factfinder

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Posts by factfinder

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  199

  Trinitarians! Who is Jesus Christ's father the Holy Spirit or the Father?

  by booker-t in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  this is one question that trinitarians try to avoid because they have created a very embarrassing problem.

  the bible is very clear when the angel tells mary that holy spirit will overshadow her and she will become pregnant.

  the angel does not say the father will overshadow her but the holy spirit will and if the holy spirit is a person that would make him the father of jesus.

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  factfinder

  I have Captain Action in the Thor uniform! He is not a trinity! lol!
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  199

  Trinitarians! Who is Jesus Christ's father the Holy Spirit or the Father?

  by booker-t in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  this is one question that trinitarians try to avoid because they have created a very embarrassing problem.

  the bible is very clear when the angel tells mary that holy spirit will overshadow her and she will become pregnant.

  the angel does not say the father will overshadow her but the holy spirit will and if the holy spirit is a person that would make him the father of jesus.

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  factfinder

  The Op was a good question but booker 2 has not commented. Has he even read these posts?
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  199

  Trinitarians! Who is Jesus Christ's father the Holy Spirit or the Father?

  by booker-t in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  this is one question that trinitarians try to avoid because they have created a very embarrassing problem.

  the bible is very clear when the angel tells mary that holy spirit will overshadow her and she will become pregnant.

  the angel does not say the father will overshadow her but the holy spirit will and if the holy spirit is a person that would make him the father of jesus.

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  factfinder

  jonza- I believe Jehovah is the one and only Almighty God, he has no equals.

  In the Hebrew Scriptures Moses was refered to as god as was Paul in the Christian Scriptures. This does not make them Jehovah, does it?

  Christians apply parts of the Hebrew scriptures to Jesus wheras the Hebrew scriptures never mention Jesus.

  Almighty God is above a mighty god yes, mighty is not Almighty!

  As Designs brought out, Judaism does not assign parts of the Hebrew scriptures to Jesus. Christians do.

  Chalam, yes I am familiar with that scripture-remember, witnesses use it! Jesus did not count equality with God a thing to be grasped, Jesus did not think he was equal to God nor did he think it proper for him to try to be equal with God. And this does not prove the trinity!

  As cofty brings out-the trinity doctrine is not taught in the Bible, Jesus' Jewish followers did not believe in a trinity, it was taken from pagan religions in the third century to try to unite Constantine's subjects and Constantine was a pagan.

  Worship of the trinity is not monotheism. This is why "Christianity" is not acceptible to people who believe in Judaism. The trinity is a pagan doctrine.
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  199

  Trinitarians! Who is Jesus Christ's father the Holy Spirit or the Father?

  by booker-t in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  this is one question that trinitarians try to avoid because they have created a very embarrassing problem.

  the bible is very clear when the angel tells mary that holy spirit will overshadow her and she will become pregnant.

  the angel does not say the father will overshadow her but the holy spirit will and if the holy spirit is a person that would make him the father of jesus.

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  factfinder

  Podbear is correct: Jesus remains SUBJECT to the Father. Jesus is not almighty god. Only Jehovah is.

  Jesus is not EQUAL to Jehovah, never was, never will be.

  Jehovah is the only almighty god.

  Interesting efforts on the part of those who believe in the trinity to explain it though! But it does not convince me.

  The view of my parents and relatives (and of witnesses)is the correct one: Only Jehovah is the one true Almighty God and he has no equals.

  Everyone is free to believe as they chose of course, but I cannot accept the trinity.

  But as I mentioned before, since learning the tatt this is all academic to me anyway -I"m not so sure God even exists and if he is as the bible describes him he is not worthy of our worship.

  And I no longer believe the bible is 100% true anymore either. As cofty brings out-people use different parts of the bible to support their view, and ignore other parts and vice versa.

  And I am not going to believe in something I do not understand. The Bible shows there is only ONE Almighty God- the god of my forefathers Jehovah. He is one, not 3 persons, not a commitee in essence of God; just ONE God who is almighty and is one person!
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  199

  Trinitarians! Who is Jesus Christ's father the Holy Spirit or the Father?

  by booker-t in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  this is one question that trinitarians try to avoid because they have created a very embarrassing problem.

  the bible is very clear when the angel tells mary that holy spirit will overshadow her and she will become pregnant.

  the angel does not say the father will overshadow her but the holy spirit will and if the holy spirit is a person that would make him the father of jesus.

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  factfinder

  The posts in support of the trinity are nonsensical.

  Jesus is 100% man & 100% God at the same time. The Jesus man part worships the father God part but they are one person and not two parts. The father does not worship the son, the son does worship the father. The father is not subject to the son but the son is subject to the father yet the son is 100% equal to the father as is holy spirit. But this is all one god and not 3 and not 3 parts of god.

  The trinity makes no sense at all.

  Hear o Israel, The Lord our God, the Lord is ONE makes sense. One God who is one person.

