not happen". Yesterday, 16 October, a report on Fantástico [a TV show], aired by Rede Globo [a big television network] showed footage of Elpídio, taken with a hidden camera and, in the course of the conversation, the retiree admitted to never having received any treatment for [renal] disease.
Yet another retiree, Ms. Jandira Rodrigues, who was granted early retirement on disability, also states that her recovery was miraculous. The doctor said that a person afflicted with ankylosing spondylitis, Jandira's disease, cannot walk normally and the prognosis is for a worsening of the disease. "Over time, a person with spondylitis loses flexibility of the backbone and the pelvis. As a result, the backbone bends forward and the person [has to] assume the stance of a skier, therefore losing the ability to walk normally", said Nicolau. Jandira retorted: "But my disease never got worse. Why didn't I get any worse? I can't say. Because what I have is my own. It's my faith".These two people retired from public service at the same time and are now under investigation for social security fraud. The investigation revealed that the Legislative Assembly of Santa Catarina is the country's leader in terms of early retirement on disability, with 46% of all people receiving pensions [claiming a disability], more than twice as much as the Brazilian average of public officials with disabilities.
Adriano Zanotto, president of the Santa Catarina Social Security Institute (IPREV, for its Portuguese initials), stands behind the investigation. "If fraud and bad faith by the beneficiaries are proved, that will have a number of consequences. The first, by IPREV, will be to revoke the benefit of pension payments. We will not make such payments any longer", Zanotto said.Personally, I believe these people only found a friendly doctor who agreed to give a diagnosis of disability -maybe for money- and, once the number of cases was so high that the authorities had to dig into them, they just came up with an easy explanation, one that cannot be proved, or disproved, for that matter, but one that many people will find reasons to believe or at least consider possible.
I also think that at least the honesty of these found sheep is in question. They didn't go back to work when they found themselves miraculously healed. That would be fraud; they could work, but woud have chosen to stay at home instead. Either that, or the miracle is a miracle twice: it happened, and it happened just before public officials found about the cases.
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Acusados de fingir invalidez afirmam terem sido curados por milagre de Deus
Elpídio Ardigó, que foi afastado por invalidez em 1982 com o diagnóstico de uma doença nos rins afirma: “Não tem cura. Mas para o meu Deus, não tem nada impossível".Uma investigação feita pela Assembleia Legislativa do Estado de Santa Catarina apontou supostas fraudes de ex-servidores públicos que se aposentaram por invalidez, porém nunca conseguiram provar a doença. Os peritos examinaram quase 200 laudos de servidores considerados inválidos, mas que não apontam sintomas.
Entre os investigados está Elpídio Ardigó, que foi afastado por invalidez em 1982 com o diagnóstico de uma doença nos rins.“Não tem cura. Mas para o meu Deus, não tem nada impossível. Agora não te explico o milagre, não dá para explicar, é mistério de Deus”, afirma Elpídio. O médico Nicolau Heuko Filho contesta: “Impossível esta pessoa ter cura sem transplante, isso não existe”. Ontem, 16/10, uma reportagem exibida pelo Fantástico, da Rede Globo, gravou Elpídio com uma câmera escondida, e na conversa, o aposentado admitiu que nunca fez tratamento para a doença.
Outra aposentada, Jandira Rodrigues, que foi afastada por invalidez, também afirma que teve uma recuperação milagrosa. O médico afirma que uma pessoa portadora da doença de Jandira, Espondilite Anquilosante, não consegue caminhar normalmente e que a tendência é piorar. “O portador de espondilite com o tempo vai perdendo a flexibilidade da coluna e da bacia. Com isso, a coluna vai encurvando para a frente e ela vai chegar ao ponto de adotar a posição do esquiador, e com isso ele perde a capacidade da caminhada normal”, afirma Nicolau. Jandira se defende: “Mas eu não piorei da doença. Por que eu não piorei? Eu não posso falar. Porque o que eu tenho é uma coisa minha. É a minha fé”.
