I'm from the U.K.
Someone said there are lots of Brits on here. No idea why that is.
Posts by Essan
-
7Essan and Chrisjoel; a warm welcome
by jookbeard ini don't know where you have come from or who you are but you boys are ass kickers of the highest level and guys like yourselves have not been seen on here for a long time,welcome and please stay!.
-
-
-
7
Essan and Chrisjoel; a warm welcome
by jookbeard ini don't know where you have come from or who you are but you boys are ass kickers of the highest level and guys like yourselves have not been seen on here for a long time,welcome and please stay!.
-
-
Essan
Aw thanks Jookbeard. That's very kind. It's nice to be appreciated.
And hey Quillsky, I know we weren't allowed Birthdays, or Easter, Christmas, but don't tell me we aren't allowed to make kindly threads either! LOL
-
18
Watchtower says: Jesus is a FALLEN ANGEL
by UnDisfellowshipped inthe watchtower society teaches that jesus is a fallen angel!.
back in the days of charles taze russell, the watchtower society correctly taught that abaddon/apollyon from revelation chapter 9 was satan or a demon (because the bible describes him as a fallen angel of the abyss who is in control of all of the demon/locusts):.
the finished mystery (1917):.
-
-
Essan
I remember reading the Revelation book. What a torrent of ever changing garbage. Even at the time as a JW I felt their interpretations were a bit mad, with almost everything, no matter how dramatically portrayed in Apocalyptic terms, being claimed to be about the relatively insignificant actions of the Bible Students around 1914-1919. Very silly.
And do the Society still teach that Jesus is this 'Angel of the Abyss', this "Destroyer', or have they flipped and flopped back to their original position?
-
270
WHO ARE THE FALSE PROPHETS TODAY?
by Dogpatch inwho are the false prophets today.
by barbara anderson.
in 1991, one of the watch tower societys senior writers, colin quackenbush, told me in the privacy of his office about letters which the society had received from prominent and credible elders, not apostates (thats exactly what he said), who were concerned about the increase in accusations saying that jehovahs witnesses were false prophets.
-
-
Essan
Thanks Miseryloveselders.
Yes, I'm aware that I may be banging my head against a brick wall with Consfearacy. However, I'm also aware that many JW's might read this later or are reading it right now but not posting, so I kinda feel a duty to try to thoroughly rebut arguments made on behalf of the Society when their guilt is clearly gross and undeniable. I suppose I hope that, even if it's of no use to Consfearacy, it may be of use to someone.
But anyway, I think C has given all his best defenses and we have dealt with them all. So this will probably fizzle out quite soon. There seem to be little left to say.
But you never know.... :)
-
270
WHO ARE THE FALSE PROPHETS TODAY?
by Dogpatch inwho are the false prophets today.
by barbara anderson.
in 1991, one of the watch tower societys senior writers, colin quackenbush, told me in the privacy of his office about letters which the society had received from prominent and credible elders, not apostates (thats exactly what he said), who were concerned about the increase in accusations saying that jehovahs witnesses were false prophets.
-
-
Essan
Consfearacy, Check you PM's. I addressed your point regarding your feeling that there is no reason for the a general Christian 'Apostasy' today. Your belief depends on the Watchtowers chronology, which, seeing as it has been so wrong on so many occasions in the past, why would you be so sure it is right now? Have you investigated 607 thoroughly yet? I'd advise it.
You said: In twenty years, I've never witnessed anyone leave the organization because they found out the early Bible students were mistaken about 1925.
Think clearly. We don't get to hear why people are announced as being "no longer one of JW's Witnesses", do we? So how do you know why people may have left the org? When someone DA's or is disfellowshipped for 'Apostasy' for seriously questioning the Society, the announcement and treatment is the same - shunning. So how would you ever know if anyone left due to the false prophesy of 1925? How do you know how many left after 1925 itself - you weren't there? Do the research. You'll find out. So your comment here is pretty meaningless.
