JT, you also seem to lack understanding of the concept of freedom of choice. Noone, but noone forces anyone to be Jehovah's Witness. Everyone is responsible for their own salvation, and that is a viewpoint also held by the GB. But back to the proof you provide to refute my statement, your proof is irrelevant in connection with my statement. I said no person is obliged to be a Jehovah's Witness, and that was in context with a discussion with Titus. You come along and proudly announce "Nonsense" and sprout off topic. What you say has nothing to do with what I said. I will restate and expand a fact. No person is obliged to be, become or remain a JW.
dieselman
JoinedPosts by dieselman
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106
Sola Scriptura
by dieselman inin response to yknot *** please note the wts doesn't believe in sola scriptura (bible understood alone by individuals), if you are 'lurker' and want to refute this fact, please start a new thread or feel free to pm me ...... (reproof will be accepted if you can show me my error of understanding on the matter).
in the words of the ethiopian "how can i," he said, "unless someone explains it to me?
" so he invited philip to come up and sit with him.
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106
Sola Scriptura
by dieselman inin response to yknot *** please note the wts doesn't believe in sola scriptura (bible understood alone by individuals), if you are 'lurker' and want to refute this fact, please start a new thread or feel free to pm me ...... (reproof will be accepted if you can show me my error of understanding on the matter).
in the words of the ethiopian "how can i," he said, "unless someone explains it to me?
" so he invited philip to come up and sit with him.
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dieselman
Perry, I'm not prepared to pander to your off topic deviation, which has no bearing whatsoever on the subject at hand. I will however restate that you clearly do not understand how the covenant arrangement operates, and will also very likely be unwilling to grasp it in the context of David and Bathsheba for example. You have already given up on the understanding of scripture according to the opinions of the WTBTS, and that is your choice. However I know that you know what I will offer as reply to you so it is a waste of time to continue discussion with you. Shaking the dust off my feet now.
Eyes wide shut, you still dont get the point do you. I responded to a definition by yknot, and then further responded to a definition by Titus, I do not have a definition of the term Sola Scriptura, as you correctly indicated it is not my term. I also never suggested that the WTBTS has Sola Scriptura as part of any so called doctrine of theirs. I suggest you go back and read my posts more carefully. I also have not pirated it in any way, I cast my personal opinion on the matter in the case of yknot's definition, and in the case of Titus' definition I provided some fact which is well documented in the writings of the WTBTS which I imagine most of you have access to.
Perhaps you should be directing your question of the definitions to yknot and Titus, but thusfar noone is able to refute anything that I have said other than twisting what I say to further their own devices.
Stick to the facts of the discussion without springing inconsequential verbage.
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106
Sola Scriptura
by dieselman inin response to yknot *** please note the wts doesn't believe in sola scriptura (bible understood alone by individuals), if you are 'lurker' and want to refute this fact, please start a new thread or feel free to pm me ...... (reproof will be accepted if you can show me my error of understanding on the matter).
in the words of the ethiopian "how can i," he said, "unless someone explains it to me?
" so he invited philip to come up and sit with him.
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dieselman
It seems people have difficulty reading here. It is a subjective opinion, I make that comment in general to your entire previous comment of opinions, not the origin of the definition of sola scriptura. And the definitions (two of them) in discussion have been expanded on. Clearly little reading and much responding takes place in this forum.
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106
Sola Scriptura
by dieselman inin response to yknot *** please note the wts doesn't believe in sola scriptura (bible understood alone by individuals), if you are 'lurker' and want to refute this fact, please start a new thread or feel free to pm me ...... (reproof will be accepted if you can show me my error of understanding on the matter).
in the words of the ethiopian "how can i," he said, "unless someone explains it to me?
" so he invited philip to come up and sit with him.
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dieselman
Perry, I am sure as a former pioneer you are well appraised of the situation, and do not require any explanation of how the Covenant is arranged. Your dramatics are wasted.
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106
Sola Scriptura
by dieselman inin response to yknot *** please note the wts doesn't believe in sola scriptura (bible understood alone by individuals), if you are 'lurker' and want to refute this fact, please start a new thread or feel free to pm me ...... (reproof will be accepted if you can show me my error of understanding on the matter).
in the words of the ethiopian "how can i," he said, "unless someone explains it to me?
" so he invited philip to come up and sit with him.
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dieselman
Very nice response eyes wide shut, and thank you for sticking to the topic. Of course that is a subjective opinion. Its entire premise is based on if you are indeed correct, and presupposes that your opinion is fact, which it is not, it is only your opinion, and the opinion of the source you quote. Nevertheless, I'm glad to see that at least somebody is getting the point. Almost.
