cofty

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Posts by cofty

• 
  405

  Origin of Life

  by cofty in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  in recent years significant progress has been made in solving the question of how life originated on our planet.. how do you think theists will respond when it finally happens?

  as a former christian i know my reaction would have been something like "well that just goes to show that it takes intelligent life to make life", but for two reasons that defense doesn't work.. firstly it would prove that life is not an ethereal force that originates with god.

  there is no 'ghost in the machine', no elan vital.

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  cofty

  why they can't just admit there is a small mistake and move on - Ruby

  Because so far nobody has demonstrated any flaws in my argument.

  If you can see any let me know. I don't want to be wrong any longer than necessary.

  As far as "souls" go it is up to those who refer to such non-entities to explain what they mean and where their evidence is. If there are other ways of knowing that humans have something called a soul that doesn't depend on evidence then what are those ways? To just make an unfalsifiable assertion like "god gave two humanoids a soul" is to be not even wrong.
• 
  405

  Origin of Life

  by cofty in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  in recent years significant progress has been made in solving the question of how life originated on our planet.. how do you think theists will respond when it finally happens?

  as a former christian i know my reaction would have been something like "well that just goes to show that it takes intelligent life to make life", but for two reasons that defense doesn't work.. firstly it would prove that life is not an ethereal force that originates with god.

  there is no 'ghost in the machine', no elan vital.

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  3. 
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  cofty

  Memphis - The angels who made bodies for themselves already possessed the "spirit of life" - they were living spirits who changed form.

  Same goes for the resurrected Jesus. In older publications it was taught that the life force was transmitted in the sperm. I doubt if they have repeated that gem for a long time but some similar assumption still applies. The official line is "life comes from life".

  That puts test-tube babies in a totally different category from the creation of new life from rocks. The former is a technical challenge, the latter is a theological impossibility. The reason is the very same that rules out resurrecting the dead without god. Pneuma belongs to god alone.

  That is why in the creationist brochure they are so careful to talk about scientists making all the components to assemble a cell. They do not talk about a living cell. It's typical Watchtower double-speak.

  EQV - Please Google non-sequitur
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  405

  Origin of Life

  by cofty in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  in recent years significant progress has been made in solving the question of how life originated on our planet.. how do you think theists will respond when it finally happens?

  as a former christian i know my reaction would have been something like "well that just goes to show that it takes intelligent life to make life", but for two reasons that defense doesn't work.. firstly it would prove that life is not an ethereal force that originates with god.

  there is no 'ghost in the machine', no elan vital.

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  cofty

  Thank you for a useful on-topic conversation Memphis

  Refreshing change!
• 
  405

  Origin of Life

  by cofty in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  in recent years significant progress has been made in solving the question of how life originated on our planet.. how do you think theists will respond when it finally happens?

  as a former christian i know my reaction would have been something like "well that just goes to show that it takes intelligent life to make life", but for two reasons that defense doesn't work.. firstly it would prove that life is not an ethereal force that originates with god.

  there is no 'ghost in the machine', no elan vital.

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  3. 
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  cofty

  explain the Angel babies pre-Flood. It's not a slam dunk like you think

  Yes it might be a very good objection to WT theology. I am not arguing that they are rational or in any way correct. Everything they believe is irrational and frequently self-contradictory.

  I am making a very simple assertion. According to WT theology the obstacle to making new life in the lab is theological - Pneuma

  Exactly the same reason doctors will never perform a resurrection.
• 
  405

  Origin of Life

  by cofty in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  in recent years significant progress has been made in solving the question of how life originated on our planet.. how do you think theists will respond when it finally happens?

  as a former christian i know my reaction would have been something like "well that just goes to show that it takes intelligent life to make life", but for two reasons that defense doesn't work.. firstly it would prove that life is not an ethereal force that originates with god.

  there is no 'ghost in the machine', no elan vital.

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  3. 
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  cofty

  Once somebody dies only god can restore that force. Scientists can never conduct a resurrection unless god sends that life force back into that person.

  The hurdle to resurrection is theological not technical - just like making life in the lab.
• 
  405

  Origin of Life

  by cofty in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  in recent years significant progress has been made in solving the question of how life originated on our planet.. how do you think theists will respond when it finally happens?

  as a former christian i know my reaction would have been something like "well that just goes to show that it takes intelligent life to make life", but for two reasons that defense doesn't work.. firstly it would prove that life is not an ethereal force that originates with god.

  there is no 'ghost in the machine', no elan vital.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  cofty

  You said - 'Spirit' is just another way of saying 'alive'.

  JW Org says - “Spirit” thus refers to an invisible force (the spark of life) that animates all living creatures.... Similarly, the spirit is the force that brings our body to life. Also, like electricity, the spirit has no feeling and cannot think. It is an impersonal force.
• 
  405

  Origin of Life

  by cofty in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  in recent years significant progress has been made in solving the question of how life originated on our planet.. how do you think theists will respond when it finally happens?

  as a former christian i know my reaction would have been something like "well that just goes to show that it takes intelligent life to make life", but for two reasons that defense doesn't work.. firstly it would prove that life is not an ethereal force that originates with god.

  there is no 'ghost in the machine', no elan vital.

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  cofty

  He doesn't literally have to give it to make something alive.

  The quotes I gave you above say otherwise.
  
  
• 
  405

  Origin of Life

  by cofty in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  in recent years significant progress has been made in solving the question of how life originated on our planet.. how do you think theists will respond when it finally happens?

  as a former christian i know my reaction would have been something like "well that just goes to show that it takes intelligent life to make life", but for two reasons that defense doesn't work.. firstly it would prove that life is not an ethereal force that originates with god.

  there is no 'ghost in the machine', no elan vital.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  cofty

  'Spirit' is just another way of saying 'alive'.

  “Spirit” thus refers to an invisible force (the spark of life) that animates all living creatures.... Similarly, the spirit is the force that brings our body to life. Also, like electricity, the spirit has no feeling and cannot think. It is an impersonal force.

  “The dust [of his body] returns to the earth, just as it was, and the spirit returns to the true God who gave it.” Eccl.12:7

  the life-force returns to where it came from—God

  With you is the source of life; By your light we can see light. Ps.36:9

  “the body without spirit [pneuʹma] is dead.” - Jas.2:26

  So if science made all the complex parts of a cell as the brochure suggests it would be lifeless without pneuma (the spark of life) from god.

  The brochure is typical WT double-speak. Nowhere does it say science might succeed in making a LIVING cell.
• 
  405

  Origin of Life

  by cofty in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  in recent years significant progress has been made in solving the question of how life originated on our planet.. how do you think theists will respond when it finally happens?

  as a former christian i know my reaction would have been something like "well that just goes to show that it takes intelligent life to make life", but for two reasons that defense doesn't work.. firstly it would prove that life is not an ethereal force that originates with god.

  there is no 'ghost in the machine', no elan vital.

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  3. 
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  cofty

  It's whether or not the means of transmission is an issue should scientists one day create life.

  In JW world, if science produces life from rocks the cell would have spirit. Where would that have come from?
  
  
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  44

  Canadian Appeal Court decision made the news: Judges can overturn unfair church edicts

  by AndersonsInfo in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  http://news.nationalpost.com/news/religion/alberta-appeal-court-rules-judges-can-overturn-unfair-church-edicts.

  the other day, this court decision was posted on jwn along with a link to the court document, but few expected the media to pick up the story.

  so to all involved, i understand it was a surprise to see the story in print.

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  cofty

  Thank you for the information. It has potential to be very significant. Elders will be hung out to dry by the organisation again.

  Why would anybody be an elder now?