Actually MANY people leave the JW's over their false prophesying. Ask around on the board. Of course, once people discover 1925, they tend to discover the other false predictions and lots of other errors that were hidden about the Society too.
Consfearacy, you last comment is absurd. You are deluding yourself in the extreme if you think for a moment that you have successfully defended the Society in anything. I'd be shocked if you could find a single other poster (other than the shameless liar, 'Debator') who feels your comments in any way negated any of the evidence presented here against the Society. Your apologetics on behalf of the WTBTS have been absolutely destroyed, repeatedly, by mountains of evidence from both the Scriptures and the Society's own literature. I already addressed and debunked the few duplicitous Watchtower quotes you gave - with their own words! You have no case. This is no reflection on you. You have set yourself the impossible tasks of defending the indefensible. And so, of course you failed spectacularly.
I sincerely hope that one day soon you join the ranks of the sane and unconditioned, and come down from the Ivory Watchtower, in Governing Body la-la-land, where black is white, up is down, failure is success, lies are truth, explicit statements are passed off as 'we didn't say', and where potentially rational people have sacrificed their power of reason at the altar of 'The Organization'.
I guarantee you, in a years time when the cloud fogging your thinking has dissipated, you will look back at this thread and say to yourself: "what was I thinking!"
And then you'll come across someone who is just like you are now, and then you'll know you really have your work cut out for you. :)
-
5
15. How do Jehovahs Witnesses suck the milk of nations,
by booby indouble whammy hypocrisy.
they can utilize certain available resources of "the nations" including computer related and i love how they use the "suck" word.. *** w00 1/1 p. 14 par.
15 "the little one" has become "a thousand" ***.
-
-
Essan
New Light! I know the JW fulfillment of the "sucking the milk of the nations" prophesy
You see, Jehovah has recently told the Governing Body that He's decided no more people have to die refusing blood fractions. So now they can take blood fractions if they want to live. Hooray! However, blood fractions are derived from stored blood and Jehovah has told the Governing Body that it's very, very bad to store blood. We must not store our blood! And we must not give blood!
However, we may - now - use fractions from OTHER PEOPLES stored blood. We can, "suck the milk of the nations", or like leeches or other parasites we can suck the blood fraction supply from stored worldly blood, but we must not CONTRIBUTE to it ourselves! We can take from them, but must not give back.
We can be helped but must not help others.
Thus we "suck the milk of the nations" and are blessed to be able to take, but not give. Praise God!
Soon, when they're dead, we can have their houses too!
PS. I'm so glad that - even if they don't contribute - JW's are now able to choose for themselves whether or not they take blood fractions as it means fewer of then have to die for the Governing Body. But of course, the whole blood refusal thing should be scrapped and JW's should contribute to a store from which they take.
-
34
Inappropriate - Sick - WT & Awake articles over the years.
by Essan ini remember as a kid reading an article - not sure if watchtower or awake - which terrified the life out of me!
i remember thinking at the time "ok, this may be true, but i'm just a kid, i shouldn't be reading this!".
some of the details remain imprinted on my mind decades later.
-
-
Essan
Ah, well it's good to know it wasn't just me being overly sensitive as a child!
Yes, I also remember all the graphic descriptions of torture etc. and the implication that this could happen to you too, in "The Tribulation", and the insistence that these victims were "examples for us to follow" and would we have the strength to face it when it comes.
Not at all suitable themes to imprint on impressionable and vulnerable young minds.
This Org was/is pretty sick.
Do you also remember being told how vitally important the book study group was, because when the "Tribulation" came and the Witnesses were being persecuted and so couldn't meet at the hall, they would have to meet at homes and if you weren't at every group, you might not know where the next secret meeting was to be held, and so lose touch with the brothers, and be vulnerable and alone!
Haven't they ditched the group study?
What, isn't it "vital" now? I suppose the Society feels a bit safer since having bent over for the 'Wild Beast' UN. Maybe it thinks the "Tribulation" won't be so bad now?
