Posts by John

583

What is the purpose of life?

by slimboyfat in

while reading the magazines the other day it occurred to me that jws never really had a very good answer to that question.

because it was aimed at young people and it said something along the lines, "if you believe in god you have a purpose, but if you don't believe in god your life has no purpose or meaning".

i think that is a faulty analysis of the situation.

John_Mann

Bishop Barron is either stupid or dishonest.
He lyingly pretends god did not cause the tsunami he only permitted it.

He's just trying to find some answer. He knows the official position of the Church is the total mystery about the problem of natural evil.

Even though nothing he said in video is "fresh", I think he made a good job summarising the existent views about the problem.

The god of Jesus did not permit the suffering of the Asian Tsunami - he caused it. He murdered them wilfully, deliberately and with malice aforethought.

I cannot change your view about it. And I can't give you an ultimate solution rather than mystery.

But I can say causation and permission are two different things.

Considering the atheist scenario, how do you explain the problem of evil?

Do you agree only a conscious mind can conceive/perceive evil?

What is the evolutionary advantage in perceiving evil in nature?

I would like to know your answers to these questions in a purely atheist scenario.

583

What is the purpose of life?

by slimboyfat in

while reading the magazines the other day it occurred to me that jws never really had a very good answer to that question.

because it was aimed at young people and it said something along the lines, "if you believe in god you have a purpose, but if you don't believe in god your life has no purpose or meaning".

i think that is a faulty analysis of the situation.

John_Mann

Here's a commentary by Bishop Barron about the problem of evil (caused by natural disasters).

https://youtu.be/vx8ZMkWL8hw

583

What is the purpose of life?

by slimboyfat in

while reading the magazines the other day it occurred to me that jws never really had a very good answer to that question.

because it was aimed at young people and it said something along the lines, "if you believe in god you have a purpose, but if you don't believe in god your life has no purpose or meaning".

i think that is a faulty analysis of the situation.

John_Mann

John_Mann I just wanted to say thanks for the conversation.
I would like to pick it up again later.

Cofty, I can assure you that you're by far the best of your kind in this entire forum. You really have a powerful intellect.

Would be great if you joined our spiritual (or intellectual if you wish) militia and we could hail together our Heavenly Mother Mary.

Angels in Heavens would compose songs about your conversion.

The invitation is open until your last breath.

Think about it my friend. I'LL pray for your conversion.

https://youtu.be/WVzbNPm1U8s

583

What is the purpose of life?

by slimboyfat in

while reading the magazines the other day it occurred to me that jws never really had a very good answer to that question.

because it was aimed at young people and it said something along the lines, "if you believe in god you have a purpose, but if you don't believe in god your life has no purpose or meaning".

i think that is a faulty analysis of the situation.

John_Mann

You could argue all those points either way, but the point is that we can conceive of situations in human interactions where people with greater power (such as parents) impose real suffering on others for reasons they can't understand, but that with greater perspective is for the good.

This reminds me the story of the Taoist farmer:

This farmer had only one horse, and one day the horse ran away. The neighbors came to condole over his terrible loss. The farmer said, "What makes you think it is so terrible?"

A month later, the horse came home--this time bringing with her two beautiful wild horses. The neighbors became excited at the farmer's good fortune. Such lovely strong horses! The farmer said, "What makes you think this is good fortune?"

The farmer's son was thrown from one of the wild horses and broke his leg. All the neighbors were very distressed. Such bad luck! The farmer said, "What makes you think it is bad?"

A war came, and every able-bodied man was conscripted and sent into battle. Only the farmer's son, because he had a broken leg, remained. The neighbors congratulated the farmer. "What makes you think this is good?" said the farmer.

And so on...

583

What is the purpose of life?

by slimboyfat in

while reading the magazines the other day it occurred to me that jws never really had a very good answer to that question.

because it was aimed at young people and it said something along the lines, "if you believe in god you have a purpose, but if you don't believe in god your life has no purpose or meaning".

i think that is a faulty analysis of the situation.

John_Mann

"It just does", and "reality doesn't care"? Are these answers really all that different from, "it's a holy mystery"? They are the secular equivalent.

True.

If you don't accept mystery you cannot have it both ways.

583

What is the purpose of life?

by slimboyfat in

while reading the magazines the other day it occurred to me that jws never really had a very good answer to that question.

because it was aimed at young people and it said something along the lines, "if you believe in god you have a purpose, but if you don't believe in god your life has no purpose or meaning".

i think that is a faulty analysis of the situation.

John_Mann

Yes, with or without God the problem of evil persists.

And makes you wonder when you think billions of intentional minds try very hard to eliminate it.

So even if without God one must accept evil is an active reality not a passive one. And an active force needs energy. From where it comes from? And why?

Why our minds would evolve to perceive evil in first place?

583

What is the purpose of life?

by slimboyfat in

while reading the magazines the other day it occurred to me that jws never really had a very good answer to that question.

because it was aimed at young people and it said something along the lines, "if you believe in god you have a purpose, but if you don't believe in god your life has no purpose or meaning".

i think that is a faulty analysis of the situation.

John_Mann

If you wish to appeal I am open to hearing fresh evidence.....

I really think this problem of evil will remains a total mystery because it's known since Epicurus.

As I said this is your best argument and my hardest problem.

But your hardest problem is to say WHY there's something in universe instead of nothing.

If you're are not a nihilist you accept there's a why or is possible to exist a why. And our very minds need "whys". A nihilist by definition would not even care about a topic about "purpose".

I think theism vs atheism can be resumed to this two problems.

I enjoy to discuss with you. You're a very clever person.

583

What is the purpose of life?

by slimboyfat in

while reading the magazines the other day it occurred to me that jws never really had a very good answer to that question.

because it was aimed at young people and it said something along the lines, "if you believe in god you have a purpose, but if you don't believe in god your life has no purpose or meaning".

i think that is a faulty analysis of the situation.

John_Mann

The god of Jesus does not exist. Case closed.

Indeed everyone is a judge in this case. This case is very relevant to our internal sense of justice.

My sentence is total different from yours.

I know I can't know everything that's why I accept the existence of mystery.

All I know is we simply cannot be both right. I'm not a relativist and I think you're not one too.

Good luck.

583

What is the purpose of life?

by slimboyfat in

while reading the magazines the other day it occurred to me that jws never really had a very good answer to that question.

because it was aimed at young people and it said something along the lines, "if you believe in god you have a purpose, but if you don't believe in god your life has no purpose or meaning".

i think that is a faulty analysis of the situation.

John_Mann

The one thing I would add is that my argument is very specifically about "natural evil". In other words suffering that is not a result of human action but which occurs as a direct consequence of the way god designed the world.

This is the hardest problem in theology and the reason for that is a complete mystery. Even Saint Augustine declared total mystery about this problem.

Not just related to human suffering but related to non human animals too.

Indeed this is your best argument, cofty.

583

What is the purpose of life?

by slimboyfat in

while reading the magazines the other day it occurred to me that jws never really had a very good answer to that question.

because it was aimed at young people and it said something along the lines, "if you believe in god you have a purpose, but if you don't believe in god your life has no purpose or meaning".

i think that is a faulty analysis of the situation.

John_Mann

Not one single word you have just typed addresses my question about the hiddenness of god.

It's the best answer I know.

John_Mann

Posts by John_Mann