These guys appear to be cronies. Since they deny the Deity of Christ and the personality of the Holy Spirit, they are sinful men ruling in the flesh. This contrasts with godly servant leadership filled with the Spirit in the despised churches of 'Christendom'. It is hypocritical to rail against the pope/papacy when WT/GB is essentially the same thing (without as much light even).
godrulz
JoinedPosts by godrulz
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75
Unrest in the Governing Body
by JWFreak inone of the many questions that i am asked is what are the current gb members like, who are the hardliners and who are more moderate.. because of my previous job, at a european bethel, i had dealings with most of them with the exception of sam herd.. these are my observations of my conversations with them and how others who had dealings with them.. other ex bethelites may have contrary views to mine, but i would be surprised.. i had spent a lot of time with splane, lett and morris.
hardliners.
david splane, without doubt the one who commands the most respect and attention.
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85
Q for all Christians (not just JW) about the ransom.
by Anony Mous inso this is the basic logical flaw in christianity i believe.
a brother identified it from the stage for me in a talk.
we all agree (as christians and jw's) that the ransom was necessary because adam lost his perfection and everlasting life.. this is a paraphrase from the talk:.
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godrulz
corp, this is an inaccurate straw man view that may be based on Augustinian, traditional 'original sin'. Sin is moral, not metaphysical. Adam is responsible for his sin and we are responsible for our own sin. We are sinners because we sin. We do not sin because we are born sinners. Sin is volitional, not genetic. You are confusing physical and moral depravity. We inherit physical depravity and the consequences of the fall from Adam (death, suffering, etc.). We form moral depravity through our own choices. We did choose to disobey, rebel against God, be lawless, selfish, etc. Ezekiel says that the soul that sins will die. Sinless Jesus, redeemed saints still physically die. Spiritual/eternal death is based on following in Adam's footsteps. Physical depravity is influential, not causative. We are responsible for our own choices. We are not condemned because Adam sinned, but because we personally sin (Rom. 1-3). The WT view of Adam, scales, perfect life for Adam's life, etc. is a wrong view of the necessity of the atonement. There are a number of theories (Christians have freedom to wrestle with these, disagree, etc.) relating to this. I believe the Moral Government theory is closest. If you investigate that and realize WT view is unbiblical, you may not be so quick to reject the necessity of His death and resurrection. We are not responsible for Adam's sin, but we are physically affected by it (believers die, but they don't go to hell).
So, differentiate physical/moral depravity, see sin as volitional, not genetic, and understand the atonement issues are governmental, not personal (public vs retributive justice), and you will not be able to falsely accuse God with your last line. Wrong assumptions lead to wrong conclusions. Christ's death satisfies love, mercy, holiness, justice. It demonstrates the awfulness of sin and the great love of God (far cry from your impugning statement based on your ignorance of theology). It allows a holy God to extend mercy to repentant sinners without compromising His holy law and moral government. If you have any idea of our Judeo-Christian legal system, you will see a glimpse of some of these principles that you would defend (we don't let serial killers loose for a reason and expect justice if we are wronged in a heinous way).
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Do you yearn to know what we are, and why we are here, before you die?
by sabastious inlets face it, we don't know what humans are.
science is doing a good job at uncovering many facts about us, but even science cannot explain consciousness yet.
conciousness is still a strong mystery to us.
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godrulz
Rom. 1-3 shows that apart from Christ our supposed 'goodness' is like filthy rags to a holy God. We all fall short of His glory and perfection. It is not arrogance to say what God says about the human condition apart from Him. Without seeing our sin and condemnation, we will not see our need for a great Savior (we cannot save ourselves). It is humility vs pride to recognize this.
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75
Unrest in the Governing Body
by JWFreak inone of the many questions that i am asked is what are the current gb members like, who are the hardliners and who are more moderate.. because of my previous job, at a european bethel, i had dealings with most of them with the exception of sam herd.. these are my observations of my conversations with them and how others who had dealings with them.. other ex bethelites may have contrary views to mine, but i would be surprised.. i had spent a lot of time with splane, lett and morris.
hardliners.
david splane, without doubt the one who commands the most respect and attention.