-
270
WHO ARE THE FALSE PROPHETS TODAY?
by Dogpatch inwho are the false prophets today.
by barbara anderson.
in 1991, one of the watch tower societys senior writers, colin quackenbush, told me in the privacy of his office about letters which the society had received from prominent and credible elders, not apostates (thats exactly what he said), who were concerned about the increase in accusations saying that jehovahs witnesses were false prophets.
-
-
Essan
Consfearacy,
I truly hope you take the time to read carefully all of the posts, quotes and links that were posted in reply to you over many pages here. People have spent an awful lot of time, research and energy in answering your points pretty thoroughly and you seem to breeze past 99% of them as if nothing was said. I personally suspect you don't really read what is written as I cannot imagine anyone with an ounce of reasonableness or love of God and truth reading what you have been shown and not being deeply, deeply concerned about the words and actions of their organization. Remember, we have all been exactly where you are now. There is nothing different between us except that we have experienced and eventually shrugged off the conditioning which still clouds your mind. It is frustrating in the extreme to deal with someone who defends the indefensible, ignores the obvious and is immune to facts and Scriptural truth. But that is what living as part of a cult will do to you. We know whereof we speak. Many here were deeply wounded and affected by their experience as JW's and so don't expect all of us to greet you with warmth when you defend unquestioningly a deeply destructive and abusive Organization in the face of overwhelming damning evidence. Don't mistake that hurt and frustration for 'malice'. One day, you'll realize, because you'll likely find yourself in our position. The truth can't be resisted forever, not if you continually allow yourself to be exposed to it.
You asked Mary "You obviously have no reservations about trashing the name of Jehovah's Witnesses. That could be a good thing if you can explain what religion teaches the Truth"
If I may answer you with my perspective - you are supposed to be a Christian. So you already know what the true Religion is: Christianity. The JW's have confused you by speaking of different religions when that wasn't indicated in the Bible. There is Christianity, which is a religion, and all Christian denominations are part of that, JW's included. They all together - including JW's - constitute 'Christendom'. Sorry to break it to you, but you are still part of 'Christendom'. The Apostasy set in during the 1st century and it is still going. No religion has 'come out'. Those dates for such events that the Society gave, like so many other of their dates, were wrong, presumptuous and premature. All these denominations are all deficient and in error in various ways, some more than others. JW's are just another Christian denomination, and not even a very good one, as you'll discover in time. They are like the congregations in Revelation, some weak some strong, all with their flaws, some catastrophically so.
So, which 'religion' will you go to? You're a Christian, so go to Christianity. Go to the Bible - free of men's interpretations. Go to Jesus. Go to others who do the same. Stop thinking in a fleshly way. Stop thinking about supposed "Organizations' and "Religions', neither of which are discussed in the Bible. Stop being a 'slave of men'. Think spiritually. If you do that, you might in time be guided as to which denomination or group you might associate with within the religion of 'Christianity', in order to best live as a free Christian. That would be my advice.
You ask "where should we go away to", but that's the wrong question. It's the physical question. The correct question is "Whom shall we go away to" and you already know the answer. You go away from lying, destructive, "visible organizations" and you go "away to" the one you believe "has sayings of everlasting life", and you wont find him in this or that Organizational "mountain", you'll find him "in spirit and truth". John 4:21-23.
-
34
Inappropriate - Sick - WT & Awake articles over the years.
by Essan ini remember as a kid reading an article - not sure if watchtower or awake - which terrified the life out of me!
i remember thinking at the time "ok, this may be true, but i'm just a kid, i shouldn't be reading this!".
some of the details remain imprinted on my mind decades later.
-
-
Essan
I remember as a kid reading an article - not sure if Watchtower or Awake - which terrified the life out of me! I remember thinking at the time "Ok, this may be true, but I'm just a kid, I shouldn't be reading this!"