Os dois foram afastados do serviço público na mesma época, e agora são investigados por fraude contra a previdência. O inquérito revela que a Assembleia Legislativa de Santa Catarina é a campeã nacional de aposentadorias por invalidez. São 46% do total de pensionistas, mais que o dobro da média brasileira de inválidos no serviço público.O presidente do Iprev (Instituto de Previdência de Santa Catarina), Adriano Zanotto defende as investigações. “Se ficar comprovado que houve fraude e má fé do beneficiário, terão uma série de consequências. A primeira delas, por parte do Iprev, vai ser cassar o benefício de aposentadoria, nós vamos parar de pagar a aposentadoria”, afirma Zanotto.
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Regulate Marijuana Like Wine (interesting article)
by sabastious inhttp://regulatemarijuanalikewine.com/legal-and-political-analysis-of-regulate-marijuana-like-wine/.
i am ecstatic to hear that people are attempting something like this.
i have always thought that using marijuana could be likened to using wine as a medicine.
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dgp
Sabastious:
The negative "effects" of the legalization of marijuana in third world drug countries cannot rightly be considered of merrit to the United States of America.
I will say that I resent the notion of "third world drug countries". Forgive me if I'm wrong, but it suggests that there is something inherently wrong with the countries; that is to say, with everyone living there. To this day, it's only minorities that are engaged in the drug trade in the Third World. Now, a minority of 100,000 in a country of 110 million, like Mexico, still means that you have to fight an army, you know?
Canada is now the biggest producer of designer drugs. Does it qualify as a "drug country"? What about traditional consumer countries, like the United States? Do they qualify as "drug countries"?
When I was a kid, a few people did drugs. Marijuana and cocaine existed, and so did mushrooms, datura, whatever. But it was not a big business because there were not many buyers from those. We drug country people did not make that heavy use of them, you know? That changed when marijuana and cocaine became articles in high demand in the United States.
Andean Cocaine: the Making of a Global Drug, by Paul Gootenberg.
Beyond that, I realize that the medical aspects of marijuana are part of the debate. My point, which you have manifested beautifully, is that the results of such legalization on third parties, whatever they can be, those are of no consequence. In other words, "I will do what I think is right for me, and if that results in misery elsewhere, well, morally I don't have to care".
One fine day, I spoke to a fine American man who enlightened me as to why Americans have "the right to bear arms". It is not a common thing to think, but one day America was a weak country and the fact that every farmer could be counted on having a musket was a big thing to consider before invading that country. That is what the man said; whether this is correct or not, I don't know. But that is the reason why Americans had the right to have weapons.
Now that America is far from being a weak country, Americans still have the right to buy and own weapons. The fact that many of those weapons end up in the hands of Mexican drug cartels seems to be of no consequence, as is the fact that it is Americans who buy and illegally sell those. "I am doing what the law allows me to do. It is not my problem if those weapons end up in somebody else's hands". Beautiful.
Ever heard of "Operation Fast and Furious"? American government officials gave weapons to Mexican drug cartels because they wanted to "track" the weapons. Many were used in killing Mexicans. Two Americans died. My last news about the thing was that there was an inquiry into the death of the two Americans.
How I wish we were part of the considerations.
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Regulate Marijuana Like Wine (interesting article)
by sabastious inhttp://regulatemarijuanalikewine.com/legal-and-political-analysis-of-regulate-marijuana-like-wine/.
i am ecstatic to hear that people are attempting something like this.
i have always thought that using marijuana could be likened to using wine as a medicine.
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dgp
Sabastious, I understand the logic. My concern is about how it would be possible to prevent drug gangs from taking control of the sale of marijuana.
I'm currently reading this book:
El Cartel de Sinaloa: Un Historia del Uso Politico del Narco
(The Sinaloa Cartel: The history of the political use of trafficking in drugs)
This book is in Spanish, so I don't expect most people on this forum to read it. Its author is a Mexican journalist who claims the current Mexican war on drugs is just a president with a legitimacy crisis trying to play the hero so he will get the recognition he craves. I disagree with that, but one thing about this book is that it addresses the multinational drug problem with Mexican eyes. The drug problem can be seen from different points of view.
