Posts by Essan

32

Most recent Society lies about 1914?

by Essan in

as i'm sure we all know, the society has lied repeatedly in the past about what they preached regarding 1914 in the run up to that year, claiming that what was preached was that jesus was to become king in that year and his presence was to begin then etc, when in fact they were preaching that all this had already happened in 1874 and that the end of the world would come in 1914.. .

but does anyone know if they have repeated this lie about what they supposedly preached recently?

when was the last time they claimed this?

Essan

Yes it was a lie. If you can't see that then you are a blithering moron, or as much of a liar as they are.

The Society claimed they were preaching Christ's Presence and Kingship as beginning in 1914 ahead of time - before 1914.

They were not. They didn't teach this until at least 1930. They were teaching - as fact - another date entirely for these events: 1874.

Hence, it's a lie. Get it? All your subsequent extensive wafflings don't change that nor will they be allowed to cloud the issue or distort the obvious fact that the Society LIED.

Sorry to be blunt, but I don't have much patience for defenders of lies and liars when the case is so thoroughly clear cut and beyond legitimate dispute.

32

Most recent Society lies about 1914?

by Essan in

as i'm sure we all know, the society has lied repeatedly in the past about what they preached regarding 1914 in the run up to that year, claiming that what was preached was that jesus was to become king in that year and his presence was to begin then etc, when in fact they were preaching that all this had already happened in 1874 and that the end of the world would come in 1914.. .

but does anyone know if they have repeated this lie about what they supposedly preached recently?

when was the last time they claimed this?

Essan

Hi :)

I have a further question for the really informed researchers among you.

I know- because I have read it very recently - that the Society has falsely claimed that the Bible Students proclaiming ahead of time that Jesus would become King and be Present from 1914 (which they didn't) was "remarkable evidence that Jehovah was using them".

Or at least, the wording was similar to that.

But try as I might I can't locate that quote or any like it where they specifically claim that heralding 1914 ahead of time (as the Parousia) was proof of their being Jehovah's people . I need that quote. It's an important claim, because it shows the motive for lying. I am putting some quotes together for a JW friend and this one or one like it would be really. really useful. Do any of you know of it or one like it? Help!

7

Best old books for exposing the 1874/1914 fraud?

by Essan in

i'm looking for a couple of the society's old books, one just prior to 1914 the other in the 1920's (as late as possible), which would show what the society was actually saying about 1914 in the run up to that year and that they were still promoting 1874 as the year of christ's presence for many years after 1914.. .

basically i'm looking for recommendations for two of their old books which would do the most damage to the modern jw claims about their past and show they could not have fulfilled prophesy or "qualified" for anything back then, as they claim.. .

there must be a couple of books which are really dynamite, choc full of nonsense and failed predictions.

Essan

Thanks so much for your help Bennyk. It's been invaluable.

It's great to have people like you around who have really done their research and are prepared to share it. These books may make all the difference to some JW friends of mine who appear to be willing to look at the evidence.

32

Most recent Society lies about 1914?

by Essan in

as i'm sure we all know, the society has lied repeatedly in the past about what they preached regarding 1914 in the run up to that year, claiming that what was preached was that jesus was to become king in that year and his presence was to begin then etc, when in fact they were preaching that all this had already happened in 1874 and that the end of the world would come in 1914.. .

but does anyone know if they have repeated this lie about what they supposedly preached recently?

when was the last time they claimed this?

Essan

Yep, thats a good one Doc Bob.

10

Books Missing From Libraries

by FrankWTower in

does anyone know if it's wt policy to exclude certain volumes of watchtower/awake magazines or other literature from the kingdom hall libraries?.

i was doing some research to confirm some of what i've seen online but many key publications are missing from the kh library.. other stuff i checked for was completely different from what's shown on scans and images from jwfacts.org and other sites..

Essan

Regarding differences between scans shown online and what is read in the publications in KH libraries - bear in mind that the Society has often rather slyly edited out anything embarrassing in subsequent editions and printing of various books. Rewriting history is a talent of theirs. So you have to check various earlier editions of the same book to find out what was actually said.

It's like when they said that the preaching work would be completed "in our 20th century" in the actual magazine, but by the time it hit the bound volume and later on the CD rom, they changed it to "In our day".

Sneaky.

7

Best old books for exposing the 1874/1914 fraud?

by Essan in

i'm looking for a couple of the society's old books, one just prior to 1914 the other in the 1920's (as late as possible), which would show what the society was actually saying about 1914 in the run up to that year and that they were still promoting 1874 as the year of christ's presence for many years after 1914.. .

basically i'm looking for recommendations for two of their old books which would do the most damage to the modern jw claims about their past and show they could not have fulfilled prophesy or "qualified" for anything back then, as they claim.. .

there must be a couple of books which are really dynamite, choc full of nonsense and failed predictions.

Essan

Thanks all for your suggestions. Very useful.

