debator

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Posts by debator

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  32

  Does God Have A Visible Organization Today?

  by wannabe in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  does god have a visible organization today?.

  well, whether we agree with them or not, the governing body of jehovah's witnesses certainly believes he does have, and they tell us, that the watchtower bible and tract society is that visible organization.

  as we see, they also tell us that their watchtower society is the channel or instrument through which the spiritual food is delivered to other members of the household.. 1939 "we acknowledge as the visible organization of jehovah on earth the watchtower bible & tract society, and recognize the society as the channel or instrument through which jehovah and christ jesus give instruction and meat in due season to the household of faith.

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  debator

  Yes Jehovah's Witnesses!
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  48

  Man arrested for molesting child at church (Kingdom Hall)

  by Gayle in

  1. social
  2. current

  http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/local_news/man_arrested_for_molesting_child_at_church_98408764.html.

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  debator

  Hi soldier

  but then are you blaming the religion and place of worship for the actions of a man that used it?

  BTW do people on here pour through newspapers for stories like this one normally? as long as witnesses are involved? It defo feels a bit off. There's two links about it already and people speculating wildly and negatively on witnesses around it.
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  17

  The guilt trip email (Should be visible to IE users now)

  by SweetBabyCheezits in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i received this from my mother on tuesday after we skipped the sunday session of the dc.

  she's using guilt now and multiplying the effect by dragging my terminally ill mother-in-law (also uber-devout) into it the picture.... "sunday after the convention while we were counting the money someone came into the counting room and said there was someone outside wanting to see me.

  i went out there and standing in the hallway was [your mother-in-law].

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  debator

  I think putting your mum's private email to you on a public forum for strangers to read says a lot more.
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  116

  Biggest Harm Caused by Watchtower in AllTimeJeff Eyes.

  by Scott77 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  "jw's are an entirely different animal from manson's followers.

  they bleed you slowly to death (literally and figuratively), but the biggest harm jw's perpetuate is the lives that are put on hold for "theocratic" activities.

  a rich life is denied its members because of their doomsday scenarios' said alltimejeff, a former jehovah's witnesses missionary in west africa.. in view of the recent generation change and interpretation, please, what do you think about that?

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  debator

  Hi Paulapollas

  I worded it badly but please don't put words in my mouth. What witnesses have done is the exact opposite to what you think I meant. We treat deaf people as equals and if you had bothered to look at my links You would have seen assemblies for the deaf community totally catered for them to enjoyed. We go into countries and become the people we are reaching too. I went to a recent Assembly it is honest to say every nation and colour, age, disability where there and it didn't matter, we were a family equal together.

  I would respected you more if you had checked my links and No we are not rich people giving handouts to the poorer ones. We are the poor people made united and rich in our faith in Jehovah whatever our circumstances.

  James 2:5
  Listen, my dear brothers: Has not God chosen those who are poorin the eyes of the worldto be rich in faith and to inherit the kingdom he promised those who love him?

  So compared to rich huge religious charities that make much of what they hand-out to the poor. We do what we do because we consider all people our equals and deserving to know God's life-saving message wherever they live and whatever their disability.
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  42

  Faithful slave has been around since the 1st Century?? So why DIDN'T Charles Russell join them?

  by Witness 007 in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  the watchtower claims there has been a "faithful slave" since jesus time till now so.....why did russell go independent and start his own group of bible students?

  why did he claim the title for himself alone?.

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  debator

  Hi Isaac

  If the Angels couldn't pick out the wheat from weeds how could imperfect men in the gentile times? We can guess at a few because of their actions but that is all.
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  42

  Faithful slave has been around since the 1st Century?? So why DIDN'T Charles Russell join them?

  by Witness 007 in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  the watchtower claims there has been a "faithful slave" since jesus time till now so.....why did russell go independent and start his own group of bible students?

  why did he claim the title for himself alone?.

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  debator

  A servant is a person who serves.

  Charles taze russell did something that People rarely do. Criticism is easy but searching for real truth and sticking by it. And when you find it investing all your life and money into that truth?

  The Dvd said something that struck me deeply. "let scripture explain scripture" simple but profound when dealing with doctrines on the Bible. I am a witness because he and a few others had the strength of character to look at God's inspired word not just for answers but also for explanations of the answers.
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  116

  Biggest Harm Caused by Watchtower in AllTimeJeff Eyes.

  by Scott77 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  "jw's are an entirely different animal from manson's followers.

  they bleed you slowly to death (literally and figuratively), but the biggest harm jw's perpetuate is the lives that are put on hold for "theocratic" activities.

  a rich life is denied its members because of their doomsday scenarios' said alltimejeff, a former jehovah's witnesses missionary in west africa.. in view of the recent generation change and interpretation, please, what do you think about that?

