Posts by darkl1ght3r

121

Documentary About The Flood and Noah's Ark

by Blue Grass in

about a week or two ago i watched a documentary about the flood in noah's day entitled "in search of noah's ark".

two things i found very interesting in this program is a theory that one person had about how they believed the flood was caused due to a meteor hitting the ocean creating a tsunami that flooded the entire earth.

scientist were unanimous in their view that this is a very plausible scenario and that there is no way to rule this possibility out.

darkl1ght3r

Billy and villalobo,

I'm fairly certain that the work to evaluate the validity of the "kinds" theory has been done. I know I've read it somewhere. Anyway, like Billy said, for the ark thing to work and then for us to end up with the biodiversity we see today would take like extreme-hyper-warp-speed evolution of the kind that even the most hard-core evolutionist wouldn't advocate.

But also the creationists have no definition of what a "kind" is. Is a "kind" a group that share reproductive capability? No that doesn't work... because there are lots of animals species that should be of the same "kind" yet they can bear no offspring (this is due to genetic drift, reproductive isolation, and leads to "speciation", which has been observed, look it up).

Also consider... where does archaeopteryx go? Is it a bird "kind" or is it a reptile "kind"? What about velociraptor? It's only slightly more dinosaur-like than archaeopteryx. Sinornithosaurus? Meilong? And what about Tiktaalik? Ichthyosaur? And what about all the synapsids (mammel-like-reptiles)? Ophiacodon, Dimetrodon, and Thrinaxodon.

Simply stated... the actual scientists no longer think those last few are EITHER reptiles or mammels, because they share so many common features of both. Which is kinda why they had to give them their own class. This is exactly a prediction of evolution: that the fossil record should show no clear distinction between the various recognized groups of phylum. In fact there have been so many "in-between" forms found that biologists had to completely redesign their classification system. This has given rise to "cladistics". There are no gaps anymore. Or at least none that would give cause to doubt the fact that evolution occurs.

And that brings up an interesting question: Perry... why, if after everything God created was deemed "good", did he proceed to destroy 99% of all species that have lived on the earth? 99% of all the variety he supposedly created? Isn't that a waste???? Sounds like poor design to me. This is a mystery to creationists... but it's a PREDICTION of evolution.

PERRY, PLEASE RESPOND TO THE ISSUES I RAISED IN THIS POST. Since you seem to have a tendency to duck my questions.

121

Documentary About The Flood and Noah's Ark

by Blue Grass in

about a week or two ago i watched a documentary about the flood in noah's day entitled "in search of noah's ark".

two things i found very interesting in this program is a theory that one person had about how they believed the flood was caused due to a meteor hitting the ocean creating a tsunami that flooded the entire earth.

scientist were unanimous in their view that this is a very plausible scenario and that there is no way to rule this possibility out.

darkl1ght3r

Oh yes, and about your "ancient dino pictures", those have been proven to be a hoax. And the few that arn't hoaxes are so ambiguous that the animals could be almost anything (like the pic you posted). Basically a few smart naitive peoples figured out that stupid fundamentalist tourists would buy folksy trinkets with pictures of dinos on them.

For example... from the Wikipedia entry on your "Ica Stones":

"The stones are reported to have been found in caves and stream beds. Because they are rocks and contain no organic material, Carbon-14 dating cannot be used. No other method of radiometric dating has been applied to the stones. Because the supposed locations of their alleged discovery have not been disclosed, it is impossible to estimate their age based on nearby geological strata. Furthermore, even a confirmation of the rocks' age would not prove that the engravings upon them had not been produced at a later date.

Neil Steede, an archaeologist who was investigating the Ica stones for The Mysterious Origins of Man (a film which attempted to make the case that humans had existed far earlier than previously thought), said that he found no patina on the engravings but that the rocks themselves showed patina, suggesting that the engravings are indeed younger than the rocks. [citation needed]