Bennyk, I have located a printing of The Time s At Hand which is a bit earlier than 1912 but I imagine it is still going to prove useful, even if it doesn't show the changes of some predictions to 1915. All of the 1912 printings I have found were very expensive, for some reason - a bit too much for me - but I found an earlier printing a bit cheaper. Or is the 1912 printing important? Does it make more explicit predictions than earlier printings? I wish there was somewhere I could see what the differences were between the various editions before I chose which one to buy. The Society has always been rather sly in it's editing.

I also wanted to ask you about 'The World' article you referred to from 1914 as I have never heard of this. Was this something the Society printed?

I have also taken your advice and bought a 1925 copy of the Harp of God and I made sure to get one with the wording you mentioned regarding "proof conclusive" And I'm trying to get a hold of a copy of Prophesy too.

Thanks again.

7

Best old books for exposing the 1874/1914 fraud?

by Essan in

i'm looking for a couple of the society's old books, one just prior to 1914 the other in the 1920's (as late as possible), which would show what the society was actually saying about 1914 in the run up to that year and that they were still promoting 1874 as the year of christ's presence for many years after 1914.. .

basically i'm looking for recommendations for two of their old books which would do the most damage to the modern jw claims about their past and show they could not have fulfilled prophesy or "qualified" for anything back then, as they claim.. .

there must be a couple of books which are really dynamite, choc full of nonsense and failed predictions.

Essan

Hi,

I'm looking for a couple of the Society's old books, one just prior to 1914 the other in the 1920's (as late as possible), which would show what the Society was actually saying about 1914 in the run up to that year and that they were still promoting 1874 as the year of Christ's presence for many years after 1914.

Basically I'm looking for recommendations for two of their old books which would do the most damage to the modern JW claims about their past and show they could not have fulfilled prophesy or "qualified" for anything back then, as they claim.

There must be a couple of books which are really dynamite, choc full of nonsense and failed predictions. I have limited cash so I can't go buying all the old books, but I have a feeling just a couple would do, if they were the right ones. And I'm aware that they changed what was said between editions, so which edition specifically is most useful?

Any ideas? What would you recommend?

Thanks.

Essan.

32

Most recent Society lies about 1914?

by Essan in

as i'm sure we all know, the society has lied repeatedly in the past about what they preached regarding 1914 in the run up to that year, claiming that what was preached was that jesus was to become king in that year and his presence was to begin then etc, when in fact they were preaching that all this had already happened in 1874 and that the end of the world would come in 1914.. .

but does anyone know if they have repeated this lie about what they supposedly preached recently?

when was the last time they claimed this?

Essan

Hi Interestedone,

Much easier than my posting lots of quotes here would be for you to take a look at a site like JWFacts.com and look at it's section of quotes regarding 1874 and 1914. There is also a collection of quotes at www.quotes-watchtower.co.uk.

Those two should provide more than enough evidence of the Society's modern lies about what they used to teach regarding 1914 and Jesus presence.

Essan.

32

Most recent Society lies about 1914?

by Essan in

as i'm sure we all know, the society has lied repeatedly in the past about what they preached regarding 1914 in the run up to that year, claiming that what was preached was that jesus was to become king in that year and his presence was to begin then etc, when in fact they were preaching that all this had already happened in 1874 and that the end of the world would come in 1914.. .

but does anyone know if they have repeated this lie about what they supposedly preached recently?

when was the last time they claimed this?

Essan

Hi Interestedone,

Yes I consider that a lie. The are being very deceptive in that statement. It's not one of the most blatant lies regarding this issue that they have printed, but it's a lie nonetheless.

You just need to tie together the linked satetments to see that it's a lie.

"The Kingdom had not come at thet time"..."There was a waiting period. For how long?"..."During the 19th century, sincere Bible students calculated that the waiting period would end in 1914."

Lie.

They calculated that Jesus became King in 1874 and that the effects of this event would be felt on earth increasingly from that time onward, until 1914.

"World events that began in 1914 confirm that the calculation of these sincere Bible students was correct."

Utter lie. Their calculation was that Jesus become King in 1874, and that Armageddon would be over by 1914.

They know what they're saying is not true.

32

Most recent Society lies about 1914?

by Essan in

as i'm sure we all know, the society has lied repeatedly in the past about what they preached regarding 1914 in the run up to that year, claiming that what was preached was that jesus was to become king in that year and his presence was to begin then etc, when in fact they were preaching that all this had already happened in 1874 and that the end of the world would come in 1914.. .

but does anyone know if they have repeated this lie about what they supposedly preached recently?

when was the last time they claimed this?

Essan

Hi Kurtbethel,

Do you mean you were having a Bible Study (unbaptized) and brought this info up during it? LOL. If so, I wish I'd been a fly on the wall. I'd love to hear that story :)

Yeah, the line you quoted also shows that they know they are being deceptive, because in that one they try to imply they predicted the events of 1914, but without actually flat out saying it. Other times to just lie outright.