Diametrically opposed, mutually exclusive views about God, Christ, gospel, salvation are not equally true/salvific. There are false gospels, false christs that are worthless (Gal. 1; Jude 3; 2 Cor. 11:4). WT cannot be reformed. It could be made to be a nicer cult, but it will still be a cult (cf. Children/Family of God David Berg nightmare). What is needed is what happened to the WWCOG after Herbert W. Armstrong died: they renounced false teaching/heresy and moved to orthodox theology (they still retain some sectarian baggage, control issues, Sabbatarianism, but they now embrace the trinity, gospel of grace, etc.). JW/Mormon is cultic counterfeit, not Christian denomination like Baptist vs Pentecostal. One can also reform and modernize Islam away from terrorism, but it is still a false religion (the terrorist ideas are actually closer to Muhammad/Koran than moderate, modern Islam is).
godrulz
JoinedPosts by godrulz
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15
New video in the WT Comments style
by RayPublisher inthis is only the second one they have done but it's pretty good:.
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hlxozqq2epm.
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117
Is Rev 5:11-14 Worship or Obeisance?
by JCISGOD98 ini asked a jw last week the following question, "is revelation 5:11-14 a worship act to the lamb or an act of obeisance?.
revelation 5:11-14 nwt states and i saw, and i heard a voice of many angels around the throne and the living creatures and the elders, and the number of them was myriads of myriads and thousands of thousands, saying with a loud voice: the lamb that was slaughtered is worthy to receive the power and riches and wisdom and strength and honor and glory and blessing.
because it's an act of worship and it is not allow in your kingdom hall.
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godrulz
Hundreds of millions personally know the risen Christ. He did not return invisibly in 1914, but will return visibly in the future, perhaps in our generation, or maybe not, but He will return just like His promised First coming happened. The reason He has not come back yet is 2 Peter 3:9 (scoffers will be proven wrong just like in Noah's day).
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328
Jesus Is Jehovah/Jehovah Is Jesus
by snowbird inhttp://www.str.org/site/news2?page=newsarticle&id=5725.
i fought against this with all my wts-trained power, but truth prevailed.. any way you cut it, it comes out the same.. peace and strength in your search.. sylvia.
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godrulz
What murders in the first 3 centuries are you talking about? The reality is that Sabellianism and modalism were not on the radar until a few centuries after the trinitarian view was normatively accepted (even without exhaustive philosophical detail). When they did appear, they were condemned as heretical and orthodoxy was maintained (the WT trinity booklet misrepresents the early Church Fathers, including the Constantine conspiracy). Those who reject the trinity are ignorant of Church history/history of dogma and Scripture itself.
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117
Is Rev 5:11-14 Worship or Obeisance?
by JCISGOD98 ini asked a jw last week the following question, "is revelation 5:11-14 a worship act to the lamb or an act of obeisance?.
revelation 5:11-14 nwt states and i saw, and i heard a voice of many angels around the throne and the living creatures and the elders, and the number of them was myriads of myriads and thousands of thousands, saying with a loud voice: the lamb that was slaughtered is worthy to receive the power and riches and wisdom and strength and honor and glory and blessing.
because it's an act of worship and it is not allow in your kingdom hall.
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godrulz
To be the Son of God is to be equal with the Father (monogenes). A different Greek word than 'theos' could be used if Jesus was merely divine in a sense, not Deity. Jesus has the names, titles, attributes of Deity. There is only one superlative King of kings, Lord of lords, Alpha and Omega, I AM, God, etc., yet Jesus has these same titles as the Father. He is Judge, Savior, prayed to, worshipped, Creator, Light, etc., things unique to God properly understood. The Jews understood Jewish Jesus and went to stone Him for blasphemy, a mere man claiming to be God/equal with God. Jesus did not correct their understanding, but stood firm in His claims that they understood correctly. JWs also reject these claims, but they do not even understand what He was claiming since they are not Jewish (first century).
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Jesus Is Jehovah/Jehovah Is Jesus
by snowbird inhttp://www.str.org/site/news2?page=newsarticle&id=5725.
i fought against this with all my wts-trained power, but truth prevailed.. any way you cut it, it comes out the same.. peace and strength in your search.. sylvia.
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godrulz
The Messiah is Deity. We do not dispute that the Father is not the Son (hence reject modalism/Sabellianism and Arianism just as the early church did; these heresies post-date a trinitarian view).
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57% of all publishers pioneered in April
by hoser inwe had a letter read this afternoon after the watchtower study that said we had 54,408 auxillary pioneers in april and with the regular pioneers it totaled 64,855 in full time preaching in april.