I am in chapter 2 of that book.
The author says that Mexican drug gangs have been hit by the availability of designer drugs. They started as sellers of poppies, then marijuana, then cocaine. But designer drugs are -of course- other ways to get high, and they compete for the customer's money. Their profits have been reduced not because their sale prices or volumes have gone down, but because it doesn't make as much sense to to smuggle more drug into traditional consumer countries if it won't get sold anyways. So, now they are also selling locally.
My point here is that these guys do know business. They don't do what they do because they are fools.
And what does that have to do with the legalization of marijuana?
Seen from "south of the border", whatever arguments there can be about whether marijuana is just a plant or not, whether it's not damaging or not, marijuana is business, and it would continue to be a business if it were legal. I haven't discussed whether marijuana is good or bad. I just said that legalizing it will not mean there will be less crime.
The business is currently in the hands of the gangs. They will not give up that business if it's profitable enough. And, because it would be legal, at whatever prices you had it, then they would still be "in business". You could think that some of them would get away with selling marijuana.
Let me make the point very simple. Al Capone may have died broke, but, did the mob disappear with the Prohibition?
I can already hear the rumble of people saying that booze became less of a problem, et cetera, but I also hope that they will recognize that the mob did not disappear.
Drug gangs will not disappear with the legalization of marijuana. They will just "diversify their product mix", which will, in my opinion, still include marijuana.
One more thing. Suppose that Mexico decided to decriminalize cocaine. It's just a plant anyways, one with a long history of use in the Andes. What would happen in the United States if Colombian and Mexican gangs were absolutely free to take their product all the way to the border? No need for gang members to hide, or dig tunnels, or use secret compartments in planes, nothing. It would create formal jobs all the way from Colombia to the border. It could be taxed to finance education and food. It would give financial sense to be a farmer. Why bother with beans or fruits or even coffee if cocaine became a legal cash crop?
I believe most Americans wouldn't like such a thing. It would create a huge problem. Well, this is what I have been trying to say, only with eyes "south of the border". The legalization of marijuana will make it harder for countries south of the border to control other drugs. Why would a Mexican or Guatemalan policeman risk his life trying to stop cocaine from reaching the United States, say, if the destination country could make it legal anyways? Why not just take the money?
Please notice that I haven't discussed the medicinal properties of marijuana or whatever. Maybe my point of view is lacking in the sense that I am not considering those points. But I wish that people with serious interest in the matter would entertain an alternative point of view.
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87
Regulate Marijuana Like Wine (interesting article)
by sabastious inhttp://regulatemarijuanalikewine.com/legal-and-political-analysis-of-regulate-marijuana-like-wine/.
i am ecstatic to hear that people are attempting something like this.
i have always thought that using marijuana could be likened to using wine as a medicine.
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dgp
Sabastious: I understand the theory behind making something legal and then eliminating overprices and the like. That is not the point.
I have not discussed whether marijuana is a drug or a medication or whatever, or whether the decision regarding its use has been taken away from Americans. My point has consistenly been a different one.
I have said that there will be no reduction in crime if marijuana becomes legal. I have also said that my regret, as a person who does not live in the United States and does not vote in America, is that, if you guys legalize the thing, we will pay for that in crime.
Drug cartels will see the same thing you see. And then my expectation is that they will not gladly give up a profitable trade. I am yet to see a businessman who makes lots of money on something and gives it up just like that. Instead, they will sell the product and will bully others out of selling it. Something like "All right, now I can sell marijuana legally. I just won't let any stupid bastard take the business away from me, whatever is left of it". In the meantime, they will go on with their "other" businesses.
It should be easy to understand this point.
I know I will not convince anyone here, but I think I can give an opinion.
Mr. What Happened is not happy with the fact that I do not think he is right. So he calls me a clown and a drug dealer in disguise. He also made blanket statements about Central Americans, which he cannot prove. None of that makes him right, or proves me wrong, or in any way advances the discussion. It does show us how uncomfortable he feels with different opinions.
