Posts by Joepublisher1

41

JW Apologists Keep Commenting

by RayPublisher in

i just posted a new article entitled "jw apologists keep commenting".

there seems to be an influx of asleep jws that are trying to fight back against what they perceive to be threats to their faith by trying to refute our websites and forums.. several are currently making the rounds voting down webpage comments and youtube videos, as well as the dissident jw blogosphere.. here's a screengrab from the article:.

here's the youtube video i made to accompany it:.

Joepublisher1

btw: I've yet to have a JW PROMISE me that the generation teaching will NEVER change again. (For someone who is studying the Bible with JWs, they can ask, "Since JWs feel they have the truth, can they promise me that the things they are teaching today will NEVER change in the future?"

41

JW Apologists Keep Commenting

by RayPublisher in

i just posted a new article entitled "jw apologists keep commenting".

there seems to be an influx of asleep jws that are trying to fight back against what they perceive to be threats to their faith by trying to refute our websites and forums.. several are currently making the rounds voting down webpage comments and youtube videos, as well as the dissident jw blogosphere.. here's a screengrab from the article:.

here's the youtube video i made to accompany it:.

Joepublisher1

When I'm reasoning with JWs, I try to show them why they can NEVER say that they have the truth and then I prove it by posing a question: "That's why you - or the WTS - can't PROMISE me that the generation teaching will NEVER change again - can? you?" This question is designed to reveal a very harsh reality. All doctrines are subject to change [in a NY minute mind you] and then change again. So, knowing this, the thinking JW starts to realize and rationalize, "You know, we can never really say we have the truth, because the teachings of JWs have changed so much and continue to change, which can only mean that it's inappropriate to go to people's doors and insist that 'we have the truth'". It's simply being irresponsible to insist on saying this. The New Light doctrine really shoots the WTS in the foot because the very nature of this doctrine proves that they can never say that we [JWs] have "the truth"! Now, if the WTS wants to go around and insist [in their opionion of course] that they only have 90% of the truth, that's an option they could employ. Of course, they would never say that because it sounds quite odd, doesn't it?

41

JW Apologists Keep Commenting

by RayPublisher in

i just posted a new article entitled "jw apologists keep commenting".

there seems to be an influx of asleep jws that are trying to fight back against what they perceive to be threats to their faith by trying to refute our websites and forums.. several are currently making the rounds voting down webpage comments and youtube videos, as well as the dissident jw blogosphere.. here's a screengrab from the article:.

here's the youtube video i made to accompany it:.

Joepublisher1

I, too, believe that anyone who stays a JW deserves "respect" at some level [for their very personnel choice] - it doesn't mean you have to agree with them. You have to remember that the very nature of this religion - being a cult - causes STRONG attachments. Many on this board have a common thread when it comes to leaving JWs. For many, they didn't leave overnight. It took months and in many cases YEARS to dis-engage with this religion that at one time they would have DIED for! So, I take it that any JW who is visiting this forum has already taken a step to consider a different "view". None of us should feel that as soon as someone joins this board, they are under obligation to QUIT their religion... remember, many are stuck in because of the SHUNNING policy or because they still don't have a clear view of these negative things they are now learning about their beloved religion.

Also, I for one enjoy it when JW Apologists respond to YouTube videos. I like to demonstrate to them how they use Logical Fallacies to support the WTS views. When it becomes clear to me that they don't understand what a logical fallacyis, I encourage them to study the meaning [and use of] "Logical Fallacies". They soon realise that Logical Fallacies are used by many people and organizations [not just JWs] and soon they begin to realise that the use of Logical Fallacies to support arguments and views is "flawed" and not the way to logically prove any point - religious or otherwise!

So, to JW Apologists, I say keep your comments coming. (I know for me, I have yet to see a JW apologists prove his argument without using Logical Fallacies. Therefore, it cements to me the point that the WTS is not who they say they are!)

My advice to everyone is, be kind to everyone. I know that it's easy to anonymously make negative or disparaging remarks on the internet, but that lowers the discussion level to something that many find unappealing and coldly judgemental. I know for me, when a JW has resorted to name calling in the past, I used to respond in like - but I've been trying to learn to stay on topic and don't resort to name-calling and other forms of attacks.

66

Still Waiting For the Governing Body To Explain Their New Light

by Cameron_Don in

jw
friends

regarding the governing bodys new light relative to matthew 24:45-47, anointedjw.org recently said the following:.

this new light certainly poses a problem for the governing body.

perhaps this is another reason why they have not yet published a sober and scriptural xplanation of this new light.