In 1998, Spanish investigator Vicente Paris declared after four years of investigation that the evidence indicates that the stones are a hoax. Among the proofs presented by this investigator were microphotographs of the stones that showed traces of modern paints and abrasives. The strongest evidence of fraud as claimed is the crispness of the shallow engravings; stones of great age should have substantial erosion of the surfaces. [3]"

~~~~~

Ohhhh.... burn. Creationists arn't doing so well lately...

121

Documentary About The Flood and Noah's Ark

by Blue Grass in

about a week or two ago i watched a documentary about the flood in noah's day entitled "in search of noah's ark".

two things i found very interesting in this program is a theory that one person had about how they believed the flood was caused due to a meteor hitting the ocean creating a tsunami that flooded the entire earth.

scientist were unanimous in their view that this is a very plausible scenario and that there is no way to rule this possibility out.

darkl1ght3r

Billy! Great post! But that was going to be along the lines of my next post! You're lucky I'm not as childish or prone to temper tantrums like Jehovah, the cosmicly transcendent 5-year-old. lol Seriously though... very well stated.

121

Documentary About The Flood and Noah's Ark

by Blue Grass in

about a week or two ago i watched a documentary about the flood in noah's day entitled "in search of noah's ark".

two things i found very interesting in this program is a theory that one person had about how they believed the flood was caused due to a meteor hitting the ocean creating a tsunami that flooded the entire earth.

scientist were unanimous in their view that this is a very plausible scenario and that there is no way to rule this possibility out.

darkl1ght3r

parakeet - Tru dat. As silly as this might sound to a fundamentalist... I place my trust in myself. I trust my ability for reason, logic, and rationalism. As those are the only tools I have at my disposal to determine fact from fiction. (And you've also proven Godwin's Law!)

villabolo - Good point. And to be fair, one can't say Hitler was necesserily a Christian either (not saying you did, but for the sake of clarity...), since his beliefs were rather murky. At times that he deemed it politically expediant, he professed anger at Jews for "killing the savior" and used other Christian themes in his speech. While there were also times that he expressed hatred towards Christianity. He was a savvy politician and often spoke out of both sides of his mouth. The one thing that can be certain however is that he was at least a deist, and believed he was doing God's work (whatever that meant). There's lots of good articles on the subject. Bottom line: No one knows for sure, but it's enough to say that he was just an evil bastard.

121

Documentary About The Flood and Noah's Ark

by Blue Grass in

about a week or two ago i watched a documentary about the flood in noah's day entitled "in search of noah's ark".

two things i found very interesting in this program is a theory that one person had about how they believed the flood was caused due to a meteor hitting the ocean creating a tsunami that flooded the entire earth.

scientist were unanimous in their view that this is a very plausible scenario and that there is no way to rule this possibility out.

darkl1ght3r

People should think seriously about this image as they contemplate the factuality of the flood fantasy...

The three spheres are 1) The Earth (duh) 2) The total amout of water on the planet [326,000,000,000,000,000,000 gallons], and 3) The total amount of FRESH water on the planet. Hope that gives you some perspective.

121

Documentary About The Flood and Noah's Ark

by Blue Grass in

about a week or two ago i watched a documentary about the flood in noah's day entitled "in search of noah's ark".

two things i found very interesting in this program is a theory that one person had about how they believed the flood was caused due to a meteor hitting the ocean creating a tsunami that flooded the entire earth.

scientist were unanimous in their view that this is a very plausible scenario and that there is no way to rule this possibility out.

darkl1ght3r

"This is interesting. Here's a newly discovered ocean....it's true. Right here on good 'ole planet earth:"

Yes that is interesting. Science is truly an amazing thing. It still does nothing for your flood fantasy. If you had read the article carefully they're not talking about an underground "ocean" (ala Journey to the Center of the Earth) but rather the total amount of water contained in one portion of the earths mantle under eastern Asia. Whats interesting is that the explanation of how it got there completely goes against both your "young earth" fantasy and your flood fairy tale. Please read and TRY to comprehend the entire article next time, instead of getting excited over a sensational headline.

"For the record, I am not saying that the known "evidence" supports a global flood."

That's good you admit that. Because NONE of it does. Yet you believe it anyway. Strange.

"As the secularists gain control of the world, people who view themselves as apes like Missing Link will increasingly make the rules of life and death for others, marrying their ideology to the state."

Blah, blah, blah. Typical right-wing fundie slippery-slope argument. Bullsh!t.

"Whereas Christianity was supposed to be separate from government, this separateness is the duty of all Christians."

AMEN! At last we agree on something! Now if only we could convince the remaining 99% of your fundamentalist bretheren of this, and try to get them to stop using our religion-neutral Government to legislate their irrational beliefs! Lets collaborate!

"Secularists are under no such obligation."

In principle, sure. Since there is no "10 Commandments of Secularism". But, if you think this something to be concerned about, you don't understand secular humanist philosophy very well. Which doesn't suprise me. Basically, 'To each his own' is an extremely strong opinon among secularists. They (we) only get riled up when the Government is used to legislate particular religious views. For example, when school boards try to force students to learn about creationism instead of science. Your brethren seem to think that by not being allowed to shove their religion down other peoples throats, that somehow THEIR rights are being impinged upon.

Secularists seek only a society where the religious and the non-religious are equally free.

"Have you ever known a secularist that wasn't a baby killer?... even if passively. I haven't. Yet these are the same people that scream obsenities when presented with the mangled fruit of their choices. It's called denial. These same folks deny huge holes in their uniformitarianism theory that drives their arrogance. It is all related."