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Greetings!!
by Lozhasleft inwishing you all a very very happy christmas and a wonderful new year.. lots of love.
loz x.
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dgp
Thank you very much, Loz! The same to you!
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87
Regulate Marijuana Like Wine (interesting article)
by sabastious inhttp://regulatemarijuanalikewine.com/legal-and-political-analysis-of-regulate-marijuana-like-wine/.
i am ecstatic to hear that people are attempting something like this.
i have always thought that using marijuana could be likened to using wine as a medicine.
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dgp
What Happened: Believe anything you want about me. I don't care.
I feel that you're trying to turn this into rounds of insults and mockery. I won't go there.
Now that you say that maybe it's my business getting hurt, well, the same could be said of people advocating for the legalization of marijuana. They just want to do the business in peace. They don't want their business messed with.
No, my argument is not that "if it's legal, then someone is going to come along and take it away". My argument is:
1) Marijuana is illegal right now. It is now in the hands of traffickers who do not hesitate to kill, maim, kidnap, extort, whatever. They do the other businesses because that gives them money, and money is all they care about.
2) Making Marijuana legal will not make those guys disappear or lose their interest in the plant. It will give them freedom to trade with it. Because the business is in their hands, will they let the legislator just take it away from them? No. They will resort to the very same "arguments" they use right now to keep everyone else out of the business of selling marijuana legally.
3) In the meantime, they will continue to kidnap, extort, kill, and sell other drugs. Anyone who is currently selling drugs INSIDE the United States on behalf of any of those groups would be able to open a shop. He would continue to do his "other" businesses.
With your comment about Central Americans, it seems to me that you want to make a blanket statement about all of them. You want to say that they are all criminals. Some are, some aren't. The same can be said of Americans, or citizens of any other country, or race.
For someone who claims roots in Mexicali, you don't seem too fond of browns.
I don't know if you should be concerned about Central Americans going to the United States. Central Americans themselves claim that, years ago, the United States deported Central-American born criminals back to Central America. Some of those didn't even speak Spanish, because they had been raised in the United States. The claim is that they learned "the tools of the trade" in the streets of Los Ángeles, and they employed those "skills" against Police corps that were a lot more prone to corruption and a lot weaker and less knowledgeable. This is, then, an American policy that backfired. These people cannot be deported again; they are now in their countries of origin. But that does not mean they have lost the contacts or the know-how to introduce drugs into the United States.
In his book "El Cártel", the late Mexican journalist Jesús Blancornelas claims that the mother of the Arellano Félix brothers lived in California and Texas. This, for five years. Her two children, Ramón and Benjamín, then the leaders of the most powerful drug organization in the world, regularly visited her. They used to rent an entire hotel for themselves. For some reason, Blancornelas says, "no one" knew about their crossing the border. I don't mean one guy crossing the border at night. I mean enough men to occupy and entire hotel. "No one" includes the CIA, the FBI, the INS, the Border Patrol, the Police corps of both states and the DEA. Come on! No one knew?
But you could call this anecdotic and maybe even untrue. But, tell me: Who distributes drugs inside the United States? How come there is never a big seizure of either drugs or money? When people say that "the war on drugs" can't be won, do they mean that the United States can cope with drug trade inside its own borders?
Your link to the Wikipedia tells a lot about whether you get my point or not. And you don't. You seem to believe that only the United States matter. I would think otherwise if your link were about marijuana in general. But, no: "history in the United States". This behavior of yours is precisely the kind of thing that motivates my comments. Guys, you're discussing the virtues of marijuana as a medicine, and you seem incapable of grasping that, in the real world, it is a commodity controlled by gangs, and it will very likely remain in the hands of gangs if you legalize its use.
Botzwana: I have one question that follows the same line of reasoning of yorus. How can polygamy be illegal, if it's widely practiced in the Bible? Didn't YHWH let Jacob - sorry, Israel- have four legal wives? How many wives did Solomon have? And concubines? Why don't we have polygamy right now?