57% of the publishers.. so my guess is that the co will come down hard on any congregation that didn't meet those numbers next april.. i think the 30 hour thing had it's desired effect.. hoser.
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godrulz
Is it theoretically possible to be a bump-on-log (Christians might call them pew warmers) and never go door-to-door as a baptized Witness and still be considered worthy of Paradise? Can someone go to a few meetings a month or none at all, never do field service (yet perhaps talk with a neighbour or leave one magazine/year at a bus stop), etc. and have full assurance of living forever? This may be an acid test of Christian grace/faith alone vs cultic works. Can a person be saved by not being part of the Catholic Church or the WT organization? Is salvation based on faith in a person (Christ) or conformity to rules of manmade organization? What are the consequences of not going door-to-door? I imagine leadership opportunity would not happen. Since they are now tying loyalty to organization and door-to-door with baptism pledge, is it a salvation issue or can one trust Jehovah/Jesus for forgiveness of sin without any subsequent works of any kind? Works are normative fruit of faith, but are they part of the root (a condition of salvation)?
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328
Jesus Is Jehovah/Jehovah Is Jesus
by snowbird inhttp://www.str.org/site/news2?page=newsarticle&id=5725.
i fought against this with all my wts-trained power, but truth prevailed.. any way you cut it, it comes out the same.. peace and strength in your search.. sylvia.
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godrulz
There is one God, Yahweh. The Messiah is Deity/God (Is. 9:6 with Is. 10:21 'el gibbor'). The Father and Son/Messiah are personally distinct (vs modalism), but they share the same uncreated nature/essence/substance (Deity vs Arianism). They are not separate beings/gods (polytheism). By showing that the Father is not the Son/Messiah, you are showing that modalism is not true (JWs always think they are refuting trinitarianism when they are actually refuting the heresy of Sabellianism, which started before Arianism in church history, but both rightly condemned as heretical). Based on dozens of other verses, you are not showing that Messiah/Jesus is not YHWH.
Ps. 2 is not an issue for trinitarians (and remember that the full revelation is progressive into the NT, so all truth is not in the one passage in the OT).
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Q for all Christians (not just JW) about the ransom.
by Anony Mous inso this is the basic logical flaw in christianity i believe.
a brother identified it from the stage for me in a talk.
we all agree (as christians and jw's) that the ransom was necessary because adam lost his perfection and everlasting life.. this is a paraphrase from the talk:.
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godrulz
I do have a short memory and cannot keep track of all posts, all posters. If asked, I would not hesitate to declare that Jesus is Almighty God, uncreated Creator, YHWH, not mere creature (He is the God-Man). Any Christian will not hesitate to make this statement. Cultists have something to hide. I simply want to know if I am debating Calvinism with a fellow believer or if the faith issue is moot in light of a denial of the Deity of Christ (salvific issue). Don't be like trying to nail down jello. Identifying beliefs with names or labels facilitates communication/understanding and is not name calling. We can agree to disagree, but it would help to know what the differences/similarities are.
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117
Is Rev 5:11-14 Worship or Obeisance?
by JCISGOD98 ini asked a jw last week the following question, "is revelation 5:11-14 a worship act to the lamb or an act of obeisance?.
revelation 5:11-14 nwt states and i saw, and i heard a voice of many angels around the throne and the living creatures and the elders, and the number of them was myriads of myriads and thousands of thousands, saying with a loud voice: the lamb that was slaughtered is worthy to receive the power and riches and wisdom and strength and honor and glory and blessing.
because it's an act of worship and it is not allow in your kingdom hall.
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godrulz
There is no difference in the worship given to the Father and Lamb in Revelation. It is forbidden to worship angels or men in any sense (Decalogue; Revelation statements of angels to John). The cumulative evidence is that Jesus is God, not angel, not mere man.
As to Jn. 20:28, the Arian perspective makes no sense and nothing in Johannine thought contradicts the trinitarian view (Jn. 1:1 is definitive).
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57% of all publishers pioneered in April
by hoser inwe had a letter read this afternoon after the watchtower study that said we had 54,408 auxillary pioneers in april and with the regular pioneers it totaled 64,855 in full time preaching in april.
57% of the publishers.. so my guess is that the co will come down hard on any congregation that didn't meet those numbers next april.. i think the 30 hour thing had it's desired effect.. hoser.
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godrulz
For us non-JWs, can you quickly clarify the levels of service (pioneer, auxil., publisher, etc.)? What are the hour requirements? How does it relate to whether one is baptized or not? Does it matter that the early church had no organizational clock punching, stats, etc.? In Christian circles, we share our faith freely without keeping track for brownie points, control, good works counting, etc. It seems like an accountability or sales technique, not NT discipleship/evangelism.