Have you ever known a Christian that wasn't a bloodthirsty warmonger?... even if passively? I haven't. Yet these are the same people that scream 'persecution' when presented with the violent and barbaric nature of their history, holy book, and God.

The "huge holes" you describe are only in the heads of fundamentalits. Not in the science. You havn't described any that havn't been handily shot down yet. Would you care to name some more? I'd also like to point out the fact that you've ignored my earlier comment that if you think that there are things (or "holes") left unexplained by current theories, there would be a mountain UNIVERSE of unexplainable phenomena if we tried to force a young age on this obviously old universe.

The "old earth/universe" theories WIN because they exaplian FAR MORE than other so-called "theories". Oh, and they also win BECAUSE THEY'RE BACKED BY ALL THE EVIDENCE.

You accuse science of arrogance, when the driving force behind it are statements such as, "I don't know if..." and "I wonder what happens when..." and "I wonder how..." Where as in religion the statement is "I ALREADY KNOW AND NO AMOUNT OF EVIDENCE CAN CONVINCE ME OTHERWISE." It takes humility to be willing to change ones viewpoint, no matter how cherished. THAT is the definition of intellectual honesty and a vital quality that nearly all creationists lack.

"Like I've said many times, people see what they want.... and some of these people want to force others through intimidation to "see" as they do."

Pot calling the kettle black much? Ironically, I don't know any atheist that wants to force other to believe as they do. But historically... this is exactly what Christians are known for.

121

Documentary About The Flood and Noah's Ark

by Blue Grass in

about a week or two ago i watched a documentary about the flood in noah's day entitled "in search of noah's ark".

two things i found very interesting in this program is a theory that one person had about how they believed the flood was caused due to a meteor hitting the ocean creating a tsunami that flooded the entire earth.

scientist were unanimous in their view that this is a very plausible scenario and that there is no way to rule this possibility out.

darkl1ght3r

"Seen your link before dark...utter nonsense."

That link reflects the consensus of the scientific community regarding your, "evidence". OK, so it's you vs. the entire scientific community. Sure, you convinced me.

That is why humans are so scary, they can force themselves into total deception at will."

Hearing that statement come from a young earth creationist just destroyed all of the irony-meters within a 20 mile radius.

"Recent examples of "stinking", "rotting" dinosaur tissue, soft tissue, hemoglobin and protein fragments just add to the fossil record of dinosaurs and humans co-existing, destroying many evolutionary claims."

Leolaia already handled this one nicely.

"That's why I went Glen Rose, Tx myself, saw the evidence, talked with Dr. Baugh."

So, if an untrained layperson cant get the full scope from a picture, then that same untrained layperson can aquire some insight that he couldn't before by staring at it through glass? Ok.

If evolutionary scientists are going to make an "unassailable" theory of our uniform/non-catostrophic history it ought to at least have something better to present than denial and accusations of "liar".

They most certainly do have something better to present. And maybe someday you'll work up the courage to investigate the REAL science with an open mind. Scientists call creationists "liars" because that's what many of them are (See Kent Hovind, Duane Gish, and the WTB&TS).

The reality is that these discoveries and others like them, while not disproving an old age for the earth, do provide evidence that evolutionary scientists can and do see what they want to.... just like everyone else.

The reality is... these discoveries and others like them have been debunked over and over by REAL scientists (not like your creationist diploma-mill Ph.Ds), and therefore mean nothing. The few remaining anomolies, in and of themselves are not enough to outweigh the clear and unambiguous mountain of evidence in favor of evolution and an old universe.

I'd also like to inform you that Francis Collins, head of the human genome project, and now head of the NIH, and himself a fundamentalist Christian, and a GOOD scientist, has stated that even with out a fossil record, DNA evidence alone is enough to confirm common ancestry. This guy has forgotten more about DNA than you or I will ever know.

I'd love to stay a post more but I've got a philosophy paper due tomorrow! Peace out!!!

Don't drink the Kool-Aide!

Too late! You've already polished it off!!!

121

Documentary About The Flood and Noah's Ark

by Blue Grass in

about a week or two ago i watched a documentary about the flood in noah's day entitled "in search of noah's ark".

two things i found very interesting in this program is a theory that one person had about how they believed the flood was caused due to a meteor hitting the ocean creating a tsunami that flooded the entire earth.

scientist were unanimous in their view that this is a very plausible scenario and that there is no way to rule this possibility out.

darkl1ght3r

And what "holes" would those be Perry? Do you cite deficiencies in one theory as evidence for your own? That's not how science works. Positive claims require positive proof. But the evidence for a 4.5 billion year old earth is iron clad, and is based on physical laws that your god supposedly put in place. If you like I can go into more detail as that is a subject I've spent some time researching. But If you think that the current scientific model leaves a few things unexplained, there are a myriad MORE unexplainable problems that would arise from trying to force a young age onto this 13.5 billion year old universe (and 4.5 billion year old earth).

And about your "footprints", that's been debunked. Sorry.

http://www.talkorigins.org/indexcc/CC/CC101.html

And about your question to homer... If God says the earth was ruined, but it wasn't. Doesn't that mean God lied? Or maybe that wasn't God at all. And, personally, I am critical of man's genocides. But man is not God. And I am particularly critical of the fact that most of them were done in the name of your God. And the fact that the framework that allowed those atrocites to take place still exists, and still holds power over many minds.

121

Documentary About The Flood and Noah's Ark

by Blue Grass in

about a week or two ago i watched a documentary about the flood in noah's day entitled "in search of noah's ark".

two things i found very interesting in this program is a theory that one person had about how they believed the flood was caused due to a meteor hitting the ocean creating a tsunami that flooded the entire earth.

scientist were unanimous in their view that this is a very plausible scenario and that there is no way to rule this possibility out.