Posts by John_Mann

posted

496
This is What I Would Need in Order to Believe
by cofty in
1. watchtower
2. beliefs
sometimes theists challenge atheists about what evidence would be required before they would believe.

various unlikely scenarios are offered in reply.

i have taken the bait myself in the past.. i think the correct answer is much more ordinary.
John_Mann

Did you say you'd had a personal revelation of some sort? I think I must have missed your explanation of this buried in this thread.
Yes.
My acceptance of theism is based on the St. Anselm's ontological argument + the Pascal's wager + a private revelation to me.
When I left the Watchtower in 2005 (I was almost a born-in) I felt a great revolt and abandoned theism as I knew it. I became an atheist but I thought it was a very arrogant position. So I became an agnostic and a "self service" believer.
Three years ago I experienced a vision and it made me to think better about spiritual things.
For my great surprise I realized I knew nothing about Christianity.
496
This is What I Would Need in Order to Believe
by cofty in
1. watchtower
2. beliefs
sometimes theists challenge atheists about what evidence would be required before they would believe.

various unlikely scenarios are offered in reply.

i have taken the bait myself in the past.. i think the correct answer is much more ordinary.
John_Mann

@deegee - the soul only have free-will while limited in physical world. While in physical world the soul can change the will until the last breath.
In the spiritual world there's no free-will anymore.
The angels once had free-will too. But at this point anyone in the spiritual world has what's called instant discernment and their wills are fixed according to their last will before death.
There are unlimited chances here but there's no second chance after death.
496
This is What I Would Need in Order to Believe
by cofty in
1. watchtower
2. beliefs
sometimes theists challenge atheists about what evidence would be required before they would believe.

various unlikely scenarios are offered in reply.

i have taken the bait myself in the past.. i think the correct answer is much more ordinary.
John_Mann

Why do you worship a god who cares nothing for physical suffering?
I worship the God who cares for physical suffering.
496
This is What I Would Need in Order to Believe
by cofty in
1. watchtower
2. beliefs
sometimes theists challenge atheists about what evidence would be required before they would believe.

various unlikely scenarios are offered in reply.

i have taken the bait myself in the past.. i think the correct answer is much more ordinary.
John_Mann

Jesus claimed that his god cared passionately about the physical suffering of humans.
He cares in the sense of an afterlife reward.
This cannot be grasped to those who only believe in a physical life.
496
This is What I Would Need in Order to Believe
by cofty in
1. watchtower
2. beliefs
sometimes theists challenge atheists about what evidence would be required before they would believe.

various unlikely scenarios are offered in reply.

i have taken the bait myself in the past.. i think the correct answer is much more ordinary.
John_Mann

Everyone is a believer.
Believing in nihil or oblivion is absurd IMHO.
496
This is What I Would Need in Order to Believe
by cofty in
1. watchtower
2. beliefs
sometimes theists challenge atheists about what evidence would be required before they would believe.

various unlikely scenarios are offered in reply.

i have taken the bait myself in the past.. i think the correct answer is much more ordinary.
John_Mann

Those are concepts that wholly absent from the early christian writings, including the gospels.Your philosophical speculation is as good as anyone else's.

The Catholic faith it's not based only in early Christian writings.
And it doesn't meet the challenge anyway: Since you claim that god creates every soul at the moment of conception, then the destiny of each soul rests under his wing.

No. Every soul has free-will.
Including abandoning such soul to a supposed hell of nihlism.
It's a personal free choice. The first requirement is to accept the existence of God. This requires the same faith applied to the axioms of the scientific method. Is it that hard?
Again, why would a god of love and justice do that? After all, that soul didn't ask god to come to existence.
This is a ridiculous teenager whining. The human nature is designed to pursue perfection (you need to exist to do that). You need a great amount of will to fight against this default feature of human nature.
496
This is What I Would Need in Order to Believe
by cofty in
1. watchtower
2. beliefs
sometimes theists challenge atheists about what evidence would be required before they would believe.

various unlikely scenarios are offered in reply.

i have taken the bait myself in the past.. i think the correct answer is much more ordinary.
John_Mann

Why would a good of love and justice subject anyone to an eternity of punishment for wrongful deeds that were practiced during a few decades in the material life? Such god would lack basic decency.
There's only two options: God or nihil.
The highest level of your will, the center of your intentions, will be fixed at the time of your death. There's no free-will after death.
The Christian eternity is not an infinite amount of time but the absence of physical time.
The pursue of nihil is Hell.
496
This is What I Would Need in Order to Believe
by cofty in
1. watchtower
2. beliefs
sometimes theists challenge atheists about what evidence would be required before they would believe.

various unlikely scenarios are offered in reply.

i have taken the bait myself in the past.. i think the correct answer is much more ordinary.
John_Mann

According to christians these natural laws were designed by god.
Outside the physical universe in a metaphysical way.
Free-will has nothing to do with it.
Free-will needs natural laws.
If you affirm that god acts in the world you have no way out of this dilemma. If you don't affirm that god acts in the world then you are not a christian.
God acts in the world continually in a metaphysical way. Every soul is created by him at conception. Sometimes there's a special act against natural laws that's called a miracle. But a miracle primarily has the purpose of something about salvation of souls.
Why God does nothing about natural evil? Actually he already did.
There's a Buddhist saying that if you want all the ways padded you just need to pad your feet.
God has padded us with immortality. Your consciousness, the higher levels of your intellect and will are not destroyed by a tsunami.
A tsunami can only give you some few minutes of pain and agony but can't damage your immortal soul. But your soul can be subject to an eternal dreadful state.
496
This is What I Would Need in Order to Believe
by cofty in
1. watchtower
2. beliefs
sometimes theists challenge atheists about what evidence would be required before they would believe.

various unlikely scenarios are offered in reply.

i have taken the bait myself in the past.. i think the correct answer is much more ordinary.
John_Mann

Designing a world with all the benefits of plate tectonics but without the earthquakes would be child's-play.
Are you saying this physical universe is ruled or guided by direct intelligent design?
I think the physical universe is ruled by impersonal natural laws. Only these natural laws were designed metaphysically outside the physical universe.
And these natural laws probably are necessary for the best world to harbor free-willed agents.
496
This is What I Would Need in Order to Believe
by cofty in
1. watchtower
2. beliefs
sometimes theists challenge atheists about what evidence would be required before they would believe.

various unlikely scenarios are offered in reply.

i have taken the bait myself in the past.. i think the correct answer is much more ordinary.
John_Mann

Any intelligent deity could design a world without tsunamis.
How do you know that???