Joepublisher1

I am one of the ones that is very suspicious of the method chosen to announce this new light! To me, it does indeed feel like the GB wanted to release this new light into the community [slowly and not in a printed Watchtower] so that they could wait to see if there was a back-lash amoungst the rank and file. Of course, as so many have commented, most JWs aren't even aware of this new light. For those that are aware, they feel there's no issue with this change because it "makes sense" to them, as the GB has "acted" like the F&DS for decades. However, the devil is in the details and the GB has gotten themselves into a situation where the change brings MANY questions to the surface (esp. for those JWs who are old-timers or students of "JW history")! Also, Don Cameron has indeed published a book that is well worth reading/studying [Captives of a Concept], as he gets to the crux of critical questions that MOST [if not all] JWs NEVER considered in detail!

80

The "Pop-In"

by Mr. Falcon in

so last night the wife is working, the kids are getting ready for bed and i'm watching futurama.

doorbell rings.

now it's dark, snowing and i live on a back road, so it's very odd to have a visitor.

Joepublisher1

My obervation has been that some people in this religion love to TAKE ADVANTAGE of their fellow brothers and sisters - esp. the meek ones who tend not to speak up. You know the type of bro. and sis. I'm talking about; they're BOLD - many times they are pios because of this BOLDNESS. I actually got a call from someone from my old hall in another state. They called to TELL ME when they would be stopping by [with their friend] during their vacation. I never invited this person and really didn't know them all that well to begin with. I thought to myself, 'boy, how bold is that!... to call someone in another state to let them know that they'll be staying over your place on certain dates'. I'm really not sure what drives this behavior of some bros. and sisters., but I always considered it extremely rude! Needless to say, I didn't agree to this boldness, considering it to be rude and presumptous behaivor.

25

Do JWs Really Still care about the "Truth"?

by XBEHERE in

jw
friends

i often read posts on here citing some km school or wt article and the comment that "now they are tightening their grip" or "they will now go after faders" etc, etc.

my perception is that the vast majority of jws, including the elders, are suffering from apathy and fatigue.

most simply don't care anymore.

Joepublisher1

So many good posts! I am always struck by how many times the 1995 generation change gets posted as a change [in doctrine] that had significant impact on JWs around then. I see so how many times posted use the expression pre-1995 generation and post 1995 generation changes. There is no doubt that that change in WTS teaching GREATLY affected many people - including me! It was the start to opening my eyes, although it took years to fully see the "truth" about "the [so-called] Truth". The pedophile issue - including the Dateline airing - was what really started me to open my mind and eyes. All of this - the 1995 generation change, the pedophilia mis-handling/coverup/etc. - ran parallel with the birth of the Internet. And, of course, it's the internet that allowed JWs world-wide to learn TTATT! So many who are left in this religion use it as a social club - many even act one way at the meetings, but sound like ordinary worldlings outside the perimeter of the meetings/service/etc. (And some JWs act even worse then the average worldling!) It's not looking good for the religion of the WTS. The Governing Body change seems to have gone completely over the head of most JWs! (btw: I couldn't believe the initial post where the wife didn't even know that the 144,000 used to be called the F&DS! How NEW a JW is she? Or, was/is she one of those born-ins who never learned the tenets of their own religion - boy, there are a bunch of those around!!! I know many of you have commented about the ignorance of born-ins!)

64

A great picture for proving that JWs aren't weird and cultish...

by cedars in

it's a shame this is only in the study edition, so the general public can't see how normal and down-to-earth the witnesses are in how they perceive themselves.... .

.

cedars.

Joepublisher1

This illustration [posted by Cedars] reminds me of that urban-myth that has been widely circulated amongst JWs and is a favorite to use for new converts who are thinking about going door-to-door. You know the one where a murderer was asked by the police why he didn't harm a sister who was preaching at his door and he responded that he saw two large men on both sides of her [when in fact she was out preaching alone] - variations may exist, but you get the point.

This story still circulates amongst gullible JWs today!!! Personally, I think it's totally irresponsible to perpetuate this fabricated story. I also feel that the WTS leaders should have quashed the telling of this story as one that cannot be validated and thus in all reasonableness should NOT continue to be told as fact. (I remember one Circuit Assembly [in the 80’s] where the attendees where told not to be so gullible concerning the story of the Smurf coming alive during a meeting, yelling something out, [etc.]. However, I’ve never heard from the platform (or in any WTS literature) that the story about the angels was unfounded and shouldn’t be retold as fact. I think that’s because the WTS leaders either believe it MAY be true [and don't want to offend Jehovah] or they want the rank and file to believe its true – or both. I mean, look at the illustration that CEDARS posted!)

