Ah I assumed the biggest block for the others was that they NEED somewhere else to go. Unfortunately the best thing they can do is do personal study and gather with like minded individuals only looking to knowlegable people who have earned their personal trust.
megaboy
JoinedPosts by megaboy
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16
"Intelligent" Witnesses
by megaboy inafter reading some experiences, i have found that this organization has had quite a big change in its operations within the last decade.
back when i was talking to the ocassional witnesses at a local hotspot i remember some of them having respectable intelligence.
what i want to know though is those who have been aquainted with who they felt were more educated and independent in thinking, how they handled the rapid changes.
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New and confused
by Catareta inplease don't hate on me.. im a 30 something blind woman, who has been aware of the witnesses a while.
after my dad died five years ago - i questioned my own faith - christian (anglican).
tried everything - the occult, new churches etc.. 3 years ago i was suggested to have a study by a good friend who is jw.
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megaboy
You ask no question in your opening post. Though that does illustrate you legitamately being confused and unsure. What are you wanting to know?
Other than that, if you read the texts you should notice that the JWs rely on logical fallcy language to convince people of things. Its written to sound reasonable when the conclusion is not truly reasonable.
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"Intelligent" Witnesses
by megaboy inafter reading some experiences, i have found that this organization has had quite a big change in its operations within the last decade.
back when i was talking to the ocassional witnesses at a local hotspot i remember some of them having respectable intelligence.
what i want to know though is those who have been aquainted with who they felt were more educated and independent in thinking, how they handled the rapid changes.
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megaboy
I got the impression that most people here were kind of just there, maybe not fully IN to it. But I guess I mean someone really invested beyond just maybe family ties and has some reasonable thinking ability. Maybe higher ranking ones?
I guess the "Huh" answered my question. Wonder how they spun that.
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"Intelligent" Witnesses
by megaboy inafter reading some experiences, i have found that this organization has had quite a big change in its operations within the last decade.
back when i was talking to the ocassional witnesses at a local hotspot i remember some of them having respectable intelligence.
what i want to know though is those who have been aquainted with who they felt were more educated and independent in thinking, how they handled the rapid changes.
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megaboy
After reading some experiences, I have found that this organization has had quite a big change in its operations within the last decade. Back when I was talking to the ocassional witnesses at a local hotspot I remember some of them having respectable intelligence.
What I want to know though is those who have been aquainted with who they felt were more educated and independent in thinking, how they handled the rapid changes.
Did they give a benefit of doubt to the organization despite the clear signs that there is no solid respect for "truth" and its really just like other religions?
Did anyone experiences others that had wake up calls and leave? Did most choose to fade? Did others make statements before leaving?
I had researched that their HQ had a lot of layoffs and people were homeless and were lied to by the head honchos. Did this have any large scale effect? Was it kept under raps and spun?
What is interesting about these new guys I've met, is that when I talked to them, they don't seem to be intelligent individually but merely memorize talking points, its not a conclusion they made personally. I'm sure some of them had to have been aware of this.
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Are witnesses even trying anymore?
by megaboy inhavent had an encounter with a witness in a while, almost 10 years, though at this point i could run circles around them in the scriptures, this encounter was very strange.
was eating with my son at a coffee shop, guy comes up using it as an opening.
i'm use to this because people find my son beautiful so i was open to him.
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megaboy
Thanks for the feedback. Now it makes morse sense to me. The way he opperated was more focusing on getting me to go to the website. Though some responses leave even more questions for me. I'll open a new thread for that. This is very interesting.
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Watchtower April, 2017 Overview
by Listener ini'll start with the first study article.. this study article deals with vows made to jehovah.
three main vows are discussed.. 1) your dedication to jehovah.
we are told that it is not possible to claim that our baptism was not valid .
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megaboy
Interesting, but if you make a vow to something that doesn't exist, IE the god that personfies "Jehovah", it means nothing and the baptism means nothing. A vow is an agreement, you can't make an agreement with something that doesn't exist. The same as putting a plate of food in front of an idol statue will not result in its consumption.
The JW version of god does not exist. Guess they are desparate if they no longer use scripture.
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Are witnesses even trying anymore?
by megaboy inhavent had an encounter with a witness in a while, almost 10 years, though at this point i could run circles around them in the scriptures, this encounter was very strange.
was eating with my son at a coffee shop, guy comes up using it as an opening.
i'm use to this because people find my son beautiful so i was open to him.
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megaboy
Havent had an encounter with a witness in a while, almost 10 years, though at this point I could run circles around them in the scriptures, this encounter was very strange.