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godrulz
I respect your legit point. I do have another light side that will eventually come out more. Perhaps we can start with a common enemy, the JW/WT Borg (I understand those who have been in it have a much bigger personal cost/stake in the issue, but concerned Christians should not be dismissed as JW-like in our sincere efforts to commiserate and try to share a more biblical, balanced, positive perspective; I liked the youtube video that showed the sad, oppressed state of JWs and then their post-Jesus joyful state. There is rejoicing when one sinner repents; I would delight greatly to have any victim of any sort find true joy and freedom. For me, God's glory is paramount and it is grievous to see how it is impugned by false religion.
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75
Unrest in the Governing Body
by JWFreak inone of the many questions that i am asked is what are the current gb members like, who are the hardliners and who are more moderate.. because of my previous job, at a european bethel, i had dealings with most of them with the exception of sam herd.. these are my observations of my conversations with them and how others who had dealings with them.. other ex bethelites may have contrary views to mine, but i would be surprised.. i had spent a lot of time with splane, lett and morris.
hardliners.
david splane, without doubt the one who commands the most respect and attention.
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godrulz
Everything comes back to Jesus. If GB is the huge issue for JWs, it is good to remind them that the real issue is the Lordship/Headship of Christ, not the fallible GB who ruins lives. We are told to trust a person, not a manmade mediator organization. This seems relevant to the topic and worth mentioning to those who fail to see the distinction. Not all my comments are about Jesus nor are they all unrelated to the topic. I don't have a big problem when people jump on my topics and use profanity, ad hominem attacks, etc. It is the wild west of the internet, not a controlled KH.
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27
Hello, I am New Here
by Boolshooy ini have just joined this discussion board.
i have been reading it for some time and have been enjoying the insightful posts here.
i grew up in the organization and had been very active.
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godrulz
Jerusalem Bible has some Catholic bias. More popular, credible versions include NASB, NIV, ESV, NKJV, etc.
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85
Q for all Christians (not just JW) about the ransom.
by Anony Mous inso this is the basic logical flaw in christianity i believe.
a brother identified it from the stage for me in a talk.
we all agree (as christians and jw's) that the ransom was necessary because adam lost his perfection and everlasting life.. this is a paraphrase from the talk:.
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godrulz
Cofty: your view is a straw man view of the real issues involved. You are talking about pagan chicken blood appeasement, etc. The Moral Government view rightly recognizes the issues are governmental, not personal, public vs retributive justice. God is full of grace and mercy, but has a moral law to uphold. Freely extending mercy and forgiveness (something He desires to do in love without being appeased to be more favorable to forgive) is not wise to the impenitent and his moral gov't without certain conditions to deal with justice issues. Everyone wants justice and wonders why God does not do something. When God does something about evil, everyone complains He is not loving/merciful. Justice and mercy kiss at the cross and the issues are satisfied with the substitutionary sacrifice. They are not personal to make an angry God less angry, etc. This demonstrates a lack of understanding and is unfair to the great heart and mind of God.
anony: you are on the wrong track to turn a limited metaphor of payment into a wooden literalism. Literal payment is a wrong view of atonement.
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75
Unrest in the Governing Body
by JWFreak inone of the many questions that i am asked is what are the current gb members like, who are the hardliners and who are more moderate.. because of my previous job, at a european bethel, i had dealings with most of them with the exception of sam herd.. these are my observations of my conversations with them and how others who had dealings with them.. other ex bethelites may have contrary views to mine, but i would be surprised.. i had spent a lot of time with splane, lett and morris.
hardliners.
david splane, without doubt the one who commands the most respect and attention.
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godrulz
Since I am not JW/WT, I assume freedom of speech and thought is meritorious. Go bully someone else.
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27
Hello, I am New Here
by Boolshooy ini have just joined this discussion board.
i have been reading it for some time and have been enjoying the insightful posts here.
i grew up in the organization and had been very active.
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godrulz
The differences between religions far exceed their similarities.
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'Great Crowd' of 12 people get baptised at District Convention!!!
by burnedout inyesterday, out of 4,035 people in attendance at the dc, only 12 people were baptized.
that is one more than eleventeen and one less than a baker's dozen.. .
want to take a guess as to the age group of this 'great crowd?
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godrulz
Mormons have high biological growth rate (and probably higher conversion rate than JWs; they are the other large pseudo-Christian cult). Do JWs tend to have larger or smaller families? It seems to me that a good number may choose to not have a family in light of 'the end' or need to commit to field service, etc. Is it also true that many defect after they are 18 (common in most religious groups)? I hope to live to see the day when the WT shrinks significantly. I believe God's hand is against the organization, but He is also reaching out to individuals to truly redeem them by His Son.