Some of the details remain imprinted on my mind decades later. It described JW's in Africa, in Witch-doctor infested territory, and JW's supposed battles with 'demons'. On, as I recall, described them dealing with a 'possessed' girl, they said when they saw her, her face contorted and kind of transfigured into the face of a lion. The JW's went into another room to talk with the father, and they heard a scream from the room where the girl was, alone. They burst in and found her head twisted right round the wrong way, her neck broken, I presume, killed by the demons.
I read this as a child an had nightmares for months. Now, time may have distorted this memory of this a little, but I remember it was deeply gruesome and inappropriate for children. Does anyone else recall this article?
I recall another which graphically (I won't even repeat it here) described the injuries to a little girl who was raped by a boy not much older than her. In fact, I remember all sorts of hideous and traumatic things being written about in the Literature.
Now, it's bad enough the JW children are told they can be 'no part of the world' and can't do many of the things normal children do, that we were discouraged from a full education and career, and that we constantly feared death at Armageddon if we weren't "good enough", that we were made to fear the world and the coming persecution in "The Tribulation", and that we believed were going to see the slaughter of millions - but should we also have been terrorized by sick and graphic themes totally inappropriate for children in magazines and other literature that we were REQUIRED to read?
Do you recall any such articles which badly affected you?
-
270
WHO ARE THE FALSE PROPHETS TODAY?
by Dogpatch inwho are the false prophets today.
by barbara anderson.
in 1991, one of the watch tower societys senior writers, colin quackenbush, told me in the privacy of his office about letters which the society had received from prominent and credible elders, not apostates (thats exactly what he said), who were concerned about the increase in accusations saying that jehovahs witnesses were false prophets.
-
-
Essan
How about this Chris:
"Therefore we may confidently expect that 1925 will mark the return of Abraham, Isaac, Jacob and the faithful prophets of old, particularly those named by the Apostle in Hebrews 11, to the condition of human perfection," (Millions Now Living Will Never Die, p. 89 1918).
Or,
"Lo, our King is here, and the year 1925 marks the date when all shall see His mighty power demonstrated in the resurrection of the ancient worthies, and the time when 'millions now living will never die'." - The Golden Age, March 1, 1922, p. 350
And regarding their predictions for Armageddon, the Rapture and Resurrection in 1925:
"Our thought is, that 1925 is definitely settled by the Scriptures. As to Noah, the Christian now has much more upon which to base his faith than Noah had upon which to base his faith in a coming deluge," (Watchtower, Apr. 1, 1923, p. 106).
Now, bear in mind Noah was told DIRECTLY BY GOD that the flood was coming. But the Society claims that the JW's had "MUCH MORE" to base their faith in the events predicted BY THE SOCIETY for 1925 than someone who had been directly told by God! Thus they claimed greater infallibility in their predictions than God's own word!
Astounding. Truly staggering.
"We have no doubt whatever in regard to the chronology relating to the dates of .. 1925 .. What further evidence do we need? ...There can be no more question about 1925 than there was about 1914." - The Watchtower. May 15, 1922
"April 1st, 1925, at which time we may expect the resurrection of the Ancient Worthies" - Millions Now Living Will Never Die , 1925 p110.
April 1st - April fools day - how ironic. And what message does telling JW's "we may expect" and "we may confidently expect" send? "Go ahead! Feel free to CONFIDENTLY EXPECT Brothers!". Now compare this with their sudden twist and rebuke on those who actually listened to their words about what would happen in 1925 and "expected" as instructed , given in the same year:
"The year 1925 is here. With great expectation Christians have looked forward to this year. Many have confidently expecte d that all members of the body of Christ will be changed to heavenly glory during this year. This may be accomplished. It may not be. In his own due time God will accomplish his purposes concerning his people. Christians should not be so deeply concerned about what may transpire this year." - Watchtower 1925 January 1
Disgusting.
More 1925 quotes gathered by Undisfellowshipped here:
http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/jw/friends/37072/1/ARMAGEDDON-IN-1925-TIMELINE-OF-QUOTES