Was eating with my son at a coffee shop, guy comes up using it as an opening. I'm use to this because people find my son beautiful so I was open to him. Gives me a flyer and I immediately knew what he was about, I was waiting for him to use a scripture but he didn't, he just said that it had websites with cartoons that teach morals, I told him I was perfectly capable of teaching my child morals and that my ancestors were the very people who penned the morals of the book he is promoting, guy got out of there before I could finish, just thanked him for his time and he flew off.
Didn't even use scriptures... I remember encountering younger ones who used scriptures. Whats happening to these guys?
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The "anointed generation" is wrong, not because it is dragging on too long, but because it is too short.
by prologos injesus taught a surviving generation, a group inhering everlasting life, an escape route to avoid a global disaster worse than the flood, a generation that "will not pass away--" an infinite generation.
wt teaches a generation that dies, ends, passes away, at the first sign of real trouble, the great tribulation.. what do you believe about this wt assertion?
(apart from that there is no talking snake, it is all irrelevant).
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megaboy
Keep in mind he talked in riddles to seperate people who didn't care, from people who really wanted to know what he was about.
All he was saying was that every generation of man after his assuming the heavenly throne would see these events he described as the great tribulation, if you read josephus all those things were happening during the first Roman empire. And as you go on in history this happened through the centuries, big earth quakes, wars, mass starvations and sicknesses. Basically he laid the foundation that the generation in his time would not pass away until seeing all of these described tribulations by either hearing about it or seeing it personally, and it would continually cycle through these things until his return, progressively getting worse.
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Was it Adam who altered his own DNA so that sicknesses & consequent death would be passed on to his offspring?
by deegee inthe blame for mankind's sicknesses/diseases and consequent death has been placed squarely on the shoulders of adam:.
romans 5:12, 17 - 19:"therefore, just as sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, and in this way death came to all people, because all sinned—for if, by the trespass of the one man, death reigned through that one man.......consequently, just as one trespass resulted in condemnation for all people........for just as through the disobedience of the one man the many were made sinners........".
1 corinthians 15: 21, 22:"for since death came through a man........... for as in adam all die.......".
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megaboy
Actually this was covered in a messianic script I read that seemed to go into more detail about Adam and Eve. Genesis was the book the decendants of Isreal had as an overiview but I'm sure there were some who prior to their development who had more detailed writings like the ones I read on these things.
It states that the state of dying and sickness was something that was placed on Adam by falling out of influence of the Creator. It said something of the sort that instead of out right destroying Adam immediately he just setenced him into a dying state. On a similar note it described Satan as being kept a live out of an act of long suffering and not because of some bet he made with God (as the witnesses claim). I believe the dialogue went as far as to highlight that he could have destroyed him immediately if he wanted but chose to put up with him for a time out of his characteristic of long suffering.
The script also explains that the suffering comes from falling into the influence of Satan, when Satan rebelled in the heaven realm he was cast into the earth which seemed to be described as a prison like realm and he was lost to darkness and when Adam transgressed he became a partaker of darkness with Satan as his master. Which required a buy back through blood from the son. Satan wants to destroy mankind because he wants to have this realm to himself since apparently before Adams fall, whatever form Adam had, placed him at a higher order than angels and angels were simply something more like handmaids/butlers to them.
I see some reflections in Enoch as him being described as transferred but it sounds as if he walked so close to the creator he went through such a physical transformation that he had no place with regular humans any longer and he begain to frighten them by his apperance so he was just moved out of the realm entirely.
I guess that reflects the theme in Genesis as first there was darkness and then with God was light created. At night there is darknesses but there are signs of light via the stars etc.
It's interesting to think if this is why there was a lot of hate and stress against murmuring in new testament writings, because what could be described as murmuring started the disorder in the heavenly realm.
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What Comes After the Watchtower Collapse?
by schnell ini was going to put this in my thread about pyramid schemes, but i thought it's discreet enough to warrant its own.
1) there are many faithful jws.
2) there are many men and women who could take control and fill the void if the watchtower collapses.
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megaboy
I think the most likely thing is never a BIG collaspe, unless there is some major thing that the org does that pretty much propagates to the world that its no good it won't burn out completely.
If it gets to the point that they have to admit they have no connection to the creator they will most likely tone down the prophetic blunderings in publications and focus on raw morality teachings and gamble with it being good enough for judgement day assuming the heads even earnestly believe in a god, could go either way but if they had any fear at all they would probably come clean, other end is that they feel they are stuck in a lie too far deep to get out of. At least thats the impression I got in a discussion with some of them.
Proving that they have some teachings and other concepts completely wrong they simply said there is no where else to go, if wrong at least they are teaching moral things in a sense etc. That might be what people will lean on.
Interestingly I was reading what many western call "non-canon" script (can't recall which one) that had an end time scenario where people would cry that they wasted their lives in untrue teachings with the reply being that it was pretty much on them for falling for it or something a long the lines of "oh well".