Posts by debator

44

JW Home study

by wiser in

jw
friends

can anyone tell me how long the jw homestudy lasts.

we are already going on a year and a half, and thank god i have not been converted yet.

i am sick of hearing their version of the bible.

debator

Hi sharah

Am I supposed to answer these deliberately loaded questions?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loaded_question

Loaded question is an informal fallacy. [ 1 ] It is committed when someone asks a question that:

presupposes something that has not been proven or accepted by all the people involved (a complex question) and
contains controversial assertions and/or loaded language.

I recognise the Jehovah witnesses as the only Christians in this time that Fully follow Jehovah as Almighty God and father through his son Jesus. it isn't an either/or situation.

Again to be saved means .....

John 17:1-3 (New International Version)

1 After Jesus said this, he looked toward heaven and prayed: "Father, ..... 3 Now this is eternal life: that they may know YOU, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom you have sent.

IMO only the witnesses do this!

and a scripture that shows this?

Zechariah 13:9
This third I will bring into the fire; I will refine them like silver and test them like gold. They will call on my name and I will answer them; I will say, 'They are my people,' and they will say, 'Jehovah is our God.' "

John 4:23
Yet a time is coming and has now come when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth, for they are the kind of worshipers the Father seeks.

All other Christian religions worship the son or a triune god over the father who they keep nameless. Demonstrably the witnesses are Jehovah's people by name and deed.

We are all recognised by which God we worship this is a Pure truth shown from the bible.

75

I'm curious...

by JediMaster in

did anyone here claim to be of the anointed and partook of the emblems at memorial when you were still a witness???

if so, was there really a force telling you, you were special and would go to heaven?

or was it more so overjoy at how spritual you though you were?

debator

Hi Loz

I am well acquinted with Ray he commited the sin of divisiveness and paid the consequences. I have no interest in reading his book that he sold for money, Anointed can go bad, the apostles highlight this and they are greatly persuasive still when this happens and the more so to be avoided.

Romans 16:17-18 (New International Version)

17 I urge you, brothers, to watch out for those who cause divisions and put obstacles in your way that are contrary to the teaching you have learned. Keep away from them. 18 For such people are not serving our Lord Christ, but their own appetites. By smooth talk and flattery they deceive the minds of naive people.

75

I'm curious...

by JediMaster in

did anyone here claim to be of the anointed and partook of the emblems at memorial when you were still a witness???

if so, was there really a force telling you, you were special and would go to heaven?

or was it more so overjoy at how spritual you though you were?

debator

Hi GL tirebiter

Please do not misuse the scriptures,john 6 the one you quote has nothing to do with the lords evening meal and is about Jesus real sacrifice for the whole of mankind his ACTUAL death itself.

The lords evening meal is a remebrance of this death.

But you highlight my point very well the differences are so great between churches and catachisms you have to KNOW what you are commiting to when you partake.

75

I'm curious...

by JediMaster in

did anyone here claim to be of the anointed and partook of the emblems at memorial when you were still a witness???

if so, was there really a force telling you, you were special and would go to heaven?

or was it more so overjoy at how spritual you though you were?

debator

Hi Aguest

If all you get from 1 cor 11 is not to gobble hungrily then you missed the fullness of the whole subject that is discussed and the importance of it.

Being anointed isn't about you gaining heaven but about you making a commitment completely to Jehovah through his son Jesus as head of the body. I see you are earnest but the anointed are known by their unity of brotherhood. Are you not judging the anointed among the witnesses? You call them false and yet criticise them for thinking the same of you?

It is not unknown for two different Christian churches whose members all partake yet they allow them to kill each other in wars?

You are right many on here have devoted their positions to a complete hatred of witnesses holding them under unrealistic telescopic lens of criticism they happily swallow whole from other Christian faiths. but to be hated is expected.

John 15:19
If you belonged to the world, it would love you as its own. As it is, you do not belong to the world, but I have chosen you out of the world. That is why the world hates you.

I think I would respect opinion on this debate site more if it was less unremittingly biased against the witnesses.

Hi lozhasleft

Did you think me harsh? I'm sorry if you did I was simply trying for mattor of fact. The word "anointed" is used to cover many different thoughts and ideas these days in our multi-doctrinal Christianity. I personally find the witnesses teaching of a select 144,000 bride-class of holy anointed more Biblically accurate than a general coverall for everyone.

So once you realise that what church teaches on anointed are so completely different, right down to individuals that are self-proclaimed anointed in themselves and recognise no church. You realise it has to be more defined because of this misuse.

Hi Candlelight

I like to keep the boundaries clear. I'm not sure I would say I like a prolonged debate especially if we are just repeating the same points. The gb are humble because they are humble. Admittedly the Pope with his country, palace and jewels and papal infalibility is an easy target.

What is idolatry? Can using the Bible as God's word and sword of the spirit mean idolatry? Can the "cross" a carved, wood, gold, silver mute image of Jesus in god's house be anything but an idol biblically?

You and I clearly have different ideas on what these terms mean and cover biblically. so we may have to agree to disagree.

44

JW Home study

by wiser in

jw
friends

can anyone tell me how long the jw homestudy lasts.

we are already going on a year and a half, and thank god i have not been converted yet.

i am sick of hearing their version of the bible.

debator

Hi Wiser

2 Thessalonians 3:14
If anyone does not obey our instruction in this letter, take special note of him. Do not associate with him, in order that he may feel ashamed.