37

Milan Italy Public Demonstration against ostracism practiced by the Watchtower.

by Nick! in

jw
friends

milan italy public demonstration against ostracism practiced by the watchtower.. .

two years after rome, yesterday december 1st, day by day, we were about 100 of us demonstrating on a public square in the center of milan, italy.. .

at about 10-11 a.m. many of us were already on the spot, installing our gazebo on the public square where we were granted authorization by the police and starting the distribution of about 4000 tracts to passersby in the surrounding squares, boulevards and streets exposing the watchtower for its teachings and instructions on discriminating those who decide to use their rights to walk away from this religious movement without to have to incur the ostracism imposed by the leadership.

Joepublisher1

There's so many good points here. I like the one where the poster said that her mother insisted the blame for the "shunning" was on her for leaving the religion [and not returning]! How twisted is that? But, that's how the WTS has their rank and file thinking. Look, it's simple. At one time, you could walk away from this religion and not be viewed as an apostate. And, that's reasonable.

However, in the early 80's - when the great apostasy hit Brooklyn - it became apparent to the Governing Body that they can't allow the rank and file to ask too many questions of those who decided to leave the religion. And, that's when they came up with the teaching that if someone leaves, they should be treated as an apostate. Talk about mind-control!

However, the Governing Body was really caught off-guard when the internet came into vogue because many ex-JWs created web-sites (FREEMINDS, JWFACTS, SIXSCREENSOFTHEWATCHTOWER, etc.) that would allow any JW to research why so many one-time loyal and faithful JWs - many who held responsible positions for decades - to decide for themselves whether this previously guarded information would sway their JW religious convictions. (I might add, the fact that so many JWs leave after learning the Truth about the Truth, shows why the Governing Body did not want its members reading this stuff. I find that the web-site JWFACTS to be indisputable - and I love how the owner Paul Grundy humbly/sincerely asks that anybody who notices errors on his site to simply contact him and he'll correct it.)

3

Watchtower Study Articles - God is the WTS?

by Joepublisher1 in

it's clear to me now - more than ever - that the wording in the watchtower is full of mind-manipulation.

one that is glaring is how the wording always suggests that following the wts [watchtower society] is synonymous with listening to god/jehovah.

so, if you pursue an education, you must be saying in your mind, i want to prepare for the future, just in case jehovah doesnt bring the end in my lifetime.

Joepublisher1

It's clear to me now - more than ever - that the wording in the Watchtower is full of mind-manipulation. One that is glaring is how the wording always suggests that following the WTS [WatchTower Society] is synonymous with “listening to God/Jehovah”. So, if you pursue an education, you must be saying in your mind, ‘I want to prepare for the future, just in case Jehovah doesn’t bring the end in my lifetime’. It’s nothing but a ploy to cause the members to feel guilty for pursuing a higher education and a better life. (Remember, in the Bible, Jehovah God says nothing about forbidding a person to pursue a higher education... this is totally a WTS directive, one that GOES BEYOND THE SCRIPTURES!)

In addition to this, the WTS view on higher education lays the foundation for others in the congregation to pass a negative judgment on those members who pursue a course of higher education – btw: these are the same ones who will argue with opposers that their religion doesn’t forbid people from going to college while the WTS ALWAYS suggests that anyone who goes to college lacks faith [in the nearnesss of the end AND in God's promises] and isn't setting a good example in the congregation. The WTS leaders are nothing but a bunch of mind-manipulating bullies! JWs, you need to wake up! Read your Watchtowers carefully and see how the writers interchangeably switch out the WTS leaders (aka the Governing Body) with “Jehovah God”! (The WTS leaders ARE NOT GOD and God is not responsible for all of their mistakes and changes, as well as their man-made interpretations that GO BEYOND THE SCRIPTURES!)

43

I grew up not fearing old age

by Sour Grapes in

as a teenage jw, i grew up believing that i was not going to finish high school nor would i get old and have to die like my grandparents did.

well, i did finish high school, as did my children and my grandchildren and old age has not been kind to me.

i don't like to look at pictures from 40 years ago, from a time when i was healthy and i had the goal of "stay alive till 75.

Joepublisher1

WASBLIND:

Those are two interesting quotes to put side-by-side, one found in the Bible and uttered by Satan, the other uttered by the WTS leaders. The difference is that Eve never knew any human family member who had died - the sense of loss, the mourning, etc. The WTS apparently knew that many people would love to entertain the thought of NEVER dieing - or seeing a loved one die! I know it was a welcomed concept for me, even in my young 20s! I used to think, if these teachings of JWs are true, why wouldn't anyone accept them? Well, apparently most people were quite aware of the expression, "If it sounds too good to be true, it probably isn't!" and would never get invovled with such a crazy religion. It just seems that the WTS knew that this teaching - never dieing - would entice some people and would result in an increase their ranks and the monetary contributions that that increase brings. Of course, the constant moving of the goal posts as to when this would happen eventually helped many long-time and once faithful JWs to realize that something was very wrong with their leaders AND the internet then provided the means for any JW to learn TTATT!