Back to the point, I suggested that the WTS supports the principle of Sola Scriptura, which is evidenced in their explanations of prophecy. (This is in my opinion, and the rest of this paragraph is fact) However I was originally responding to the statement made by yknot where he said that the WTS does not believe SS, and in terms of HIS definition I do agree. Of course in his mind he was suggesting it as a negative thing, whereas I showed it is a positive thing. Aside from the example at Acts (and for the person who said I was not quoting scripture, have you found the shallow end yet?) there is the case to be made that understanding of scripture cannot be made without holy spirit. Not a single person in this forum can honestly refute that, and if they do, it would be hardly worthwhile to continue any discussion with them. I am not going to set out proving that holy spirit is needed to understand scripture, its quite obvious. (fact) What I do find odd is the forum opinion is that Jehovah's Witnesses do not individually all have the priviledge of access to the power of holy spirit just like any person on this planet. It is evidently even the opinion of those who formerly were or some who currently are JW, and apparantly that this is a unique domain for the GB only. Just so that all are informed, God is not partial, (fact)the holy spirit is an equal opportunity for all (fact). I have already expanded on that particular aspect in a previous comment and will categorically refute any suggestion to the contrary. The question is, are we(plural) benefitting from it. That is for us all to verify for ourselves, and we should invite God to inspect us (fact). If you think you stand up to his inspection then good for you (fact). JW's do not judge and neither does the GB (fact), and neither do they think that they do (fact). Once again, I will categorically refute any suggestion to the contrary and put it down to pure ignorance or obstinance. We all know who will do the judging. All the JW's do is publish their opinion of what God's message is (fact), and as a group, they like to think that it is the correct one, just like any other group likes to think that theirs is so too (fact). And much like individuals on this forum, they also like to think that their opinion is correct, except of course for the comedic lack of unity in the opinions of this forum (fact). Does that sound scripturally familiar.
To answer Titus, I am a 2nd generation, secularly further educated, JW, in my late 40's, df'd for many years and reinstated. I will not be discussing any further personal circumstances with anyone, so dont bother to ask. Suffice it to say that my experiences have allowed me to see things rather differently, and I am extremely greatfull to have had the oppurtunity to make an examination of many things with a broad mind. Further narrowminded arguments against my opinion and the facts above can be made amongst yourselves, however none would sway mine just as I am sure mine will not sway most here, and none will change the facts. You (plural) can misquote and take out of context all you like, the facts still stand. The WTS and JW's do use scripture to explain scripture, and they do not believe that a person can independantly understand God's Word, only by Holy Spirit and someone to assist, both of which are clearly scriptural facts.
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106
Sola Scriptura
by dieselman inin response to yknot *** please note the wts doesn't believe in sola scriptura (bible understood alone by individuals), if you are 'lurker' and want to refute this fact, please start a new thread or feel free to pm me ...... (reproof will be accepted if you can show me my error of understanding on the matter).
in the words of the ethiopian "how can i," he said, "unless someone explains it to me?
" so he invited philip to come up and sit with him.
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dieselman
And Mythbuster, you are trying to bust a myth. When anyone says the WT says this, or the GB says this, sola scriptura is not the point in discussion. So why make out that it is? I merely suggested that the GB and any JW uses the principle of SS in understanding the scriptures. Nothing wrong with that. Anyway, this has been fun, my day draws to a close. Cheers
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106
Sola Scriptura
by dieselman inin response to yknot *** please note the wts doesn't believe in sola scriptura (bible understood alone by individuals), if you are 'lurker' and want to refute this fact, please start a new thread or feel free to pm me ...... (reproof will be accepted if you can show me my error of understanding on the matter).
in the words of the ethiopian "how can i," he said, "unless someone explains it to me?
" so he invited philip to come up and sit with him.
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dieselman
Teel, I think you see my point on the HS not being a GB propriety, and that is by their own statement.
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106
Sola Scriptura
by dieselman inin response to yknot *** please note the wts doesn't believe in sola scriptura (bible understood alone by individuals), if you are 'lurker' and want to refute this fact, please start a new thread or feel free to pm me ...... (reproof will be accepted if you can show me my error of understanding on the matter).
in the words of the ethiopian "how can i," he said, "unless someone explains it to me?
" so he invited philip to come up and sit with him.
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dieselman
Let me help you Perry. The context of your point was that I stated everyone qualifies to receive God's Holy Spirit, and I base that on advise by the GB. Lets see what para 18 of the July 11 WT study says. "In their prayers, husbands can ask that by means of holy spirit, Jehovah will help them in their dealings with others, including their wives" This is just one example of many many cases where the GB encourages people to prayer for God's Holy Spirit to help them, and that includes bible understanding. I am not going to itemize every occurence but this year alone this point has been stressed over and over again.
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106
Sola Scriptura
by dieselman inin response to yknot *** please note the wts doesn't believe in sola scriptura (bible understood alone by individuals), if you are 'lurker' and want to refute this fact, please start a new thread or feel free to pm me ...... (reproof will be accepted if you can show me my error of understanding on the matter).
in the words of the ethiopian "how can i," he said, "unless someone explains it to me?
" so he invited philip to come up and sit with him.
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dieselman
Snowbird, thank you for your opinion. It is of course your opinion and you have every right to it, even in God's eyes. Why should leaving be complicated. If its not the truth in a persons opinion then they are at liberty to leave. Why stay, theyre just fooling themselves. It only becomes complicated when there is doubt, and where there is doubt then clearly a person has not arrived at a conclusion and therefore cannot make a final choice.
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106
Sola Scriptura
by dieselman inin response to yknot *** please note the wts doesn't believe in sola scriptura (bible understood alone by individuals), if you are 'lurker' and want to refute this fact, please start a new thread or feel free to pm me ...... (reproof will be accepted if you can show me my error of understanding on the matter).
in the words of the ethiopian "how can i," he said, "unless someone explains it to me?
" so he invited philip to come up and sit with him.
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dieselman
Perry, I think you should expand your research a little.