By the way please take your time. This is a discussion forum. That means at its best you have to read your interlocutor's words carefully and respond thoughtfully to what they have actually written.
Sadly it's a rare skill.
Posts by cofty
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cofty
If you can't admit science knows SQUAT about what life IS and how it BEGAN, they you refuse, also, to see the rest is sheer guesswork - MCL
Actually science can define life very precisely and knows a huge amount about where, when and how life emerged on earth. I have read a number of books on this very topic in recent years, the most interesting was The Vital Spark by Nick Lane of University College London. He and his team are making fantastic progress in the field of bioenergetics. In other words the key to understanding life and its origins is working out where the energy for life came from.
'Life is nothing but an electron looking for a place to rest' - Albert Szent-Györgyi
I'm not avoiding the subject of abiogenesis because I don't have answers I am offering to stick to the topic of evolution and discuss abiogenesis on a separate thread.
Let's say for sake of argument that life began with an act of divine creation 3.5 billion years ago. Since then every species that has ever lived descended from LUCA through unguided evolution.
Even if I credit god with the origin of life you still have all your work ahead of you to explain the overwhelming body of evidence for the fact of evolution.
So if you can agree to less 'gotcha' rants and more respectful dialogue maybe we can get a conversation started.
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EVERY Religion has Hypocrites- even the TRUE One!
by MuchCloserLook inso, if you expect to find 'saints' with halos, you will never find real christians.. after over 30 years of being a jw, there are many things about the org that disturb me- yet no one else even acknowledges the only true god, as jesus referred to him.. not a 'they' or 'them' ('trinity')- but him!and he has always had the name jehovah (yehovah in hebrew)- even though the koine greek had no version of it when the nt was written.. so among the many things real christians have to endure- is often each other!
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cofty
What are the biggest reasons that make you convinced about the fundamentals of your faith and is there any potential information that could make you question them?
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cofty
MCL - I have spoken to you respectfully and offered to spend as much time as you wish to share my knowledge about evolution. In return you have tried to change the subject, refused to admit your error and responded with hysteria.
Are you genuinely interested in learning anything?
I could discuss abiogenesis if you want but your thread, and my response was about evolution. It's telling that you don't understand the huge gulf between the two subjects. This is precisely what the Watchtower does in every publication it it has written on the topic. The WT books and booklets about evolution display appalling ignorance and dishonesty.
I will offer a deal. If you stick to evolution I will address the current evidence for abiogenesis in a separate thread after that.
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cofty
Why not click on the link and choose a specific topic that interests you?
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cofty
Okay here is the first misconception, Abiogenesis IS NOT evolution.
Evolution deals with the fact that every species that has ever lived, including the 99.9% of species that went extinct before humans appeared, descended from a common ancestor over millions of years.
Abiogenesis is about how geochemistry became biochemistry.
The former is known is great detail; the latter is still an open question although massive progress has been made in recent years. My offer is to discuss biological evolution.
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cofty
No books
That was obvious from your posts.
I can answer any objection to may have to the fact of evolution and there are many other well-informed people here.
Let's talk about it. Nothing to lose....
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cofty
I noticed you proposed an argument from personal credulity.
This is the most common objection used by creationists. It takes the form - 'Here is a feature about the natural world that is really complex. I haven't read anything about evolution but I can't imagine how this could come about by naturalistic processes. Therefore god.'
It is an obvious fallacy.
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cofty
MCL - My question was 'What scientific books that present the evidence FOR evolution have your studied in recent years?'
I noticed that - just like the other many, many times I have asked creationists that question - you didn't answer it. So far I have a 100% record on that!
Evolution is a fact but there is also much still to be discovered. Every species that has ever lived, including the 99.9% of species that went extinct before humans appeared, descended from a common ancestor over millions of years by a process of evolution. This is as certain as anything that is known to be true. People who doubt this fact are invariably ignorant of the evidence. I used to be in that position too. Would you be open to discussing it or is your mind closed for now?
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Active JW's - Do you see a CONTRADICTION here?
by The Fall Guy inthe bible says this - acts 17:11 “...for they [the beroeans] accepted the word with the greatest eagerness of mind, carefully examining the scriptures daily to see whether these things were so.”.
km 9/07 p. 3 question box - does “the faithful and discreet slave” endorse independent groups of witnesses who meet together to engage in scriptural research...?.
and yet, in various parts of the world, a few associates of our organization have formed groups to do independent research on bible-related subjects... some have pursued an independent group study...so as to analyze the accuracy* of the new world translation... for those who wish to do extra bible study and research, we recommend that they explore insight on the scriptures, “all scripture is inspired of god and beneficial,” and our other publications...” .
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cofty
as a Catholic I read it to prove them wrong, then became shocked at how wrong my church was
Have you considered the possibility that you were right on both counts?