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  debator

  Paulapollos

  There is no point in them teaching a sign language that is not an already established one. I should have made this clearer they can only build on what is already being used by the majority of the deaf community. But if you want proof of it working.

  http://www.salisburypost.com/Lifestyle/070310-Jehovah_s-Witnesses-qcd

  http://www.pe.com/localnews/corona/stories/PE_News_Local_D_deaf10.22bb969.html
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  29

  Now versus 7 Years Ago.....

  by AK - Jeff in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  we have been out of the organization since 1-1-2004 - at least that is the way we mark it to remember.

  we began to read ray's books in late fall/early winter of 2003 - a thousand pages later and a few weeks - viola - we were out to never return.. i was contemplating just how significantly i have personally changed in that period of time - not the stages, though there have been many stages.

  but the raw contrast of my opinions, moral stance, and view of the world is amazing.

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  debator

  And yet akjeff

  Whether you intended it or not. Your expressions are very generalised.

  "Freedom to really grow as a human being " "Live, Laugh, Love, as if each moment could be our Last"

  I personally find a greater freedom in searching and finding God specifically rather than just living in the moments that slip into memories so easily.

  You have made a choice Ak-jeff that I respect but also I challenge since you put it up here for us to see. It does feel like an appeal to emotion.

  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appeal_to_emotion

  "Instead of facts, persuasive language is used to develop the foundation of an appeal to emotion-based argument. Thus, the validity of the premises that establish such an argument does not prove to be verifiable. [ 1 ]"

  "Conclusively, the appeal to emotion fallacy presents a perspective intended to be superior to reason"

  http://www.nizkor.org/features/fallacies/appeal-to-emotion.html

  An Appeal to Emotion is a fallacy with the following structure:

  1. Favorable emotions are associated with X.
  2. Therefore, X is true.
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  67

  Bible says God confused peoples languages at Babel....is this childish nonsense?

  by Witness 007 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  yeah so in genesis we read how people began building a tower which would reach up to jehovah in heaven....must have been damn tall....rather then just stop them, god changes everyones language.....one guys speakin french.....another speakin russian and so on!

  can't finish the tower now can they!!

  this is not very scientific......does anyone believe this is how languages got started???

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  debator

  Hi bohm

  Is that the new explanation for us not to actually see evolution now? it sounds very convenient. So evolution happened before any time that we could check it against? that just makes it a mythology. It basically pushes language into an accepted assumption. Very convenient.
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  67

  Bible says God confused peoples languages at Babel....is this childish nonsense?

  by Witness 007 in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  yeah so in genesis we read how people began building a tower which would reach up to jehovah in heaven....must have been damn tall....rather then just stop them, god changes everyones language.....one guys speakin french.....another speakin russian and so on!

  can't finish the tower now can they!!

  this is not very scientific......does anyone believe this is how languages got started???

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  debator

  Hi leolaia

  I disgree a "just so" story is simply a recognition of the reality and can be checked against the reality. Many mythologies have "just so" stories that under simple everyday scrutiny are patently untrue. but Bible shows complex language was given to man straight away. God could talk to adam and Adam could understand language concepts like future, past that are part of language complexity. Then Babel says the Languages are confused by the appearance of different unique languages and this led to a natural separation of humanity.

  You own words show this to be a reality we live with when groups separate languages separate. I recognise the constant changing nature of language (it's inate fluidity) but while all languages are different in nature they are inherantly similar in functional complexity. I was trying to keep it simple because I do not have your knowledge on the subject. This inherant complexity of language resists an darwinistic framework that always suggests that simplicity is the first building blocks that lead to later and greater complexity. This doesn't happen with language. Gramatical function and complexity appear with the earliest languages we know of and they in their environment are as complex as any language used now. This fits with it being a unique specific divine ability we are given rather a seeably evolved attribute.

  There are no missing language "links" it appeared a fully formed in the earliest known forms as it is now in the later ones.

  On the table are two or three offers for language origin.

  1/ Bible - claims a fully complex given ability from it's start that also explains how completely unrelated languages linguistically to each other with no obvious connections appeared at the same time by divine intervention. (the examples you give would still have shown that connection with the original language they diverged from) When you look at any language it is a history book in itself showing what it roots were linguistically.

  2/ Darwinisms - always claims simplicity gives way to greater complexity. Survival of the fittest demands the need to evolve more complex ways to deal with situations. Then as something evolves clear links connecting these ancestral roots can be seen. Darwinists are constantly looking for connections and similarities that can show the original formations. You get nice pictures of skeletal heads apparently growing in complexity and brain size etc you have People using simple tools and then more complex tools, hairy ape-like men giving way to smooth-skined humanoids. Language complexity resists this type of calculation. Language was as complex thousands of years ago as it is now with all the same abilities to describe unseen concepts and have gramatical structure etc.

  Not only this, you cannot see the links between the disparate early language groups. You say they could just emerge but the examples you showed (Pitkern and Norfuk) like I said above would have shown their original language root despite how much they diversified. Language is a history book of how it diverges in itself you can see the links to previous languages thats how I know English is of indo-european growth. My point is your cannot see the the connection as you go back further in time. It is just as if many disparate unconnect languages appeared similtaneously at the same time.

  You say theories can be checked well for me so far the winning one is the bible simple explanation it was a God-given complex ability.

  3/ Many scientist point to some extraordinary event that caused a change either extra-terrestrial or otherwise as yet unknown that triggered everything. this simply lends itself to the creation of modern mythology to explain the unexplainable.