This is from the NIV what is Paul saying here?

Hi sharah

Jesus told his apostles to wipe their feet from the dust of those that didn't believe. The apostles told us the following about unbelievers.

2 Corinthians 6:14
Do not be yoked together with unbelievers. For what do righteousness and wickedness have in common? Or what fellowship can light have with darkness?

To both Jesus and the apostles those that didn't believe had rejected God. Having confidence on the Bible message is not a crime.

The love comes in going out and giving the kingdom message literally preaching to the entire inhabited earth so all those that hear and listen can have the chance to be saved. It is not loving to chase after unbelievers if they have made their choice. You have to accept they have a right to that choice as we as witnesses do.

56

FAO: Bane - You Mentioned the Eye

by cantleave in

jw
friends

i don't want to hijack the other thread.. you mention the eye being better than any camera so lets discuss this.

i used to give a talk where i would use the complexity of the eye as evidence of creation, but i have since changed my mind and below is the reasoning that helped me do so.. i would welcome you comments and reasoning against this.. if you had a choice between being totally blind and being able to see things out of focus, which would you pick.. i'm sure you would, like me prefer to have out of focus vision, than no vision at all.. would you rather have vision that was out of focus and devoid of color, or be totally blind.

i'm sure you prefer the colour option.. how about if you could only see vague shapes around you or blindness?

debator

Darwinists such has dawkins try to blind with science. Make a speculation sound complex and scientific and it will be believed. They make you try and play on their playing field of assumptions said to be facts so your already in the losing position. To them the framework of darwinism is already in place and everything has to be fitted within it .

They even invent new speculative processes to explain how things they've never seen happened.

We live in a time of end results and if something gets disproved as most of darwins own theories were they create new ones to fit the changes and ever more complex but continually changing and redefining itself and allow for many different theories among it. Darwin becomes simply a header for things he never taught or understood.

For me darwinism is just a Big argument fallacy of Proof by intimidation.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proof_by_intimidation

75

I'm curious...

by JediMaster in

did anyone here claim to be of the anointed and partook of the emblems at memorial when you were still a witness???

if so, was there really a force telling you, you were special and would go to heaven?

or was it more so overjoy at how spritual you though you were?

debator

Hi candlelight

what adultery and idolatry? I see the cross idolatry, I see the pope calling himself God. but in witnesses I see humble men working for Jehovah through his son Jesus.

With you I can see you do not agree with our teachings that is your choice but then your anointed-ness is different and of your own understanding of it and not of the witnesses understanding from the Bible so it was incorrect to partake under our understanding anyway. So in that case you were right to leave.

75

I'm curious...

by JediMaster in

did anyone here claim to be of the anointed and partook of the emblems at memorial when you were still a witness???

if so, was there really a force telling you, you were special and would go to heaven?

or was it more so overjoy at how spritual you though you were?

debator

Hi outlaw

I refer you to these scriptures.

2 Thessalonians 3:6
In the name of the Lord Jesus Christ, we command you, brothers, to keep away from every brother who is idle and does not live according to the teaching you received from us.

Romans 16:17
I urge you, brothers, to watch out for those who cause divisions and put obstacles in your way that are contrary to the teaching you have learned. Keep away from them.

1 Corinthians 5:10-13 (New International Version)

10 not at all meaning the people of this world who are immoral, or the greedy and swindlers, or idolaters. In that case you would have to leave this world. 11 But now I am writing you that you must not associate with anyone who calls himself a brother but is sexually immoral or greedy, an idolater or a slanderer, a drunkard or a swindler. With such a man do not even eat.

12 What business is it of mine to judge those outside the church? Are you not to judge those inside? 13 God will judge those outside. "Expel the wicked man from among you." [a]

2 Thessalonians 3:14
If anyone does not obey our instruction in this letter, take special note of him. Do not associate with him, in order that he may feel ashamed.

The anointed in the early Christians held each other up to rebuke and expelling if they ignore their teachings or caused divisions among many other things. Are you saying this was wrong of the early Christians?

75

I'm curious...

by JediMaster in

did anyone here claim to be of the anointed and partook of the emblems at memorial when you were still a witness???

if so, was there really a force telling you, you were special and would go to heaven?

or was it more so overjoy at how spritual you though you were?

debator

I am sorry I should have been specific.

The teachings on eucharist, holy communion, sacrement, partaking outside of witnesses is that everyone does it whatever their circumstances from my experience and knowledge. I have had friends join various christian religions and they just partook straight away as part of their church services. They turned up on a certain weekly or monthly day and everyone at church on that day got offered bread and wine. I don't know any Christian religions besides witnesses and early Christians that have a personally qualified point of self examination when partaking

44

JW Home study

by wiser in

jw
friends

can anyone tell me how long the jw homestudy lasts.

we are already going on a year and a half, and thank god i have not been converted yet.

i am sick of hearing their version of the bible.

debator

The study is there to separate the interested from the not interested in God's kingdom message.

If you now walk away uninterested that is your right and they have done their assigned task. You cannot say you are ignorant of our Bible drawn beliefs from Jehovah and haven't had enough information to decide on.

Despite what some have said on here we as witnesses do the preaching work assigned us whether someone is interested or not. So we have done our job simply by offering them the message. Jehovah asks no more of us than that.

There comes a point in all studies where the person indicates his interest or lack of it. It looks like you have got to that point.