  I cannot make any sense of the explanations presented in support of the trinity.
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  17

  JW.ORG ABOUT TO WIN THE LOTTERY!

  by The Searcher in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  after the reading out of the letter about the "new donation arrangement" this week, there is going to be a flood of money pouring into the org's coffers!.

  not only from the bank accounts of the sheep, but soon after from the bulk of money in kingdom hall accounts worldwide!.

  question: has anyone calculated how much cash could be grabbed from the 113,823 congregations on earth?.

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  factfinder

  marked
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  199

  Trinitarians! Who is Jesus Christ's father the Holy Spirit or the Father?

  by booker-t in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  this is one question that trinitarians try to avoid because they have created a very embarrassing problem.

  the bible is very clear when the angel tells mary that holy spirit will overshadow her and she will become pregnant.

  the angel does not say the father will overshadow her but the holy spirit will and if the holy spirit is a person that would make him the father of jesus.

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  factfinder

  Chalem- Jews do not beleive the messiah is almighty God. God does not become a man nor does he die, nor can he die.

  The Jewish idea of messiah is not the same as the christian idea.

  My relatives have not accepted Jesus for this reason.

  Chalem, as Designs brings out-the Jewish veiw of the messiah is different from the christian view. Jews do not see any references to Jesus in the Bible, remember, the Christian scriptures are not a part of the Jewish Bible.

  Judaism does not teach original sin or that messiah will die for our sins.

  All of Jesus' early followers were Jews and none of them believed in a triune god.

  The wts does not understand either, the Jewish view of messiah, this is why their reasoning on how Jesus fits the prophecies did not interest relatives I used to try to witness to long ago.

  Jesus is NOT the Jewish messiah, he is the christan one.

  In Judaism, Jesus is unimportant, but Christendom makes him into a triune God, thus Jewish people have no interest in him.

  When I became a witness I learned to accept their view of Jesus as it fit the scriptures (as a witness I accepted the entire Bible.) I could never accept a triune god! But since learning the tatt it all became academic to me anyway.

  I'm kind of becoming agnostic now.

  But you cannot expect to use the Hebrew scriptures to try to "prove" the trinity. Jehovah is the one and only God, not Jesus, not holy spirit, not a trinity. There is no God before him and none after him, regardless of what christians later decided to teach, trying to merge the idea of one God and the pagan trinity together.

  It is important to understand the Jewish view of the messiah because all of Jesus' early followers (until 36 CE) were Jewish and that is what they believed. Not that Jesus is part of a trinity.
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  199

  Trinitarians! Who is Jesus Christ's father the Holy Spirit or the Father?

  by booker-t in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  this is one question that trinitarians try to avoid because they have created a very embarrassing problem.

  the bible is very clear when the angel tells mary that holy spirit will overshadow her and she will become pregnant.

  the angel does not say the father will overshadow her but the holy spirit will and if the holy spirit is a person that would make him the father of jesus.

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  factfinder

  Cofty- thank you for your excellent posts!

  The trinity is a nonsensical teaching that even believers in it cannot seem to understand or explain.

  Jewish people believe in ONE God who is Jehovah, ONE person, not 3. It is simple to understand.

  Those who want to worship Jesus have to go to great lengths to try to justify their worship of him as well as their claim of worshipping only one God.

  Jewish people do not accept the Christian Scriptures to be inspired of God.

  The jw teaching on Jesus made sense, he is God's SON, created at some time by God, not EQUAL to Jehovah. Since discovering the tatt I find Jesus to be academic.

  Jewish people cannot accept that Almighty God became a man or is part man. I cannot accept such a teaching.

  The trinity teaching is a confusing, unexplainable from a rational point of view later attempt to justify worshipping Jesus and accepting pagan ideas.

  Cofty-good questions! Who in the trinity worships who? God worships himself? Which person of God worships which other person(s) of god? It just makes no sense at all.
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  21

  New Scientist Article: God not-botherers: Religious apathy reigns

  by AndersonsInfo in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  http://www.newscientist.com/article/mg22229671.500-god-notbotherers-religious-apathy-reigns.html#.u2je8vco7mr.

  god not-botherers: religious apathy reigns.

  01 may 2014across the developed world, people are losing interest in god without becoming atheists.

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  factfinder

  marked
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  9

  How To Prove That The "Truth" Is Founded On Negativity And Hate

  by metatron in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  wanna prove to yourself that jws can't let go of negativity and hate?

  that it is at the core of their faith?

  ask the following question:.

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  factfinder

  darth frosty-

  you are right- God has intervened several times against humans ruling themselves, the tower of babel, the time of the flood when God let angels materialize, take wives, produce violent offspring, and the god blamed humankind and destroyed them in the flood; sending satan & his demons to the earth and letting Satan and his demons rule it.

  Also, God did not allow PERFECT humans to rule.

  And God put Satan in the Garden of Eden.

  If human's COULD solve all problems and make earth a paradise the gb would be against it. They have to be vindicated by everyone else being destroyed by God at armageddon.

  metatron- the gb and witnesses will only be happy if the destruction of all non witnesses comes. Very good op!